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Plain and simple...Are you saying it is absolutely impossible for Jesus, as God's son, to be Michael the Archangel?
I'm saying, as the scriptures do, that Jesus is the son of God and Michael is an Archangel. It's a clear distinction that they are two separate individuals.
Are you saying that you have biblical evidence that Jesus changed His form and became Michael the archangel? Please reference this scripture for me because I've never seen it. What purpose did Jesus have to become Michael that He could not have accomplished as Jesus, the Son of God? Where else has Jesus done this? Where else has anyone in the scriptures morphed into a different person?
When Jehova's Witnesses come calling and I point this out to them, every single one of them is astonished and thank me when they leave, for pointing this out to them. They didn't know about Michael the Archangel. They believed that Jesus was the only Archangel. When they see in scripture that what they've been taught is a lie, those of them who are really seeking the truth end up leaving the JH's. My church has many ex-JH's, so we're pretty aware of their non-biblical teachings.
Actually, they believe, and I agree, that he was both. Jesus was an angel in heaven before coming to Earth as a man.
The Imperial Bible-Dictionary says of Michael: "name of a superhuman being, in regard to whom there have in general been two rival opinions, either that he is the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, or that he is one of the so-called seven archangels."
In the Bible there are only two angels mentioned by name. Gabriel and Michael. The term archangel is always singular, and used only in reference to Michael. There are only two persons in the Bible other than Jehovah who have authority over the angels. Jesus and Michael. The apostle Paul says Jesus will come with the voice of an archangel.
So, to relate exactly what you just posted back to the original post in this thread: No, Jehovah's Witnesses are not biblical Christians because that's not what the Bible teaches of who Jesus is. There are no references of Him - or anyone - becoming a different person. Why would Jesus, the Son of God, need to become an archangel and what could He possibly accomplish as an archangel that He couldn't accomplish as the Son of God?
Nowhere in the scriptures does it identify Jesus as Michael (or any other angel, for that matter). Hebrews 1:5-8 draws a clear distinction between Jesus and the angels, “For to which of the angels did God ever say, ‘You are my Son; today I have become your Father’? Or again, ‘I will be His Father, and He will be my Son’? And again, when God brings His firstborn into the world, He says, ‘Let all God's angels worship Him.’ In speaking of the angels He says, ‘He makes his angels winds, his servants flames of fire.’ But about the Son He says, ‘Your throne, O God, will last forever and ever, and righteousness will be the scepter of your kingdom.’”
So, how would you explain that scripture in light of calling Jesus an archangel or that He becomes Michael the archangel? This one scripture alone nullifies that possibility. The hierarchy of heavenly beings is made clear in this passage -- angels worship Jesus who, as God, is alone worthy of worship. No angel is ever worshipped in Scripture; therefore, Jesus (worthy of worship) cannot be Michael or any other angel (not worthy of worship). The angels are called sons of God in Genesis 6:2-4, Job 1:6, Job 2:1, Job 38:7, but Jesus is THE Son of God as stated in Hebrews 1:8 and Matthew 4:3-6.
Michael the archangel is probably the highest of all the angels. Michael is the only angel in the Bible who is designated “the archangel” (Jude 9). Michael the archangel, though, is only an angel. He is not God. The clear distinction in the power and authority of Michael and Jesus can be seen in comparing Matthew 4:10 where Jesus rebukes Satan, and Jude verse 9, where Michael the archangel “dared not bring a judgment of blasphemy” against Satan and calls on the Lord to rebuke him.
Jesus is God incarnate. (John 1:1 and 14) Michael the archangel is a powerful angel, but still only an angel.
The apostle Paul says Jesus will come with the voice of an archangel.
I'm sorry, I forgot to address your other point.
The scripture (the glorious hope and comfort in these last days of the rapture for those who know Christ!) you're referring to is...
1 Thessalonians 4:16, "For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first."
By your reasoning, Jesus becomes Michael the archangel at this time. Does He also become a trumpet? In both cases, it says that Jesus descends WITH, not as...
Also, this verse is the fulfillment of Jesus' promise made in John 14:1-3. In His Father's house are many mansions. That He is going there to prepare a place for those who know Him. Verse 3 is the promise: "And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also."
He says that HE will come again and receive us unto HIMSELF. He. Jesus. Not Michael the Archangel.
The Bible doesn't talk much about the ranking of angels. According to Daniel 10:13, there seems to be more than one in the archangelic ranks. But, in regard to 1 Thessalonians 4:16, perhaps it's Michael whose voice is heard as he is identified with Israel's resurrection in Daniel 12:1-3. Since that's the only information we're given to that mystery, it's a mistake to create an entire theology around it. Especially one that has Jesus turning into an angel, unworthy of worship, and taking on a new name. When Jesus as God, became a man, He was still God and still had the same identity. There was a purpose in God becoming man -- to redeem them unto Himself. There is no reason for Jesus to become an angel with another name. There's also no scriptural reference to, or evidence of, it.
You know, Idk to answer the OP, that is between them and their God.
(I know many people say that their God is not the God of the Bible) (Others say it is.)
I think some people are way too judgmental, and need to worry more about their own relationship
with God and their Savior instead of passing judgement perhaps. Let God work out the rest.
With God all things are possible.
I would recommend evaluating your life against the book of 1John, a measure of the life of a Christian. Your post is so politically correct that it takes no stand whatsoever for anything. Just politically correct platitudes.
is anything you believe incorrect? (knowingly or unknowingly)? if you hear you pastor say something that is incorrect, do you correct them?
Do I think I'm always 100% correct? No. I'm not perfect. But I also don't have other books that I hold as truth other than the scriptures. The Book of Mormon, for example, that contradicts, or tried to add to, the scriptures. I believe that Jesus is Lord and no other.
If I hear a pastor speak and I don't understand something he says, yes, I do try to talk to him to make sure I'm understanding correctly what he said. If I believe he's in error and contradicting the scriptures, I'll discuss it with him and spend time in prayer, seeking God, and searching the scriptures for understanding.
Mormons are not Christians, and this is very easy to understand if you know their doctrine. They teach that God was once a man on another planet and was elevated to being God. And so they believe that Mormon men and women will become elevated to also be gods of their own worlds. Its totally against Biblical Theology, and it is clearly Polytheism. The Bible teaches there is one God, Monotheism.
Your only knowledge of Mormonism comes from anti-Mormon sources, sources that twist and distort LDS doctrine to make it appear offensive. I wonder how you'd like it if the tables were turned. You should be ashamed of yourself.
You remind me a lot of the first person who ever told me I wasn't a Christian. I was five years old, and was sitting out in the sun on the porch of my house one Sunday afternoon. The little neighbor boy, who was six (and whom I had an enormous crush on ) stopped by and proudly told me that he'd just gotten back from going to Church for the first time. "I'm a Christian!" he said. "Oh, that's nice," I answered. "So am I." "No you're not," he insisted. "You're a Mormon." Six years old! He'd been to church once in his brief life and look what he came away having learned.
The Book of Mormon, for example, that contradicts, or tried to add to, the scriptures. I believe that Jesus is Lord and no other.
The Book of Mormon actually testifies to Jesus Christ's divinity and power to save even more times than does the Bible. There is nothing in the Book of Mormon which contradicts anything in the Bible.
The Book of Mormon actually testifies to Jesus Christ's divinity and power to save even more times than does the Bible. There is nothing in the Book of Mormon which contradicts anything in the Bible.
Did Jesus create everything that exists, or was He created?
You know, Idk to answer the OP, that is between them and their God.
(I know many people say that their God is not the God of the Bible) (Others say it is.)
I think some people are way too judgmental, and need to worry more about their own relationship
with God and their Savior instead of passing judgement perhaps. Let God work out the rest.
With God all things are possible.
Leave it to a fellow cat person to be the voice of reason amid all of this nonsense. When all is said and done, it really doesn't matter once single solitary bit whether so-and-so acknowledges so-and-so as a Christian or not. There is not one person on earth God's going to look to for a second opinion when any of us stand before Him to be judged. To believe in Him is to know that the rules will be fair and that there will be wonderful surprises.
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