Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
What is it you are saved from or being saved from ?
SIN which leads to death.
This is the problem with those anti-universalists. They never can explain victory over sin. Instead they show that sin can rob God of a child. Or that sinners just get moved to a new location where they remain in rebellion (sin) of God for the rest of eternity. Thankfully that message is WRONG. And the Truth is that God is ALL Powerful and will REMOVE sin from EVERYONE not only because He is ALL Powerfull but because He is willing.
ThAT God is the only god being preached that is ALL POWERFULL!
Yes, we are saved by faith, knowing that Jesus Christ is WITH US IN THE FIRE - just as Christ was with the three Hebrew children when the wicked King put them in the fiery furnace. You are familiar with that story, I take it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heartsong
The crazy stuff I was referring to is the stories about God supposedly telling people to stone disobedient children to death or demand the blood of animals or split open the belly of a pregnant woman or to go to war and kill everyone, not sparing even women and children. I KNOW that stuff is not from God. There ARE some stories in the Old Testament that are "pictures of Christ". Quite a few, in fact. But we must RIGHTLY DIVIDE the scriptures by the indwelling Holy Spirit. I hope that helps.
Sounds like cafeteria theology to me.
Yes, I will take some Daniel. Laws in Leviticus - no thanks.
You know God split open the earth and it swallowed a whole clan of people, right? Pharaoh's army drowned in the Red Sea... Uzziah struck dead trying to balance the ark of the covenant... Samuel chopping up King Agag because King Saul did not follow the Lord's orders and wipe out the enemy... The Lord was an active participant in these deaths in different ways.
As far as your Daniel answer to me... I am not in any fire. Jesus Christ is with me, but we aren't in any fire - so I guess I don't understand your point.
Yes, I will take some Daniel. Laws in Leviticus - no thanks.
You know God split open the earth and it swallowed a whole clan of people, right? Pharaoh's army drowned in the Red Sea... Uzziah struck dead trying to balance the ark of the covenant... Samuel chopping up King Agag because King Saul did not follow the Lord's orders and wipe out the enemy... The Lord was an active participant in these deaths in different ways.
As far as your Daniel answer to me... I am not in any fire. Jesus Christ is with me, but we aren't in any fire - so I guess I don't understand your point.
No fire, eh? I believe you. Everyone will be salted with fire, though. You can interpret the OT however you want - it makes no difference to me. I have my own personal faith. You have yours. What's new?
This is the problem with those anti-universalists. They never can explain victory over sin. Instead they show that sin can rob God of a child. Or that sinners just get moved to a new location where they remain in rebellion (sin) of God for the rest of eternity. Thankfully that message is WRONG. And the Truth is that God is ALL Powerful and will REMOVE sin from EVERYONE not only because He is ALL Powerfull but because He is willing.
ThAT God is the only god being preached that is ALL POWERFULL!
Incorrect accusation.
It's all in Romans 6.
Believers are freed from sin upon dying with Christ. That freedom means we are able to live without sin. Before Christ, people are slaves to sin - but that is no longer the case for the believer. So even though we are now free from the slavery of sin - we can still choose to sin. Therefore, our command is to...
Romans 6:12-13 - ...not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts, and do not go on presenting the members of your body to sin as instruments of unrighteousness; but present yourselves to God as those alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God.
Until we leave the earth, we still have the option to sin.
This is not to be confused with Christ's death which paid for the penalty of sin. We may still sin - but those sins are not charged to anyone's account.
The sole factor one needs for eternal life is the presence of Christ through the indwelling of the Spirit (which comes at a result of believing the gospel). Without that, even though all sins are paid for - the vessel is still dirty and unworthy to be in God's presence.
This is not to be confused with Christ's death which paid for the penalty of sin. We may still sin - but those sins are not charged to anyone's account.
You have that part right. The penalty of sin is death. But the gift of God is life through his son. And God is not holding anyone's sins to their account. That goes for people who do not yet know about this. It is sinful men who are holding sins against others. The gospel message is that God was in Christ reconciling the world to himself and that He chose to do this WHILE WE WERE YET SINNERS. I have never met a believer who did not still retain a sin nature. There is no difference - we are all concluded in unbelief and if we sin in one point that counts as breaking all of God's laws (which we all have) and all men are liars and all liars will have their part in the Lake of Fire,,, BUT those who have purified themselves will NOT BE HURT by the 2nd Death which Is the Lake of Fire. Our God is a consuming Fire. Who can dwell with the devouring fire - he who has clean hands and a pure heart.
The crazy stuff I was referring to is the stories about God supposedly telling people to stone disobedient children to death or demand the blood of animals or split open the belly of a pregnant woman or to go to war and kill everyone, not sparing even women and children. I KNOW that stuff is not from God. There ARE some stories in the Old Testament that are "pictures of Christ". Quite a few, in fact. But we must RIGHTLY DIVIDE the scriptures by the indwelling Holy Spirit. I hope that helps.
Thanks for the response.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
