Mark 16:15-16 DID JESUS SAY IT? (evolve, prayers, Holy Ghost, verse)

[GREATDIVIDE46]

I know I'm not katiemygirl, but I'd like to give my comments, too. I may just repeat what KMG already said or I may have a different take on something.

Originally Posted by kids in america_

And he stopped “baptizing” people. Right?

No, I don't think so.

What about the so-called great commission found in Mark 16? Mark 16:16 clearly has Jesus commanding his disciples to “baptize”. Was not Paul under the great commission as well?

Yes, he was.

Here's another question that needs to be asked: If Paul was not sent to baptize, why did He baptize?

Because it's part of the gospel message. Someone has to baptize people, but when people start saying that they're better Christians because Paul baptized them, you can see why he might be reluctant to baptize people himself. Paul says nothing here about whether or not baptism is necessary for salvation.

Fair enough. So you do recognize the split Paul puts between “baptism” and “the gospel”?

I don't believe Paul is putting a split between baptism and the gospel. What he's trying to do is convince the Corinthians that they should not form cliques based on who baptized them.

The only thing I can say is to reiterate what I've said before: you are conditioned to read into Romans 6, Galatians 3, and Colossians 2 as reference to baptism by water.

Actually, in my case it was the other way around. I was conditioned to read water out of every reference to baptism that you've cited here. It wasn't until I quit listening to my teachers and began studying the word for myself that I understood that every unmodified reference to baptism always means baptism in water.

Katimy girl when the “bible” refers to "water baptism" the context always makes this clear. However if you see the word “baptism” or “baptize” alone, we need to use extreme care and caution in studying and recognizing what kind of “baptism” is being refer to in the passage.

I would disagree. When the Bible refers to a baptism other than water baptism the context always makes it clear. If it is not clear in the context what kind of baptism is being referred to in a passage, then we must assume that baptism in water is meant because that's the meaning of the Greek word baptizo.

Cornelius, the Roman centurion, received the “Holy Spirit” before he was commanded to be baptized in water. How do you explain?

It's interesting that "faith only" people think that Cornelius was saved when he spoke in tongues and not when he had faith. Cornelius believed even before Peter and his companions arrived. I don't know why some think Cornelius was not saved by his faith, but was saved by speaking in tongues. Because I don't believe we are saved by faith only but by God only, I tend to think that Cornelius and his household were not regenerated until the Holy Spirit actually indwelled them at their baptism in water.

[kids in america_]

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

The scripture does not say Paul stopped baptizing.

You are correct that the scripture does not say explicitly that Paul stopped baptizing.

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

It doesn't say he continued either.

All right… I concur.

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

Division was a specific problem addressed to a specific group of christians, the Corinthians. Do we know for sure that Paul didn't continue to baptize wherever he went? There is no proof either way. So to use this passage to teach that Paul stopped baptizing is a false teaching because there is no proof. You may think it implies it, but that doesn't make it true.

Okay…
Question: If Paul was not sent to baptize, why did he baptize? Quite similar, Paul was likewise not sent by Jesus to circumcise and yet Paul did circumcise. Why did he do it?

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

I'm sure we can agree that Paul said he was glad he didn't baptize anyone else that he could remember other than the three mentioned because he did not want people to be able to say, "I follow Paul." Remember, there are divisions in the church over this.

“Agreed”.

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

Paul said he was sent to preach not to baptize. Preaching was his main job, what Jesus had called him to do. Paul had many christian companions who could have taken care of the baptizing detail. Is Paul saying baptism is not important or necessary? You can imply that if you choose, but you cannot prove it with scripture.

Paul said, “For Christ sent me not to baptize, BUT to preach the gospel…” The word "but" here is a contrastive. There is a stark contrast made between “baptism” and the “gospel”. Question: If baptism is “necessary” for “salvation”, then why did Paul not include baptism in the “gospel message”?

Quoting Corinthians 15:1-4:

1Co 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
1Co 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Notice Paul said the “gospel” is what saves. Again “baptism” is not included in the “gospel message”. "Baptism"is not mentioned at all. Why?

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

I'll say it again. Paul was sent to preach. That was his main job. Anyone could baptize. But in no way does Paul ever minimize the importance or necessity of baptism.

Katimygirl can you give me a scripture that says “baptism is necessary for salvation”. Can you also give me verses that say we are condemned if we don't get "baptized".

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

I found your comment about "the so called great commission" disturbing. You don't believe Jesus gave that commission? Even if you don't want to accept Mark 16, Jesus reaffirms it in Matthew 28. Be careful of those kinds of comments Kids. I don't think you meant it the way it looks, but it did look pretty bad (the so called great commission?). It jumped right out at me. Yikes! Those are Jesus' words. Be careful.

Oh, sorry! I didn’t mean to offend you. The reason why I said the so called “great commission” was because the term “great commission” is not found in the “bible”. So it was just a matter of semantics (nothing more and nothing less).

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

Yes Paul was under the great commission, just as you and I are. Paul and all of the apostles baptized because that's what they were told to do. Does this mean Paul disobeyed Jesus' command? Does this mean that every single person he and the other apostles preached the gospel to, they personally baptized? I doubt it. Does this mean that every single christian must baptize? I don't think so. I think the main idea of the great commission was to make disciples. We are to teach the gospel, and either we or some other christian will do the baptizing. I have personally never baptized anyone. Does that mean I am not following Jesus' great commission? I don't believe that. You are putting way too much emphasis on the "baptizer." The one that does the baptizing is not important. All they do is lower the person into the water, and raise them up from it. God does ALL of the work. The important thing is that people must be baptized to be saved, and Paul never, ever minimized its importance.

If we are under the “great commission”, we should be baptizing and making disciples don’t you think? That is commanded…

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

Does this mean that every single christian must baptize? I don't think so. I think the main idea of the great commission was to make disciples. We are to teach the gospel, and either we or some other christian will do the baptizing. I have personally never baptized anyone. Does that mean I am not following Jesus' great commission? I don't believe that. You are putting way too much emphasis on the "baptizer." The one that does the baptizing is not important. All they do is lower the person into the water, and raise them up from it. God does ALL of the work. The important thing is that people must be baptized to be saved, and Paul never, ever minimized its importance.

Could you show me scripture that say people must be baptized to be "saved", other than Mark 16:16?

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

Every single scripture that talks about baptism is literal water baptism unless the context tells us different (suffering, Moses, Holy Spirit).

What if you can’t really tell out of the context? What you just automatically assume it refers to water baptism?
How would you interpret Mark 10:39?

Mar 10:38 But Jesus said unto them, Ye know not what ye ask: can ye drink of the cup that I drink of? and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with?
Mar 10:39 And they said unto him, We can. And Jesus said unto them, Ye shall indeed drink of the cup that I drink of; and with the baptism that I am baptized withal shall ye be baptized:

What “baptism” do you think Jesus had in mind?

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

I said it several times in my post that history is not inspired by the Holy Spirit, but you cannot deny 1500 years of history when it consistently 100% of the time says baptism was immersion in water for the forgiveness of sins. I could understand if their were various opinions about it, but there were not. EVERYONE agreed that baptism was immersion in water, and it was for remission of sins. You might as well deny the Civil War ever took place if you deny early church history.

I'll address Cornelius in another post.

Katie

Are you appealing to tradition? People have been consistently getting it wrong in the past. History of the church is entirely fallible. Do I have to bring up early heresies of the church? I’ll say again I am not arguing from people's interpretation. Instead, I am arguing from the ‘biblical’ text itself.

[MissKate12]

kids in america_;19046239] Question: If Paul was not sent to baptize, why did he baptize? Quite similar, Paul was likewise not sent by Jesus to circumcise and yet Paul did circumcise. Why did he do it?

First of all, I want to tell you that you are right. The scriptures do not call Jesus' command to make disciples and baptize "the great commission." It's a habit I've gotten into only because when you say great commission, everybody knows what you're talking about. Not a good excuse, and in the future, I will be careful not to say it. So thanks for bringing that to my attention.

I have no clue about Paul circumcising. I'll research it.

I believe Paul baptized for the same reason any other christian does: because it was what Jesus commanded us to do.

"18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.

My question to you is, do you make disciples and baptize them?

Hypothetical situation: Paul preaches to a group of 50 Gentiles. Forty accept the message and want to be baptized. If Paul doesn't baptize every single one of the forty, has he disobeyed Jesus? Not IMHO, and I doubt you'd think so either. As I said to you in my last post, I preach the gospel to people. When they accept the message, the preacher at the congregation where I worship baptizes the person. Does that mean I disobeyed the command of Jesus. Honestly, I think this is a silly point.

Paul said, “For Christ sent me not to baptize, BUT to preach the gospel…” The word "but" here is a contrastive. There is a stark contrast made between “baptism” and the “gospel”. Question: If baptism is “necessary” for “salvation”, then why did Paul not include baptism in the “gospel message”?

Yes Paul makes the distinction between baptism and preaching the gospel. They are two completely different actions, but in no way does this minimize baptism. I kind of think we've gone over this already.

I think we first need to agree on what the gospel message is. The following passage written by Paul defines the gospel.

1 Cor. 15: "1 Now I would remind you, brothers, of the gospel I preached to you, which you received, in which you stand, 2and by which you are being saved, if you hold fast to the word I preached to you unless you believed in vain. 3For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, 4that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day"

I think we can agree that the gospel message is that Christ died for our sins, he was buried, and he was raised. But notice that Paul is writing to christians, people who have already been saved/baptized.

1 Cor. 1: 2 To the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be his holy people,

As a contrast, read Peter's gospel message in Acts 2.

22 “Fellow Israelites, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know. 23 This man was handed over to you by God’s deliberate plan and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men,[d] put him to death by nailing him to the cross. 24 But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep its hold on him.

Baptism is not the gospel message. The death, burial, and ressurrection of Jesus is the gospel message.

Peter doesn't mention baptism until the people are pierced to the heart and ask him what they should do.

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

When the people OBEY THE GOSPEL, they are added to the church/kingdom.

47Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

In all of Paul's epistles, he is writing to christians. Christians are baptized people. Look at what he says in Romans 6.

3 Or don’t you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

and Colossians 2

11 In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not performed by human hands. Your whole self ruled by the flesh was put off when you were circumcised by Christ, 12 having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through your faith in the working of God, who raised him from the dead.

and Galatians 3

27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.

The gospel message is the death, burial, and ressurection of Jesus.
Obeying the gospel is when you are buried with Him through baptism into death in order that just as Christ was raised from the dead, we too may have a new life.

Do you see the difference between the gospel message and obeying the gospel?

Katimygirl can you give me a scripture that says “baptism is necessary for salvation”. Can you also give me verses that say we are condemned if we don't get "baptized".

Could you show me scripture that say people must be baptized to be "saved", other than Mark 16:16?

Here you go.

38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Ananias to Paul: 16 And now what are you waiting for? Get up, be baptized and wash your sins away, calling on his name.’

No I cannot give you a single scripture that says you are condemned if you don't get baptized. But I can tell you what will happen if you don't obey the gospel.

7And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: 9Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Can you give me a single scripture that says baptism with the Holy Spirit is for salvation?

Oh, sorry! I didn’t mean to offend you. The reason why I said the so called “great commission” was because the term “great commission” is not found in the “bible”. So it was just a matter of semantics (nothing more and nothing less).

You didn't offend me, and thank you for clarifying. You were right about the "great commission." I had never given it any thought prior to you saying it. I wonder how that got started?

What if you can’t really tell out of the context? What you just automatically assume it refers to water baptism?
How would you interpret Mark 10:39?
What “baptism” do you think Jesus had in mind?

38 “You don’t know what you are asking,” Jesus said. “Can you drink the cup I drink or be baptized with the baptism I am baptized with?”

39 “We can,” they answered. Jesus said to them, “You will drink the cup I drink and be baptized with the baptism I am baptized with,"

The context makes it very clear that Jesus is not talking about water immersion here.

IMHO, Jesus was talking about the suffering he was to undergo on the cross. He was letting the apostles know that they, too, would undergo the suffering of persecution. What do you think this means?

When the scriptures talk about baptism, it is always literal water immersion unless the context tells us differently.

Are you appealing to tradition? People have been consistently getting it wrong in the past. History of the church is entirely fallible. Do I have to bring up early heresies of the church? I’ll say again I am not arguing from people's interpretation. Instead, I am arguing from the ‘biblical’ text itself.

True, there have been so many errors in the past, and you're right, history is entirely fallible. But when you get the same story consistently for 1500 years, it's worth taking notice. Like you, I also argue from the Biblical text itself, but history does help one to understand. I don't expect you to use it, but I thought it worth pointing out. Quite honestly, I don't need it to prove that baptism is necessary for salvation.

Now Kids, please tell me you have been baptized in water. I'm going to feel very badly if you haven't been.

Your Buddy,
Katie

[DXCC]

Kids of American

If you open up a NIV Bible to Matthew 28:16 you will see the title of that scripture 28:16- 20 . The title or subtitle or heading of that is ,

The Great Commission.

Because it was a Commission of Jesus Christ . It is referred to The Great Commission.

If you had a Bible as the- People's New Testament - explanatory Notes by B.W.Johnson . dated back from the 1800's

You would read this : 19Go ye therefor , and make disciples of all nations. There are several things to be noticed:1.Go, implies an aggressive warfare. The Gospel army must move upon the nations. the Lord seeks universal empire, and sends forth his armies to conquer the world. Every church and every disciple must understand that they have marching orders. 2Not only is every saint commanded to go, or to take steps to make the gospel go, but the object is stated. They are to make disciples, or pupils, and scholars of Christ; not great philosophers, but "babes in Christ Jesus," who have entered the school of Christ and are to be taught after wards. 3. Who are to be made disciples is next indicated, Not the Jews only, but all nations. Christ came to be the Savior of the world. His is a universal religion. In the Great Commission he looks beyond Judea, and commands that the Gospel shall be offered to all nations, The test of eighteen centuries shows that Christianity is not local or national, but is adapted to the need of all mankind. Next stated how disciples shall be made. Baptizing them. The rite by which those who believe upon him should be formally enlisted and enrolled in the school of Christ is baptism. It is not a baptism of the Spirit that He means, because it is one that those whom he addresses are commanded to administer. He alone baptized with the Spirit.
- B.W.Johnson go's on to explain the rest of the Great Commission. By the way we are now into the 21st century of Christianity -Some day I may purchase a Bible with Explanatory notes from a 21 century Preacher of a Church of Christ . But I really doubt the understanding would have changed any.

I would say 99% of the Christians know what Katie would mean by the Term or Title Great Commission and would except it. Your word games do not change anything.

The Great Commission.

28:16 Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go. 17When they saw Him, they worshiped him: but some doubted. 18Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me, 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

Katie ,my preacher and very dear friend James Harvey said for me to tell you that "he appreciates the great effort you put forth and the outstanding post."


And least us not forget this verse : Acts 2:38 Peter replied " Repent and be baptized everyone of you , in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

God Bless,

DXCC

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

I'll say it again. Paul was sent to preach. That was his main job. Anyone could baptize. But in no way does Paul ever minimize the importance or necessity of baptism.

Katie, you know that I agree with you that baptism by water is required of us. What I don't understand is how you have come to the conclusion that "anyone could baptize." I cannot see so much as a hint in the scriptures that this is so. Can you tell me why you insist that it is?

[MissKate12]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Katie, you know that I agree with you that baptism by water is required of us. What I don't understand is how you have come to the conclusion that "anyone could baptize." I cannot see so much as a hint in the scriptures that this is so. Can you tell me why you insist that it is?

Hi Katz. Nice to see you again.

There are no apostles today. Even when there were, disciples also did the baptizing, i.e. John's disciples, Jesus' disciples, the seven who were chosen....Philip, Steven, and the others. I see nothing in the scriptures that say anything about qualifications to be a baptizer. Jesus commanded us to make disciples by baptizing them, then teaching them to observe all He had commanded. Jesus gave all of us authority to baptize. Not only did He give us authority to baptize, He commanded it.

There are no records of any of the apostles starting the church in Rome. It is widely thought that some who had heard the word preached on the day of Pentecost, believed, repented and were baptized. They then carried the gospel to Rome and established a church there. So yes, any christian may baptize. IMHO, I see no reason to place any importance on the baptizer. They have no role other than lowering and raising the believer from the water.

Katie

[MissKate12]

Originally Posted by DXCC

Katie ,my preacher and very dear friend James Harvey said for me to tell you that "he appreciates the great effort you put forth and the outstanding post."
God Bless,
DXCC

Hi DXCC,

Please tell your preacher and dear friend James Harvey that I said thank you so much for his kind words. There are times when I ask myself why I bother to put so much time and effort into the forums when so many oppose and reject Jesus' command to be baptized.

Here is something to think about.

Luke 7:29-30
29 (All the people, even the tax collectors, when they heard Jesus’ words, acknowledged that God’s way was right, because they had been baptized by John. 30 But the Pharisees and the experts in the law rejected God’s purpose for themselves, because they had not been baptized by John.)

1. All the people heard Jesus, even the tax collectors
2. They acknowledged that God's way was right
3. Because they had been baptized by John
4. But the Pharisees and experts rejected God's purpose for them
5. Because they had not been baptized by John

These scriptures tell us much. The first part clearly states that ALL THE PEOPLE ACKNOWLEDGED GOD'S WAY WAS RIGHT BEING BAPTIZED WITH THE BAPTISM OF JOHN. The second part clearly states THE PHARISEES AND EXPERTS REJECTED GOD'S PURPOSE FOR THEM BECAUSE THEY HAD NOT BEEN BAPTIZED BY JOHN. Simply put, it is God's purpose that we be baptized.

By their refusal to be baptized by going into the water, they rejected Jesus. It was proof that they did not believe in their heart or repent. They rejected GOD. They rejected His Word, by not being baptized.

So those who love to take Mark 16:16 "Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned," and tell us that it does not say that if you are not baptized you will not be condemned should look closely at Luke 7:29-30. When you reject baptism, you reject God's purpose. You reject God!

And now I will post this for my good friend Kids in America.

Thank you for your nice post.

Katie

[MissKate12]

kids in america_;19046239

Here is something to think about.

Luke 7:29-30
29 (All the people, even the tax collectors, when they heard Jesus’ words, acknowledged that God’s way was right, because they had been baptized by John. 30 But the Pharisees and the experts in the law rejected God’s purpose for themselves, because they had not been baptized by John.)

1. All the people heard Jesus, even the tax collectors
2. They acknowledged that God's way was right
3. Because they had been baptized by John
4. But the Pharisees and experts rejected God's purpose for them
5. Because they had not been baptized by John

These scriptures tell us much. The first part clearly states that ALL THE PEOPLE ACKNOWLEDGED GOD'S WAY WAS RIGHT BEING BAPTIZED WITH THE BAPTISM OF JOHN. The second part clearly states THE PHARISEES AND EXPERTS REJECTED GOD'S PURPOSE FOR THEM BECAUSE THEY HAD NOT BEEN BAPTIZED BY JOHN. Simply put, it is God's purpose that we be baptized.

By their refusal to be baptized by going into the water, they rejected Jesus. It was proof that they did not believe in their heart or repent. They rejected GOD. They rejected His Word, by not being baptized.

So those who love to take Mark 16:16 "Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned," and tell us that it does not say that if you are not baptized you will not be condemned should look closely at Luke 7:29-30. When you reject baptism, you reject God's purpose. You reject God!

Katie

[AlabamaStorm]

Originally Posted by katiemygirl

Here is something to think about.

Luke 7:29-30
29 (All the people, even the tax collectors, when they heard Jesus’ words, acknowledged that God’s way was right, because they had been baptized by John. 30 But the Pharisees and the experts in the law rejected God’s purpose for themselves, because they had not been baptized by John.)

1. All the people heard Jesus, even the tax collectors
2. They acknowledged that God's way was right
3. Because they had been baptized by John
4. But the Pharisees and experts rejected God's purpose for them
5. Because they had not been baptized by John

These scriptures tell us much. The first part clearly states that ALL THE PEOPLE ACKNOWLEDGED GOD'S WAY WAS RIGHT BEING BAPTIZED WITH THE BAPTISM OF JOHN. The second part clearly states THE PHARISEES AND EXPERTS REJECTED GOD'S PURPOSE FOR THEM BECAUSE THEY HAD NOT BEEN BAPTIZED BY JOHN. Simply put, it is God's purpose that we be baptized.

By their refusal to be baptized by going into the water, they rejected Jesus. It was proof that they did not believe in their heart or repent. They rejected GOD. They rejected His Word, by not being baptized.

So those who love to take Mark 16:16 "Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned," and tell us that it does not say that if you are not baptized you will not be condemned should look closely at Luke 7:29-30. When you reject baptism, you reject God's purpose. You reject God!

Katie

I've read a number of your posts regarding your belief that a person cannot be regenerated to life by the Spirit apart from being water baptized.

If this is so, how do you understand Joh 1:13?:

Joh 1:13 who--not of blood nor of a will of flesh, nor of a will of man but--of God were begotten.

The implication here is that neither the will of the flesh (the one who wills to be water baptized) nor the will of man (the one who administers water baptism) plays any part or roll in our regeneration. IOW, according to Joh 1:13, regeneration is accomplished by God alone. Purely being an act of monergism by the Spirit, rather than synergism.

How then are we to understand this if man's will in being water baptized plays apart in his regeneration?

Here is an article that discusses the differences between monergism and synergism with regards to regeneration of the Spirit:

Two Views of Regeneration by John Hendryx

[twin.spin]

Originally Posted by DXCC

Thief on the Cross Explained.

According to Romans 6:3-6 Baptism represents being unified with Christ in His Death , Burial , and Resurrection.

The problem with the thief on the Cross when Jesus told him he would be with Him in paradise, is Jesus was still alive. Christ had not yet died or been buried, so He sure had not risen yet either.

Baptism into Christ was not put into practice until Pentecost in Acts 2 . After Christ had risen from the dead and ascended to Heaven. (Acts 2:38)

The thief on the Cross was still under the Old Covenant ( or on the Old Testament side of the Cross ) and therefor not subject to baptism. The thief was saved like anyone else under Old Covenant.

But besides that Jesus Christ had the authority to forgive people of their sins. Mark 2:9-12 Matthew 9:6

Hebrews 9:16 In the case of a will, it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it. 17because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while the one who made it is living. 18This is why even the first covenant was not put into effect without blood.

It is that simple !

DXCC

My understanding of what Baptism does is that it doesn't represent anything. Christ's love for the church has more than a "representation" concept to it. (Ephesians 5:25-26)

As far as the whole line of thinking that the thief was "still under the Old Covenant .... therefor not subject to baptism" would not hold up then against all the prior references to baptism before his crucifixion.

As advice was given before ... people should look closely at Mark 16:16, John 3:36 and others.

Damnation is based on a person's rejection of God, nothing else. That has always been the standard in both covenants.