Near Westside and University Circle Property Values 2009-2015 (Cleveland: home, neighborhoods)

[C-rob2727]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Is there anything to back up your claim that people are moving to Cuyahoga county from lake or medina?

Also I said public schools. So hawken, great. Also not public and very expensive. I mean, I agree that private is the way to go, even if public schools were "good". But are you seriously suggesting that Cleveland public schools are good? What about Cleveland heights? Garfield? Maple? Euclid? Etc. Public school quality overall is (and has been) declining.

The three high performing schools are CMSD. I wasn't including Hawken because they just started to build it. It's still a sign of the times. Don't cha think people buying 500k homes can afford private schools???? Especially when they're not paying ANY property taxes. Has the light flipped on yet?

[C-rob2727]

Cleveland's inner city is growing faster than its suburbs as young adults flock downtown


Cleveland's inner city is growing faster than its suburbs as young adults flock downtown | cleveland.com

Cleveland's among a group of cities outperforming their outlying suburban areas in attracting 'educated millennials'

http://www.crainscleveland.com/artic...their-outlying




Mapping brain gain and loss: New study charts changing faces of Cleveland, Cuyahoga County



Mapping brain gain and loss: New study charts changing faces of Cleveland, Cuyahoga County | cleveland.com

[C-rob2727]

"In my view, in the '70s, '80s and '90s, simply no one wanted to live in the city, particularly after the Glenville and Hough riots. Black or white, why live in a chaotic area?" Krumholz asked. "Now with the influx of several thousand people, mostly white and (working) in eds and meds, the city has become a more desirable place. It is architecturally distinct. And it's not as violent as before."

Marous's family-owned company is working on its last two sites within Battery Park itself. One will go for an 82-suite apartment building that will rise five stories Vintage plans to build this year after closing a $12 million financing package. Another site will go later for 42 condos in a multistory building — as much as lenders will consider.
However, demand is such that Vintage with its next phase of 20 townhouses will jump to a site on the northeast side of West 73rd. About 30 people are on waiting lists to see the yet-to-rise project, he said. Marous bought that land years ago for when Battery Park proper sites were exhausted. Now it's doing master planning for other sites it has acquired farther south on 73rd's east side.
It's eye-opening the developer is starting to move beyond the one-time home of an Energizer Battery plant, which created a 13-acre site for redevelopment.
Although land prices are rising, none of the local development corporations, Marous or other developers believe there will be any shortage of sites or even demand for more projects.


http://www.crainscleveland.com/artic...velopment-boom


Where DO you think these people are moving in from??? Please post something as evidence that I'm wrong. I know, I know bubble, crash, bust BLAH! I'll wait..

[bjimmy24]

So I haven't seen any evidence that people are leaving other counties to move into Cleveland. Ok, some young people are moving downtown (almost certainly temporarily). Where do they go in 5 or 10 years?

3 public schools? Out of how many?

City of Cleveland and Cuyahoga county is still shrinking. Where are they all going? Huge parts of Cleveland are either vacant or crime ridden (to he fair, mostly east side). This is a problem.

[C-rob2727]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

So I haven't seen any evidence that people are leaving other counties to move into Cleveland. Ok, some young people are moving downtown (almost certainly temporarily). Where do they go in 5 or 10 years?

3 public schools? Out of how many?

City of Cleveland and Cuyahoga county is still shrinking. Where are they all going? Huge parts of Cleveland are either vacant or crime ridden (to he fair, mostly east side). This is a problem.

More false statements. People are moving into Duck Island, Tremont, Ohio City, Gordon Sq, Downtown, University Circle and Little Italy.

3 public schools near ME are very good with more on the way. How many do most suburbs have????

Look I get it, you don't believe me. maybe believe the LARGE national developers investing 350million from w25th to w117th.

What do you get out of trolling and basically calling me a liar? I've presented tons of facts to back up my statements. You haven't provided ANY evidence to the contrary, you just troll from Boston.

[C-rob2727]

he's referring to the near westside

"Now with the influx of several thousand people, mostly white and (working) in eds and meds, the city has become a more desirable place. It is architecturally distinct.

http://www.crainscleveland.com/artic...velopment-boom

[C-rob2727]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

So I haven't seen any evidence that people are leaving other counties to move into Cleveland. Ok, some young people are moving downtown (almost certainly temporarily). Where do they go in 5 or 10 years?

We are moving into the city neighborhoods instead of the suburbs. 10k people lived in Downtown in 2012, there will be 17k by the end of this year. As the downtown base grows so will the neighboring neighborhoods.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by C-rob2727

More false statements. People are moving into Duck Island, Tremont, Ohio City, Gordon Sq, Downtown, University Circle and Little Italy.

3 public schools near ME are very good with more on the way. How many do most suburbs have????

Look I get it, you don't believe me. maybe believe the LARGE national developers investing 350million from w25th to w117th.

What do you get out of trolling and basically calling me a liar? I've presented tons of facts to back up my statements. You haven't provided ANY evidence to the contrary, you just troll from Boston.

Wow. You are being way sensitive about this. I fully understand that Cleveland has several growing neighborhoods. That doesn't mean the city is growing (it's not, nor is the county). Concentrated growth in a minority of areas is happening, but it's scope is thus far quite limited compared to the whole. Why do you ignore that? And yeah, 3 public schools are great. Let's say I grant that they are best in the state. Still- out or how many? This is a simple question.

All I asked for is some kind of evidence that people are moving from lake or medina to Cuyahoga (at a larger rate than vice versa). That's all. Then you accuse me of trolling and lying? Ok. I don't know how to take that. But it certainly doesn't look good on you. I guess you missed my thread about my exciting upcoming trip to Cleveland (where I am from by the way). I hope clevelanders aren't all like this nowadays.

Also, for all the people who accuse me of being a Cleveland homer, I guess keep this thread in mind.

[C-rob2727]

Adrian Byrne, a real estate consultant who is chairman of the Cleveland chapter of the Urban Land Institute development trade group, said developers are responding in the neighborhoods to the 5% vacancy rate in the expanding downtown rental market.

[j_ws]

We need that strawman guy to come back and school us.

There are a lot of variables that could define Cleveland's future sustainability.

If we can invest more in housing that appeals to broader demographics a lot of the potentially temporary population can be retained.

If increased tax revenue can be channeled into a rapid improvement in schools, more families might be willing to stay. Granted, there are families in all demographics moving here and remaining, but there are a lot we could still lose. I have a lot of hope for the specialized high schools that are going to be coming online. As has been pointed out elsewhere, the existing models have actually done very well. Unfortunately, they aren't benefiting the majority of students because of their limited capacities.

C-rob's observations are correct in terms of the growing neighborhoods, and bjimmy is also correct in terms of certain neighborhoods, the city, and the county still losing population.

In a lot of scenarios where Cleveland grows or stabilizes, surrounding suburbs lose. It's unlikely we'll see a net population gain for the county unless there were some massive outside population/demographic/migration shifts on a national, or at least multi-regional scale. Cleveland's best bet is to convince people to move back to the city as even though there may be some influx of new residents to support a knowledge economy, the city is still losing uneducated and lower-skilled workers. So while you may see growth by certain metrics, there is a net loss. You could essentially take everyone from North Olmsted, North Ridgeville, and any similar suburbs and relocate their entire populations to Kinsman, Mt Pleasant, Lee-Miles, Buckeye-Shaker, etc. and the city still wouldn't be at capacity.