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Well if Jesus didn't say it metaphorically, how did He say it?
factually ... it's just is. A stand alone statement.
not represents
not metaphorically
not transubstantiation
As our doctrinal statement states in point #4:
(4) The real presence of the body and blood of Christ in the usus is brought about solely and alone by the power of Christ according to the words of institution, that is, by His command and promise. We accept this statement (Point 4) with the understanding that:
a) The real presence is effected solely by the original words of institution spoken by our Lord (causa efficiens) and repeated by the officiant at His command (causa instrumentalis).
b) While we cannot fix from Scripture the point within the sacramental usus when
the real presence of Christ's body and blood begins, we know from Scripture and
acknowledge in the Confessions that what is distributed and received is the body
and blood of Christ.
c) The Confessions do not assert more as a point of doctrine than the above, which is clearly taught in Scripture.
factually ... it's just is. A stand alone statement.
not represents
not metaphorically
not transubstantiation
As our doctrinal statement states in point #4:
(4) The real presence of the body and blood of Christ in the usus is brought about solely and alone by the power of Christ according to the words of institution, that is, by His command and promise. We accept this statement (Point 4) with the understanding that:
a) The real presence is effected solely by the original words of institution spoken by our Lord (causa efficiens) and repeated by the officiant at His command (causa instrumentalis).
b) While we cannot fix from Scripture the point within the sacramental usus when
the real presence of Christ's body and blood begins, we know from Scripture and
acknowledge in the Confessions that what is distributed and received is the body
and blood of Christ.
c) The Confessions do not assert more as a point of doctrine than the above, which is clearly taught in Scripture.
yes and no, communion is indeed an individual and intimate meeting of Christ and the recipient for their sanctification but the results are also for the edification/building up of the Body of Christ (the Church) of which the recipient is a member of (initially "grafted onto" Christ through faith and baptism) where we show and celebrate the unity of all the Church's members who share in the sacrificial offering in the local congregation and the wider Church. strengthened and nourished by the body and blood of Christ those who worthily receive can become better, holier members of that Body and more effectively participate in it's mission and ministry of evangelization by example and word for the salvation of the world
Last edited by georgeinbandonoregon; 06-23-2015 at 12:34 AM..
again, the case can be made that it's not that the meanings and implications of a particular statement is simply "either/or" (metaphor or literal) BUT actually "both/and"---sometimes there may be no dichotomies false or otherwise when Jesus speaks---just the "fullness of truth" on multiple levels. perhaps, we should all recall what Jesus said---"he who has ears to hear, let him hear!"
again, the case can be made that it's not that the meanings and implications of a particular statement is simply "either/or" (metaphor or literal) BUT actually "both/and"---sometimes there may be no dichotomies false or otherwise when Jesus speaks---just the "fullness of truth" on multiple levels.
No one should ever dismiss the power of a metaphor. A metaphor is not "a lie," so there is absolutely no reason for anyone to try to suggest that the metaphors by which Jesus described himself aren't metaphors at all. They are metaphors. Period. When Jesus said He was a vine and that we are the branches, He was expecting us to be intelligent enough to know that He is not literally "a plant having a long, slender stem that trails or creeps on the ground or climbs by winding itself about a support or holding fast with tendrils or claspers." We don't need to look for excuses for Him or try to get Him out of the bind He put himself in by using a metaphor. He said exactly what He wanted to say. It was a "true statement" -- but in a metaphorical as opposed to a literal sense.
No one should ever dismiss the power of a metaphor. A metaphor is not "a lie," so there is absolutely no reason for anyone to try to suggest that the metaphors by which Jesus described himself aren't metaphors at all. They are metaphors. Period. When Jesus said He was a vine and that we are the branches, He was expecting us to be intelligent enough to know that He is not literally "a plant having a long, slender stem that trails or creeps on the ground or climbs by winding itself about a support or holding fast with tendrils or claspers." We don't need to look for excuses for Him or try to get Him out of the bind He put himself in by using a metaphor. He said exactly what He wanted to say. It was a "true statement" -- but in a metaphorical as opposed to a literal sense.
God revealed in 1 Corinthians 10:16-17 and 1 Corinthians 11:27-29 that refutes your so-called intelligence.
1 Corinthians 10:16-17 KJV The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ?
The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ?
For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread.
1 Corinthians 11:27-29 KJV Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord. But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup. For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body Moderator cut: delete
Last edited by Miss Blue; 06-23-2015 at 02:24 PM..
Reason: Personal attack
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