Boston Racial Stigma- is it "cool" to hate on Boston? (Lowell: prices, to move)

[Space_League]

Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade

Guessing you dont watch SNL?

But yea, when I go places and tell people im from Boston its usually bashed on in very short order. This has nothing to do with "inflated egos" and everything to do with real lived experience. You being from Chicago (and white) arent gonna share that experience.

Boston and New England definitely has an inflated ego in general. People from there act and truly believe it to be a top 5 metro (it's #11 in population size). I've met people who seriously think Boston is a peer of Chicago when it just isn't. People look down on places like Dallas and Houston which are both larger than Boston with bigger economies. The only city I can think of with a more outsized ego is SF.

I think you are right though about race being important to outsider perceptions. White southerners I've met either have no opinion about Boston or a fairly positive one. Black southerners I've met will either have no opinion or a fairly negative one. I've met people where the first thing they said after finding out I'm from Boston is that they heard it's racist.

[masssachoicetts]

Originally Posted by Enean

Is it "cool" to hate on Boston? That presumes everyone thinks about Boston, probably a lot more often than they do. Boston never enters my mind, unless there's something on the news that brings it up, or its a sports thing. People don't, typically, sit around thinking about other cities, unless they're on a forum discussing it. I have friends who have a son and his family who live in Boston, and we discuss them, but not Boston.

An example...do you and your friends sit around and talk about and think about other cities in the US on a regular basis? Do you think it's cool to bash a city that you have no connection with, or (kind of) no interest in?

A lot of people with misconceptions and inflated egos. Just because you choose to live in a city, and think it's all that, doesn't mean a thing to the rest of us. Why would we "hate" on your city, when we have no connection to it?? I will say, though, that incessant bragging does drag a city down, in the eyes of others...just opposite of what the intent was.

Well again, you constantly talk about how someone is boosting Toronto when they mention it. I dont think your one to ask about 'bragging' since literally anytime any city is brought up, you associate that with boosting.

Also cannot relate, since all my friends and I do are talk about cities since we are all Urban Plannig PHD students.. lots of fun arguments.

[Boston Shudra]

Originally Posted by Space_League

Boston and New England definitely has an inflated ego in general. People from there act and truly believe it to be a top 5 metro (it's #11 in population size).

Only if you ignore half the suburbs, which happen to be closer to Worcester or Providence.

Though if you want to argue that Rochester, NH (in the MSA) is more a part of the Boston metro than Mansfield, MA (not in the MSA) then be my guest.

[masssachoicetts]

Originally Posted by Space_League

Boston and New England definitely has an inflated ego in general. People from there act and truly believe it to be a top 5 metro (it's #11 in population size). I've met people who seriously think Boston is a peer of Chicago when it just isn't. People look down on places like Dallas and Houston which are both larger than Boston with bigger economies. The only city I can think of with a more outsized ego is SF.

I think you are right though about race being important to outsider perceptions. White southerners I've met either have no opinion about Boston or a fairly positive one. Black southerners I've met will either have no opinion or a fairly negative one. I've met people where the first thing they said after finding out I'm from Boston is that they heard it's racist.

I would look more at how Global a city actually is over population size. Although I do agree both Bos and SF along wth NY, DC and LA have inflated egos. But agan, isnt that every major city?

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by Space_League

Boston and New England definitely has an inflated ego in general. People from there act and truly believe it to be a top 5 metro (it's #11 in population size). I've met people who seriously think Boston is a peer of Chicago when it just isn't. People look down on places like Dallas and Houston which are both larger than Boston with bigger economies. The only city I can think of with a more outsized ego is SF.

I think you are right though about race being important to outsider perceptions. White southerners I've met either have no opinion about Boston or a fairly positive one. Black southerners I've met will either have no opinion or a fairly negative one. I've met people where the first thing they said after finding out I'm from Boston is that they heard it's racist.

This has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Just for the record...

To draw such a conclusion is beyond me..

The last 2-3 sentences is on topic though.

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by Enean

I don't watch it anymore...used to, though.

Well they were on the "Boston is racist" train, again last week. This would be they're 2nd or third skit on that topic this past year. One of them might have been on comedy central?? The how racist is Boston skit?

Our first black (acting) mayor has warranted history lessons on and archival footage on racism in Boston and interviews on Rachael Maddow, CNN, Al Roker, Good Morning America and more... All within a week,

So yea-its on a lot of people's minds...

[Space_League]

Originally Posted by Boston Shudra

Only if you ignore half the suburbs, which happen to be closer to Worcester or Providence.

Though if you want to argue that Rochester, NH (in the MSA) is more a part of the Boston metro than Mansfield, MA (not in the MSA) then be my guest.

I agree that the MSA boundaries are flawed because they do it by county. If you took out Stafford and Rockingham and subbed in Bristol, that would change the demographics and density numbers but I don't think it would really change the population or GDP size by much.

I feel bad for still bringing BBMM thread off topic though we can pm if you want to talk about boundaries ought to be drawn or where Boston ranks overall for cities

[jcp123]

Originally Posted by Boston Shudra

Yeah. My older, conservative coworkers like to bash San Francisco whenever the opportunity arises. Granted most have likely never visited and have lived their whole lives between MA and NH.



What’s your age and race? I think the stigma is mostly amongst young and non-white people. So, if you’re a 50-something Italian guy...

Mid-30s mutt of mostly European descent. For me, it comes down more to something of a west coast superiority complex than anything else.

[Boston Shudra]

Originally Posted by MassNative2891

North Shore just isn't very diverse and in my experience the people are definitely not accustomed to seeing Black folks and they show it.

Edit:

Also noting North of Boston has A LOT of Dominicans. Lawrence, Lynn, Methuen. Lowell has A LOT of Cambodians. Just not a lot of Black folks.

I think the big thing that differentiates the North from the South is relative amounts of gatekeeping in the suburbs. Like Brockton is absolutely the blackest city in the metro area at 60% black, but nearby suburbs like Stoughton, Avon, Randolph, and Holbrook are all also >15% black.

On the North Shore, Salem, Lynn, Lawrence, and Haverhill are all pretty Latino. However, the only suburb of the northern cities that's >15% Latino is Methuen. Lowell has a lot of Cambodians, but the only Lowell suburb that has a lot of Cambodians is Dracut, which is only 4% Asian in total! More data below:


Lowell: 111,306 people, 15,591 Cambodians, 57% of all Asians
Billerica: 43,200 people, 96 Cambodians, 2.6% of all Asians
Chelmsford: 35,126 people, 524 Cambodians, 14% of all Asians
Dracut: 31,373 people, 622 Cambodians, 41% of all Asians
Tewksbury: 31,098 people, 195 Cambodians, 14% of all Asians
Tyngsborough: 12,364 people, 202 Cambodians, 13% of all Asians
Westford: 24,342 people, 161 Cambodians, 3.1% of all Asians
(source)

Lawrence: 79,942 people, 40,618 Dominicans, 63% of all Latinos
Andover: 35,816 people, 375 Dominicans, 21% of all Latinos
Methuen: 50,282 people, 8,398 Dominicans, 57% of all Latinos
North Andover: 30,842 people, 828 Dominicans, 36% of all Latinos
(source1)
(source2 the link in source1 kept giving me every town except Andover )

Lynn: 93,743 people, 15,049 Dominicans, 38% of all Latinos
~~~Guatemalans are another 24%
~~~And Salvadoreans are 13%
& Salem: 43,252 people, 4,660 Dominicans, 60% of all Latinos
Beverly: 41,885 people, 689 Dominicans, 32% of all Latinos
Danvers: 27,586 people, 348 Dominicans, 25% of all Latinos
Lynnfield: 12,894 people, 82 Dominicans, 26% of all Latinos
Marblehead: 20,500 people, 393 Dominicans, 39% of all Latinos
Peabody: 52,906 people, 2,228 Dominicans, 43% of all Latinos
Saugus: 28,215 people, 155 Dominicans, 6.4% of all Latinos
Swampscottt: 15,002 people, 148 Dominicans, 39% of all Latinos
(source)

Haverhill: 63,533 people, 6,275 Puerto Ricans, 43% of all Latinos
Boxford: 8,282 people, 0 Puerto Ricans, 0% of all Latinos
~~~113 are Dominicans, which is 58% of all Latinos in Boxford
Groveland: 6,780 people, 13 Dominicans, 0.6% of all Latinos
~~~75 Bolivians and 68 Mexicans make up the bulk of Groveland's Latin pop.
Merrimac: 6,890 people, 75 Puerto Ricans, 45% of all Latinos
West Newbury: 4,631 people, 11 Puerto Ricans, 0.9% of all Latinos
~~~35 Ecuadorians and 76 Spaniards make up the rest of W. Newbury's Latin pop.
Plaistow: 7,689 people, 0 Puerto Ricans, 0% of all Latinos
~~~49 of Plaistow's Latinos are Dominican, 96 are Chilean, 33 are Colombians, 56 are Spaniards.
(source)

Brockton: 43,582 Black people, 46% of the city
~18,972 born in MA | 4,041 born elsewhere in the US | 20,569 born outside the US
Easton: 1,046 Black people, 4.2% of the town
~647 born in MA | 71 born elsewhere in the US | 328 born outside the US
Avon: 820 Black people, 18% of the town
~511 born in MA | 145 born elsewhere in the US | 164 born outside the US
Holbrook: 1,855 Black people, 17% of the town
~918 born in MA | 146 born elsewhere in the US | 791 born outside the US
Stoughton: 4,294 Black people, 15% of the town
~1,933 born in MA | 557 born elsewhere in the US | 1,804 born outside the US
Abington: 331 Black people, 2% of the town
~125 born in MA | 84 born elsewhere in the US | 122 born outside the US
East Bridgewater: 559 Black people, 3.9% of the town
~325 born in MA | 43 born elsewhere in the US | 191 born outside the US
West Bridgewater: 128 Black people, 1.8% of the town
~103 born in MA | 15 born elsewhere in the US | 10 born outside the US
Whitman: 288 Black people, 1.9% of the town
~114 born in MA | 48 born elsewhere in the US | 126 born outside the US
(source)
^Can't find a census table that breaks Black residents down by ethnicity. If anyone can find one, please send me the link.

[P Larsen]

FWIW, Boston's Combined Statistical Area is 6th at roughly 8.3 million people.