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There are a couple of people on here who seem to believe that their doctrines concerning the Elect of God are the absolute correct doctrines. They also believe they are speaking on behalf of God, proclaiming "their" version of the truth as the absolute Truth. May God have mercy on them for proclaiming theirs as absolute, while belittling others who have not received what they have.
As far as the Elect go, we need to find out what is an Elect. In the English it is also the same word as chosen. When Jesus chose the twelve, He Elected them. But being called an Elect doesn't make one safe. Look at Judas. He was chosen, yet fell. So, by proclaiming yourself an Elect doesn't mean anything without Faith to endure to the end. Don't believe me? Ask Judas.
But back to the point of this Elect. How does one become an elect? Well, first you must be called. Notice before the disciples were elected, they were called to follow. ALL believers go through this. Otherwise, the carnal mind wants nothing to do with Spiritual things of God. They are enemies.
In Revelations those standing on the side of the Lamb were called, chosen, and faithful. Notice there are three things, in order. If I say I was called, does it mean anything without faith? No. If I say I have faith, does it mean anything unless I bear fruit of my calling? No. If I say I have faith, and have been called, does it mean anything unless I am chosen? No. Only God can set us apart from the world, and from the power of the evil one.
These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, elected, and faithful."
But to say that men who are not of God are automatically of the devil, is saying something to the Creator of men. It would mean that God and the devil are just playing a universal game of chess, seeing which pieces they can grab. Only God would be cheating because He already knows how the game ends. Do we think this little of the Creator?
So what do we do with the verses talking about "you are of your father the devil"? Could this simply mean the flesh? Since it already is set against the things of God? You know, the carnality vs. the spiritual. This would seem the most logical, since even those whom Jesus DID NOT Elect, were offered salvation by their faith. This would mean that, as disciples, His followers were being trained on how to obtain the Faith to endure to the end, having already been Called out of the world, and already having been Elected.
See, all this makes perfect sense to me. But this is how I believe. Do I type this to try and preach it to others? No. I type it to reassure others who may be doubting their own salvation by the false doctrines being portrayed by a few on this board. Keep the faith, enduring to the end, and the same shall be saved. We have this promise from our King. We must believe it, live it, and love it.
If you believe in the Creator of ALL, as the One and absolute God and Father. If you believe that Jesus was the Christ sent by God to redeem mankind for their transgressions, then you have been called. How do we KNOW this? Remember when Jesus asked His followers who do men say that I am? And Peter responded, the Christ? The Son of the Living God!
And Jesus said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Barjona, because flesh and blood did not reveal to you, but My Father who is in heaven.
That my friend, IS the calling. Otherwise, all this would seem as foolishness, to those who do not believe. Remember Paul saying that the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing? So, by being here, covered in the Blood of the Lamb, you have been called. Rest in this, and persevere to the end, in your Faith.
Judas was not the elect. Judas was a follower of Christ but he never believed Jesus to be the Messiah; not once did Judas call Jesus, the Son of God or the Messiah, my Lord or my God, it was always Rabbi. I can appreciate your position but your theology is a little inaccurate.
Judas was not the elect. Judas was a follower of Christ but he never believed Jesus to be the Messiah; not once did Judas call Jesus, the son of God or the messiah, it was always Rabbi
Elect are true Christians. PERIOD
Keep thinking in the racist way, Fundy. That is NOT what my King said, and for you to contradict Him? Be ashamed, and repent.
Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen(ELECTED) you twelve, and one of you is a devil? He spake of Judas Iscariot of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.
Keep thinking in the racist way, Fundy. That is NOT what my King said, and for you to contradict Him? Be ashamed, and repent.
Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen(ELECTED) you twelve, and one of you is a devil? He spake of Judas Iscariot of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve.
Thinking racist? Study scripture and find out who the elect are my beloved.
Judas was not the elect. Judas was a follower of Christ but he never believed Jesus to be the Messiah; not once did Judas call Jesus, the Son of God or the Messiah, my Lord or my God, it was always Rabbi. I can appreciate your position but your theology is a little inaccurate.
Elect are true Christians. PERIOD
Okay then fundie, then who are the elect according to you?
P.S. I think YOUR theology is inaccurate. And you think mine is. But I'm not going to say with absolute certainty that your theology IS inaccurate, because I am not God and not privy to all knowledge, and therefore subject to being wrong sometimes. The point I'm trying to make is that this post of yours and others come across as if you think that you are God's personal spokeperson to us and to doubt what you say is to doubt God. No offense but that is how it comes across.
Thinking racist? Study scripture and find out who the elect are my beloved.
The elect MUST BELIEVE......Judas never believed
I just showed you that he was an elect. Does scripture now lie? Are you telling me that he never witnessed any miracles? Are you telling me that? Are you telling me that he was never chosen? Are you telling me that? How could he not believe? Did not the riches of this life seem more appealing to him, than the riches of the next?
Even Peter stumbled in his faith, for he denied the Savior. Did he fall and then repent? YES! Because Judas fell, and never sought out repentence, he was condemned to suffer his fate. Peter's faith was made stronger, even to death upside down on the cross.
There is a difference between stumbling over the Rock and being broken, and the Rock making us whole again, and being crushed into dust by the same Rock. Judas was crushed, Peter was broken. Both were elected, sorry. One had faith to endure to the end, and the other sought his own glory and riches now in the flesh.
I just showed you that he was an elect. Does scripture now lie? Are you telling me that he never witnessed any miracles? Are you telling me that? Are you telling me that he was never chosen? Are you telling me that?
Even Peter stumbled in his faith, for he denied the Savior. Did he fall and then repent? YES! Because Judas fell, and never sought out repentence, he was condemned to suffer his fate. Peter's faith was made stronger, even to death upside down on the cross.
There is a difference between stumbling over the Rock and being broken, and the Rock making us whole again, and being crushed into dust by the same Rock. Judas was crushed, Peter was broken. Both were elected, sorry. One had faith to endure to the end, and the other sought his own glory and riches now in the flesh.
We see this all around us every day.
SHEEP AND THE GOATS
I said Judas was a follower of Christ; even Jesus spoke of people like Judas in the parable of the sower. Peter gets a bad rap; Peter never left Jesus; oh he denied him but he never left his side which is how he saw Jesus look at him when the rooster sounded but the other disciples took off hiding, no where to be found.
John said it best in this verse.
(1 John 2:19) 19 They went out from us, but they did not really belong to us. For if they had belonged to us, they would have remained with us; but their going showed that none of them belonged to us.
Last edited by Fundamentalist; 07-08-2009 at 08:42 AM..
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God bless.
