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Old 11-21-2013, 09:24 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
269 posts, read 208,221 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
How does that prove that Jesus Christ never loved them or considered them an enemy not a neighbor?
show me where jesus was compassionate to a pharisee...
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Old 11-21-2013, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
269 posts, read 208,221 times
Reputation: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
What inconsistency is there in Jesus Christ?. All you've come up with so far is "he wasn't very nice to a Pharisee in his own home". Are you for real?
wow...really...

But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath?
matthew 3:7

"Be careful," Jesus said to them. "Be on your guard against the yeast of the Pharisees and Sadducees."
matthew 6:16

john 8
Dispute Over Whose Children Jesus’ Opponents Are

31 To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, "If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples 32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.

33 They answered him, “We are Abraham’s descendants and have never been slaves of anyone. How can you say that we shall be set free?”

34 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. 37 I know that you are Abraham’s descendants. Yet you are looking for a way to kill me, because you have no room for my word. 38 I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence, and you are doing what you have heard from your father.[b]”

39 “Abraham is our father,” they answered.

“If you were Abraham’s children,” said Jesus, “then you would[c] do what Abraham did. 40 As it is, you are looking for a way to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God. Abraham did not do such things. 41 You are doing the works of your own father.”

“We are not illegitimate children,” they protested. “The only Father we have is God himself.”

42 Jesus said to them, If God were your Father, you would love me, for I have come here from God. I have not come on my own; God sent me. 43 Why is my language not clear to you? Because you are unable to hear what I say. 44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies. 45 Yet because I tell the truth, you do not believe me! 46 Can any of you prove me guilty of sin? If I am telling the truth, why don’t you believe me? 47 Whoever belongs to God hears what God says. The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.”

Jesus’ Claims About Himself

48 The Jews answered him, “Aren’t we right in saying that you are a Samaritan and demon-possessed?”

49 “I am not possessed by a demon,” said Jesus, “but I honor my Father and you dishonor me. 50 I am not seeking glory for myself but there is one who seeks it, and he is the judge. 51 Very truly I tell you, "whoever obeys my word will never see death.”

52 At this they exclaimed, “Now we know that you are demon-possessed! Abraham died and so did the prophets, yet you say that whoever obeys your word will never taste death. 53 Are you greater than our father Abraham? He died, and so did the prophets. Who do you think you are?”

54 Jesus replied, "If I glorify myself, my glory means nothing. My Father, whom you claim as your God, is the one who glorifies me. 55 Though you do not know him, I know him. If I said I did not, I would be a liar like you, but I do know him and obey his word. 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.”

57 “You are not yet fifty years old,” they said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”

58 “Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

yea jesus was a real piece of work alright.
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Old 11-21-2013, 11:45 PM
 
Location: Taos NM
5,357 posts, read 5,134,067 times
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Why did god want to create an enemy?
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:01 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
269 posts, read 208,221 times
Reputation: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil P View Post
Why did god want to create an enemy?
so it can feel better about itself....?????

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Old 11-22-2013, 12:18 AM
 
670 posts, read 815,365 times
Reputation: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil P View Post
Why did god want to create an enemy?
In order for freewill to exist there must exists choices, otherwise with out the choices you are a mindless automaton.

God did not want dolls to play with, she wanted people to nurture as a parent nurtures their children, people to love and if they chose to reject her, people to let go of so that she could let them walk their own path.

So in order for you to comprehend what is good, there must also exists evil.
To comprehend what is a thing is to define what it is not.

If God is good, the the devil is evil, for when God created freewill in order for it to exists there had to exists evil.

"Nothing can exist with out it's apparent dissimilar to be weighed against it." - Azraels Law of the Universe #3.
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:45 AM
 
Location: South Africa
5,563 posts, read 7,215,344 times
Reputation: 1798
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azrael17 View Post
In order for freewill to exist there must exists choices, otherwise with out the choices you are a mindless automaton.

God did not want dolls to play with, she wanted people to nurture as a parent nurtures their children, people to love and if they chose to reject her, people to let go of so that she could let them walk their own path.

So in order for you to comprehend what is good, there must also exists evil.
To comprehend what is a thing is to define what it is not.

If God is good, the the devil is evil, for when God created freewill in order for it to exists there had to exists evil.

"Nothing can exist with out it's apparent dissimilar to be weighed against it." - Azraels Law of the Universe #3.
The problem with the theist proposition of freewill is that it is used to somehow reinforce that a choice to be theists was a free choice and not one influenced by indoctrination.

It is a false premise as even in the secular world, we do not have free will. We are all required to adhere to the laws of the land or else there are consequences. These are real consequences like jail time, criminal record and so on.

The theist assertion of freewill suggests that you are free to choose to believe in god or not but they do not see the fallacy of that proposition. The choice of "choosing" not to hold to a god belief infers a consequence of a mythical hell and eternal torment.

The choice to believe is even less convincing as by the definitions in the bible, heave is a place of eternal worship and a 24/infinity church service. Who in their right mind looks forward to that? Not to mention the bible also suggests that god will deal with memories of loved ones that would be in the imaginary hell by way of a mind wipe that these people even existed. (wiping away every tear)

This then negates the entire freewill proposition as the end game you become a mindless drone which defeats the concept of not being created as a mindless drone with freewill. There is a reason why sheep are used in reference to believers and goats to non believers. Sheep are by observation, pretty devoid of anything but herd mentality whereas goats tend not to herd and do their own thing foraging far and wide and even climbing trees.

This is the menu options as far as the theist choice goes but in reality, the menu is not even real. In both cases you have to die to get served.

If free will does not exist in secular society concerning laws with real tangible consequences, then how can anyone use this argument when it comes to god belief is simply disingenuous.
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Old 11-22-2013, 12:59 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
269 posts, read 208,221 times
Reputation: 58
who is the enemy of god...?

the skeptic.
god sure is insecure...as he places his value on whether or not people believe his unverifiable claims...
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Old 11-22-2013, 03:26 AM
 
Location: New England
37,337 posts, read 28,299,599 times
Reputation: 2746
Quote:
Originally Posted by minidiaz View Post
wow...really...

But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath?
matthew 3:7

"Be careful," Jesus said to them. "Be on your guard against the yeast of the Pharisees and Sadducees."
matthew 6:16

john 8
Dispute Over Whose Children Jesus’ Opponents Are

31 To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, "If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples 32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.

33 They answered him, “We are Abraham’s descendants and have never been slaves of anyone. How can you say that we shall be set free?”

34 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. 35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever. 36 So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. 37 I know that you are Abraham’s descendants. Yet you are looking for a way to kill me, because you have no room for my word. 38 I am telling you what I have seen in the Father’s presence, and you are doing what you have heard from your father.[b]”

39 “Abraham is our father,” they answered.

“If you were Abraham’s children,” said Jesus, “then you would[c] do what Abraham did. 40 As it is, you are looking for a way to kill me, a man who has told you the truth that I heard from God. Abraham did not do such things. 41 You are doing the works of your own father.”

“We are not illegitimate children,” they protested. “The only Father we have is God himself.”

42 Jesus said to them, If God were your Father, you would love me, for I have come here from God. I have not come on my own; God sent me. 43 Why is my language not clear to you? Because you are unable to hear what I say. 44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies. 45 Yet because I tell the truth, you do not believe me! 46 Can any of you prove me guilty of sin? If I am telling the truth, why don’t you believe me? 47 Whoever belongs to God hears what God says. The reason you do not hear is that you do not belong to God.”

Jesus’ Claims About Himself

48 The Jews answered him, “Aren’t we right in saying that you are a Samaritan and demon-possessed?”

49 “I am not possessed by a demon,” said Jesus, “but I honor my Father and you dishonor me. 50 I am not seeking glory for myself but there is one who seeks it, and he is the judge. 51 Very truly I tell you, "whoever obeys my word will never see death.”

52 At this they exclaimed, “Now we know that you are demon-possessed! Abraham died and so did the prophets, yet you say that whoever obeys your word will never taste death. 53 Are you greater than our father Abraham? He died, and so did the prophets. Who do you think you are?”

54 Jesus replied, "If I glorify myself, my glory means nothing. My Father, whom you claim as your God, is the one who glorifies me. 55 Though you do not know him, I know him. If I said I did not, I would be a liar like you, but I do know him and obey his word. 56 Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.”

57 “You are not yet fifty years old,” they said to him, “and you have seen Abraham!”

58 “Very truly I tell you,” Jesus answered, “before Abraham was born, I am!” 59 At this, they picked up stones to stone him, but Jesus hid himself, slipping away from the temple grounds.

yea jesus was a real piece of work alright.
Like I said to you,you are revealing how easily offended and sensitive you are. Jesus Christ exposed religious hypocrisy(something that your probably despise yourself)and rather than applaud him for doing so, you use it to form an argument that Jesus Christ as enemies and is unloving. By the way it was John the Baptist who said you brood of vipers. You have no idea what was happening while Jesus walked the earth. He did not come to save folk from hell,to appease God by being a sacrifice, but to set man free from himself by revealing the heart of the Father to them, and in the case of the Jew, the only way possible for him to come, was to tear down the religious system of hypocrisy built on the traditions and doctrines of men that stunk to high heaven that held them captive. Nasty old Jesus sure was a piece of work
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Old 11-22-2013, 03:40 AM
 
35,309 posts, read 52,305,052 times
Reputation: 30999
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azrael17 View Post
In order for freewill to exist there must exists choices, otherwise with out the choices you are a mindless automaton.

.
If god made everything why would he also make an enemy?
This idea of freewill seems a rather vacuous concept as it appears your choice is to either follow this gods way or burn in hell for eternity,sounds more like extortion than free will.
Then theres all these concepts of love and compassion, how does that fit in with all the pain,suffering and devastation that goes on in the world? , how many young children got swept away in the recent Philippine what hurricane, or the kids that got blown to bits in their Sandy Hook school.
If i was going to bow down and worship some super being who supposedly made everything he will have to do a much better job of it than i'm seeing.
As for mindless automatons? religious fundamentalists certainly fit that description IMO
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Old 11-22-2013, 03:45 AM
 
Location: New England
37,337 posts, read 28,299,599 times
Reputation: 2746
Quote:
Originally Posted by minidiaz View Post
who is the enemy of god...?

the skeptic.
god sure is insecure...as he places his value on whether or not people believe his unverifiable claims...
The better question would be who created a god that is your enemy ?. The answer although it is a hard one to swallow is...............look in the mirror. Hopefully this will pull the rug from under your argument that the dispicible bible god and Nasty old Jesus created them.
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