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A backslider can be forgiven when godly sorrow is exhibited. For instance, Peter willfully sinned by lying and cursing before the crucifixion. However, do not take this as a license to sin. If you do not have godly sorrow, then you will not be determined to overcome the flesh, which means not giving into sin. God will not accept willful sin. Adam & Eve is the example.
(2 Corinthians 7:10)"For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of..."
Amen.....there is always hope for sinners to repent and turn to the Lord for forgiveness.......But this in NO WAY implies licenteousness to sin. We must be determined to resist sin.
A backslider can be forgiven when godly sorrow is exhibited. For instance, Peter willfully sinned by lying and cursing before the crucifixion. However, do not take this as a license to sin. If you do not have godly sorrow, then you will not be determined to overcome the flesh, which means not giving into sin. God will not accept willful sin. Adam & Eve is the example.
(2 Corinthians 7:10)"For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of..."
When Peter sinned by lying and cursing before the crucifixion, he was not born-again nor did he have the indwelling Holy Spirit.
The indwelling Holy Spirit was not given until after Christ's resurrection.
"And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:"
John 20:22
We must consider this and beware: The disciples had spiritual gifts before the crucifixion; but they did not have the indwelling Holy Spirit; nor were they born-again. Yet many modern Christians are accepting "spiritual signs and wonders" as their evidence of the new birth, when the Bible says:
"Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin ..."
1 John 3:9
"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Matt 7:21-23
Donna Kupp
The Seven Deadly Deceptions Of Counterfeit Christianity freetruth.info
What do the scriptures say? You must understand what it means to commit sin and know the difference between committing sin and sins of ignorance.
Please read Deception #1 and Deception #2 on my free website. Under related subjects: "Blaspheme The Spirit" and "Knowledge Of The Truth" Heb 10:26. Those articles contain the answers to your questions.
If your present spiritual condition is "sin and repent" and "sin and repent", then you have probably never truly repented in the first place. That is good news; because now you still have the opportunity to make that full repentance and commitment that God requires of you.
Donna Kupp
The Seven Deadly Deceptions Of Counterfeit Christianity freetruth.info
Just curious about something. I do agree with you about not sinning. We should not be sinning. Problem is, I have not met a person who has not sinned after they repented. Paul had quoted that he was not already yet perfect.
Philippians 3:12 [SIZE=2]Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
According to Paul, he had not even attained nor was he yet perfect.
It took 28 years for the people in the book of Acts to call themselves Christians. WOW!! 28 years and today we are called Christians instant potato style.
Either we are perfect instantly and will not ever sin, or salvation is a process.
I do agree that willful sinning is a no no. But you show me one person who is perfect and I will follow that person.
If there is such a person...God would have taken that person away.
[SIZE=2]Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do thefirst works;or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent. [/SIZE]Sounds like Jesus is after His church about repenting again and doing their first works all over again. We know they had the Spirit of God at that time.
By the way Peter had been rebuked by Paul about eating with the Jews and that took place after he had the Holy Ghost.
[/SIZE]
Last edited by Chris Redfield; 01-26-2009 at 05:07 PM..
Just curious about something. I do agree with you about not sinning. We should not be sinning. Problem is, I have not met a person who has not sinned after they repented. Paul had quoted that he was not already yet perfect.
Philippians 3:12 [SIZE=2]Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]According to Paul, he had not even attained nor was he yet perfect. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]It took 28 years for the people in the book of Acts to call themselves Christians. WOW!! 28 years and today we are called Christians instant potato style.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Either we are perfect instantly and will not ever sin, or salvation is a process. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]I do agree that willful sinning is a no no. But you show me one person who is perfect and I will follow that person. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]If there is such a person...God would have taken that person away. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][SIZE=2]Rev 2:5 Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do thefirst works;or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent. [/SIZE]Sounds like Jesus is after His church about repenting again and doing their first works all over again. We know they had the Spirit of God at that time.
By the way Peter had been rebuked by Paul about eating with the Jews and that took place after he had the Holy Ghost.
God will decide who is truely repentant and who will be forgiven because it is only He who is able to judge with wisdom and mercy........Bottom line: avoid sin and ask God's Help to keep from sinning..... He promises to never leave you or forsake you..........Let no man (or woman) condemn you or accuse you.......HOPE IN THE LORD and Trust Him with all your heart..........Jesus came to save sinners not those who "think" they are good enough (or perfect)...... all who call on the name of the Lord will be saved........Those who obey and trust in "Christ Alone" for the forgiveness of sin will be pardoned........."Be humble" before God and He will lift you up...... Tell others of the Love and forgiveness of God thru Jesus Christ.......do not accept the accusations and lies of the enemy.......never believe the lie that you cannot humbly turn back to the Lord for forgiveness in HIM THERE IS HOPE.....God Blessings......
she makes a case by twisting and contorting words of scripture yet, they aren't spoken.
what does quoting the verse "depart from me you workers of iniquity." have to do with this debate?
She denies grace. that is unfortunate because the writer of hebrews in chapter 2 even said jesus was under grace Heb 2:9
"But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honor, that He by the grace of God should taste death for every man."
sorry, donna but these words are truth. the doctrine of grace was even with jesus Christ. these words are suitable for your correction , for your edification, and your instruction.
You remind me of the pharisees in mark , you say you see but you are blind. blind to the truth. and of your own sin.
Donna, jesus died for you and me so that you didn't have to struggle throught life thinking by your own righteousness you might be saved.
What do the scriptures say? You must understand what it means to commit sin and know the difference between committing sin and sins of ignorance.
Please read Deception #1 and Deception #2 on my free website. Under related subjects: "Blaspheme The Spirit" and "Knowledge Of The Truth" Heb 10:26. Those articles contain the answers to your questions.
If your present spiritual condition is "sin and repent" and "sin and repent", then you have probably never truly repented in the first place. That is good news; because now you still have the opportunity to make that full repentance and commitment that God requires of you.
Donna Kupp
The Seven Deadly Deceptions Of Counterfeit Christianity freetruth.info
Moses, Jonah, the woman at the well, and countless others received second chances......................Me, Betsey..................none is perfect, no not one!
That no one should perish, is His desire. Stop making it so complicated for people to come to Christ Jesus. He's God! Let them come, and He'll work it out. He loves us all. That's why we need Jesus, that's the soul purpose of Him dying for our sins...................so that we can have a second chance.
"Let he/she without sin, cast the first stone, go and sin no more." No one threw a stone, no one!! Put your stones down. He's God and He's able to all things according to HIS will!
So if He feels that you deserve a second chance, a third chance, who are you to tell someone, the cut off number? His love is infinite. This is not a prerequisite to sin mind you, that's not what I'm saying. What I am saying is: HIS grace is sufficient for ALL. The drunks, the the crackheads, the murders, the lost, the vagrant, the rich, the poor, me, you............ALL!!
He does'nt need help being God! We are called to tell people about the goodness of God, that He saves.........."So come people, just as you are, and the Holy Spirit will do the rest!" The hour is near, let them come.
Your sister in Christ Jesus
Last edited by Betsey Lane; 01-26-2009 at 09:36 PM..
Hmmm, interesting. Donna, you did so well in that other thread that I gave you a rep for....what happened? I guess I am just not familiar enough with what you believe but after reading this thread, I am.
There are a couple of other people here that think like you do, and it serves no purpose to think like this and in fact, this type of thinking is damaging to God's purpose for us to spread the love of the gospel of Jesus Christ because it is making that wonderful experience out to be unobtainable.
Please stop with the perfection business. It is not biblical, and I don't think anyone wants to be responsible for leading people astray for making salvation too complicated. That is legalism and definitely not Biblical.
Salvation is simple, and we are to work out our salvation with GOD, not men.
So for those misunderstanding and confused by all of this, Jesus said:
John 14:6
Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Simple!!! There is but one way, and all you have to do is accept Jesus as your Savior and repent of your sins, study the word of God for YOURSELF, follow Jesus' teachings and do not willfully sin. When you become saved, you will have a hunger for God's Word that will never be satisfied and the Holy Spirit will convict you when need be.
When you walk with Jesus you grow in your spiritual walk everyday.
Donna, when I read the gospels, I see Jesus much more at home with the tax payers, the prostitutes, the drunkards than the pharisees. Why? Because those sinners needed a Savior. The pharisees didn't.
Don't see much on your website that can't be done without a lot of effort and obeying the law. Jesus didn't need to come for your type.
But for me and folks like me that need a Savior and do not have it within ourselves to uphold the law, I am so glad Jesus came and died for me, forgiving me not only of my past sins, but all my future sins. When he died 2000 years ago, he called all my sins atoned for. All of them were in the future at that point. He didn't just die for the ones I commited prior to my coming to know him, but all the ones I would commit afterwards. This is mercy and grace. Those bound by the law do not like the message of grace. It doesn't appeal to the flesh.
I have met many good adventists. I have also met some that were the leven that Jesus told us to be wary of. You, by your words and your website fit into that category, I am afraid.
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Peter was not born-again when he lied.
