Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
How ever wonderful Franklin Graham might think of himself, other christian leaders do not share the same image..
Seems his racism and bigotry are showing:
Franklin posted--
“Listen up—Blacks, Whites, Latinos, and everybody else. Most police shootings can be avoided. It comes down to respect for authority and obedience. If a police officer tells you to stop, you stop. If a police officer tells you to put your hands in the air, you put your hands in the air. If a police officer tells you to lay down face first with your hands behind your back, you lay down face first with your hands behind your back. It’s as simple as that. Even if you think the police officer is wrong—YOU OBEY. Parents, teach your children to respect and obey those in authority. Mr. President, this is a message our nation needs to hear, and they need to hear it from you. Some of the unnecessary shootings we have seen recently might have been avoided. The Bible says to submit to your leaders and those in authority “because they keep watch over you as those who must give an account.”
How ever wonderful Franklin Graham might think of himself, other christian leaders do not share the same image..
Seems his racism and bigotry are showing:
Franklin posted--
“Listen up—Blacks, Whites, Latinos, and everybody else. Most police shootings can be avoided. It comes down to respect for authority and obedience. If a police officer tells you to stop, you stop. If a police officer tells you to put your hands in the air, you put your hands in the air. If a police officer tells you to lay down face first with your hands behind your back, you lay down face first with your hands behind your back. It’s as simple as that. Even if you think the police officer is wrong—YOU OBEY. Parents, teach your children to respect and obey those in authority. Mr. President, this is a message our nation needs to hear, and they need to hear it from you. Some of the unnecessary shootings we have seen recently might have been avoided. The Bible says to submit to your leaders and those in authority “because they keep watch over you as those who must give an account.”
Maybe Franklin would do well to heed his own advise about AUTHORITY and RESPECT the PRESIDENT?
I have never listened to any of Franklin Graham's messages and so don't know anything about his views. But regarding this matter, while you might not like the way he said it (I have no problem with it) but there was nothing racist or bigoted about what he said. He included everyone in his statement, and he is correct in that when a police officer tells you to put your hands up, or stop, or lie on the ground, then you do it. It is a matter of respect for the authority of the police officer. And it is definitely to your benefit to obey. Too many people have no respect for authority, and law and order.
This isn't an issue of having to choose between obeying God rather than man. It's simply an issue of obeying the legitimate authority of the police officer under the principle of divine establishment who is doing his job as a law enforcement officer. And while some police officers may be too quick to shoot, and while there may be some genuinely bad apples who wear a badge, that is not the issue.
Romans 13:1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. 2] Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. 3] For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, 4] for he is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God’s wrath on the wrongdoer. 5] Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God’s wrath but also for the sake of conscience.
The people who wrote an open letter to Graham objecting to what he said are out of line. And anyone who refuses to comply with the lawful commands of a police officer is in the wrong.
“Listen up—Blacks, Whites, Latinos, and everybody else. Most police shootings can be avoided. It comes down to respect for authority and obedience. If a police officer tells you to stop, you stop. If a police officer tells you to put your hands in the air, you put your hands in the air. If a police officer tells you to lay down face first with your hands behind your back, you lay down face first with your hands behind your back. It’s as simple as that. Even if you think the police officer is wrong—YOU OBEY. Parents, teach your children to respect and obey those in authority. Mr. President, this is a message our nation needs to hear, and they need to hear it from you. Some of the unnecessary shootings we have seen recently might have been avoided. The Bible says to submit to your leaders and those in authority “because they keep watch over you as those who must give an account.”
Geee.... Franklin...... you'd have loved the Nazi-era WWII years in Europe!! Too bad you didn't have FB then so you could to tell people what to do.
"Listen up--Jews, gypsies, homosexuals and everybody else. Most overcrowding on railroad box cars can be avoided. It comes down to respect for authority and obedience. If a member of the SS tells you to stop, you stop. If a member of the SS tells you to put your hands in the air, you put your hands in the air......"
The police are not here to tell me what to do. They work for me. If I have to put my hands up they better have a dam good reason. If I am told to lay on the ground, they better have a better reason.
The police have overstepped their authority when men are killed for simply selling cigarettes in public.
The police work for us. They are not the be all end all of authority. In this country, the courts and the law are the authority, and we have the means to challenge them too. There is no authority in this country I cannot challenge.
Franklin Graham and Christianity is an oxymoron. The two should never be in the same sentence. Franklin Graham and the word twit is a better match.
Geee.... Franklin...... you'd have loved the Nazi-era WWII years in Europe!! Too bad you didn't have FB then so you could to tell people what to do.
"Listen up--Jews, gypsies, homosexuals and everybody else. Most overcrowding on railroad box cars can be avoided. It comes down to respect for authority and obedience. If a member of the SS tells you to stop, you stop. If a member of the SS tells you to put your hands in the air, you put your hands in the air......"
There seems an issue related to respect for a police officer's command, respect for authority broadly, and the current tension racially in our nation. I have great respect for the police, though it is quite likely there are a small percent who are on the other side of the law. They should be outed from within but that is a discussion for another forum. Until then, the rebuttal letter outlines very nicely the tenets of appropriate civil disobedience and the racial discord that has existed in this country. Relative to respect for authority, that should be qualified as it pertains to government authority and as described within the rebuttal letter contextually, as it is fitting within the church hierarchy. I believe there is a scriptural admonition to obey both, though while his research for the same was incorrect relative to the scripture, his intent was clear regarding respect for government authorities.
With that said, I think Franklin was off simply because the racial tension between the police and minority groups cannot be addressed with the premise to just 'obey.' While I think I get where he is coming from, the issue is not a simple one. There is great complexity as well as clear biases found through investigations that are getting minorities sacrificed. I have heard the 'obey' argument and it is doesn't hold water for many of the unjust shootings over several decades, where people have simply obeyed and been shot or otherwise killed nevertheless. There is a whole other discussion point (training police officers) that is good for another forum or thread.
With that said, I can support the rebuttal writers. Franklin erred. It is his support of the 'simple command' that is erroneous. The rebuttal writers were correct to call him on it and I think they did it appropriately. I don't think it was racially motivated or shows him as a racially ignorant fellow as much as it suggests he should become educated on the political issues relevant for the discussion. His ignorance in that arena spills over into the discussion on race. He should apologize.
Geee.... Franklin...... you'd have loved the Nazi-era WWII years in Europe!! Too bad you didn't have FB then so you could to tell people what to do.
"Listen up--Jews, gypsies, homosexuals and everybody else. Most overcrowding on railroad box cars can be avoided. It comes down to respect for authority and obedience. If a member of the SS tells you to stop, you stop. If a member of the SS tells you to put your hands in the air, you put your hands in the air......"
Jesus was a radical. He was crucified for his radicalism. I'll be damned if I am going to allow the authorities do anything close to modern day crucifixion.
Franklin Graham speaks for authority, when Jesus spoke against it. Some of us are standing up. More of us every day. Fundamentalism in every faith is the Anti-Christ. Franklin Graham is a fundamentalist.
Last edited by RonkonkomaNative; 03-22-2015 at 03:41 PM..
Reason: adding.
I have never listened to any of Franklin Graham's messages and so don't know anything about his views. But regarding this matter, while you might not like the way he said it (I have no problem with it) but there was nothing racist or bigoted about what he said. He included everyone in his statement, and he is correct in that when a police officer tells you to put your hands up, or stop, or lie on the ground, then you do it. It is a matter of respect for the authority of the police officer. And it is definitely to your benefit to obey. Too many people have no respect for authority, and law and order.
This isn't an issue of having to choose between obeying God rather than man. It's simply an issue of obeying the legitimate authority of the police officer under the principle of divine establishment who is doing his job as a law enforcement officer. And while some police officers may be too quick to shoot, and while there may be some genuinely bad apples who wear a badge, that is not the issue.
Romans 13:1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. 2] Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. 3] For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, 4] for he is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God’s wrath on the wrongdoer. 5] Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God’s wrath but also for the sake of conscience.
The people who wrote an open letter to Graham objecting to what he said are out of line. And anyone who refuses to comply with the lawful commands of a police officer is in the wrong.
My confidence in this was so great,i just won $100!!
Never resist authority...no matter what they do
Last edited by zthatzmanz28; 10-15-2017 at 09:51 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
