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Perhaps if people spent more time attempting to eradicate their own sin there would be less sin.
--As it strikes June that the only "sins" that anyone can really have any control over would be their own. Perhaps that is where the focus should be.
June likes the notion of "personal responsibility" as opposed to judging other people's actions...
Take gentle care.
Makes sense to me, plus how will you manage your own issues, if you're always looking at and gawking at others?
That's what the Lord said...
As far as gays saying that they're saved, we still need to love them, and let them in, or that's like a young father, trying to teach his son to walk, instead of letting him from out behind the baby gate; to learn, he tells him, "No you can't come here yet, you can't walk like us, stay behind that gate," and the only way he will learn to walk, is for the door to be opened, so he can make little baby-steps......
I thank you for your honesty, but as for the context of those quotes you are not to judge by your own understanding but by what is written. As for the he who is without sin, this is often misunderstood and people forget it takes two to commit adultry so why is she to be punished while the man walks free. It is not a matter of casting stones, that was a punishment unto death, but pointing out a sin thru scripture and seeking repentance of the offender should not be sa death sentence but a revelation of love. Jesus knew the womans heart and knew she was repentant and He told her to go and sin no more.
Context is necessary for understanding, but I commend you on your attempt and honesty.
If I may be permitted and I mean no disrespect to you and I realize that this is the Christian forum and that I am not a Christian but if you will allow me to make this observation. In my culture we also have homosexuals and have for thousands of years, so to us this is nothing new, we look upon them as it is their lifestyle and their choice, not ours, however we don't go about persecuting or condemning them, to us it is just like, and if you forgive the comparison, we look upon other religions and cultures, it is their lifestyle, does not mean that we have to be a part of it. I don't condemn nor do I condone that particular lifestyle, I tolerate it and that is all I do, it is not my lifestyle, I also don't worry about it, I have far more better things to do than worry about somebody else's lifestyle. Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to express this.
RobinD69,
Some practical advice, if you don't mind, from an old retired minister.
If you really care about the souls you feel are headed to hell because they are gay then show your love and concern in some practical way. Make friends. Visit when they're sick or take their trash out - something - anything. Once you establish that you are real and your love is real then maybe - just maybe - you will have a platform to speak to them.
If not you are just another voice in a vast sea of gay haters and persecutors throughout history. If not you are just a sounding brass and clanging cymbal.
Here in the south Texas hill country where I live someone can still get beat up just for being gay. That's because straight men, like me, find the entire thing naturally repulsive. So, show you are different and that you really care for their souls. Prove it.
Then you can report back here about your exploits and how you are reaching these souls for God.
In the meantime I would also suggest (again - it's none of my business - but it's you who made it public) that you make sure you have completely forgiven the person who sodomized you and try to remember that the act wasn't done by a lifestyle or 'people group' it was done by an individual.
I do appreciate your openness and honesty even though we don't see eye to eye on a lot of things.
Blessings...
*edit* earlier when I said "That's because straight men, like me, find the entire thing naturally repulsive" I am just being honest and attempting to show that I don't HAVE to be controlled by my natural tendencies to react very negatively against certain things. I don't have to be a persecutor myself just because I share some of the same initials feelings as those who do hate and persecute. I could have left this detail out but I believe that if we are going to see change in this world we have to be honest about what the causes are for oppression and persecution.
Last edited by firstborn888; 04-04-2009 at 10:17 PM..
^^
That is wise advice, but one must be clear of his intentions. If one is reaching out and helping those in need with the goal of converting them, then it is no better than a missionary holding food in front of a starving child to make that child proclaim Jesus as her savior.
ptsum - According to the terms of the "Christian" subforum, anybody is allowed to post in it so long as they are discussing issues associated with Christianity, not Christians themselves. I appreciate your perspective. I think it is an important one in this forum that seems dominated by extreme atheists and extreme Christians and people who descend from those worldviews.
So, thank you.
I will never get the obession with gays! I don't feel like looking it up, but I know there is a scripture that says not to even LOOK UPON something that even RESEMBLES sin....think of all the places that could take you! You couldn't even watch a tv commercial these days! If Robin or anyone else who claims to be a christian watches television, they are looking upon lots of sin and things resembling sin. Obsession!
Agreed! When those commercials come on, I turn it. There is very little TV that we can watch. It's mostly a bunch of filth.
Sin is sin. Everytime we are off the mark as believers we sin, we ask forgiveness and move on. I have a close friend who is gay. I have shared with him what I see the Scriptures saying but love him as a brother in Christ. At this point in his life he feels God does not want him to act on his feelings. But believe me he is gay through and through and I have learned a lot from him. I was so set on my very conservative positions. But we all struggle in some area and what we need is truth but sometimes what we need more is love, caring, a listening ear, and long suffering with each other's struggles....
So long as he does not practice that lifestyle, then there is no sin. He can go to Heaven.
Sin is sin. Everytime we are off the mark as believers we sin, we ask forgiveness and move on. . . . But we all struggle in some area and what we need is truth but sometimes what we need moreis love, caring, a listening ear, and long suffering with each other's struggles....
I thought it best for Robin's edification to clear up his obvious confusion over what is the proper way to "love each other" (agape) . . . in contrast to his "tough love" nonsense. This highlight of driftwoodpoint's is on the mark . . . especially the long-suffering. The judgers and condemners and shunners . . . etc. show no understanding of true agape love whatsoever. They indulge their own desires to control, dominate and otherwise dictate to others under the cover of Biblical authority . . . but that is NOT Christian . . . that is "Biblean.".
Last edited by MysticPhD; 04-05-2009 at 05:44 PM..
If I may be permitted and I mean no disrespect to you and I realize that this is the Christian forum and that I am not a Christian but if you will allow me to make this observation. In my culture we also have homosexuals and have for thousands of years, so to us this is nothing new, we look upon them as it is their lifestyle and their choice, not ours, however we don't go about persecuting or condemning them, to us it is just like, and if you forgive the comparison, we look upon other religions and cultures, it is their lifestyle, does not mean that we have to be a part of it. I don't condemn nor do I condone that particular lifestyle, I tolerate it and that is all I do, it is not my lifestyle, I also don't worry about it, I have far more better things to do than worry about somebody else's lifestyle. Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to express this.
RobinD69, Some practical advice, if you don't mind, from an old retired minister. If you really care about the souls you feel are headed to hell because they are gay then show your love and concern in some practical way. Make friends. Visit when they're sick or take their trash out - something - anything. Once you establish that you are real and your love is real then maybe - just maybe - you will have a platform to speak to them.
Actually there are not very many openly gay people around here, but back in Virginia and Florida I knew a few and we actually got along rather well.
Quote:
If not you are just another voice in a vast sea of gay haters and persecutors throughout history. If not you are just a sounding brass and clanging cymbal.
That is the thing, I dont hate them. I dont like what they do, but I dont hate them.
Quote:
Here in the south Texas hill country where I live someone can still get beat up just for being gay. That's because straight men, like me, find the entire thing naturally repulsive. So, show you are different and that you really care for their souls. Prove it.
Quote:
Then you can report back here about your exploits and how you are reaching these souls for God.
Like I said I dont know of any openly gay people around here. I did come across a website that was calling for a secret infiltration and indoctrination but that is all.
Quote:
In the meantime I would also suggest (again - it's none of my business - but it's you who made it public) that you make sure you have completely forgiven the person who sodomized you and try to remember that the act wasn't done by a lifestyle or 'people group' it was done by an individual.
I forgave him a long time ago and I know homosexuality had nothing to do with what he did. My concern for the gay community is that they are following lies and promoting lies.
Quote:
I do appreciate your openness and honesty even though we don't see eye to eye on a lot of things.
I thank you and I understand alot of people around here dont see eye to eye.
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