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So degrees from many European universities are worthless then? How about my school in the US that made it into the top 75 (i know, rankings are never objective) despite attendance being mandatory only for 1 of my classes?
A degree is worthless if you have bad grades and if you do not study hard. Going to class does not ensure good grades or a good degree.
If someone can study the same stuff at home better - what's the big deal? He can still do good on exams, homework and papers.
College should make the students more independent and teach them how to acquire knowledge by yourself. Taking them by their hands by forcing them to class like high school students is not always favorable, especially not in the sciences. In the real world no one will tell you which chapter to read, which book to buy or where to gather information.
If you are in college does your professor or teaching assistant take attendence? If so, what is the maximum number of absences in relation to the total number of classes? Do you feel taking attendence is really necessary? Or should a student be able to just read the class materials and show up only when he/she wishes or when there is a test.
It depends. Certain courses have 100 points (700 or 800 total) for attendance. Even one absence will affect the grade, and those points are necessary if the student wants his/her A.
Other courses allow 1 absence, after the 3rd one is automatic F.
For science classes, if the student fails one lab, he/she gets an F for lab and lecture.
The instructors say that they're taking attendance because for financial aid records and to have proof that a certain student didn't care until last week of school so he/she deserves the bad grade. I was surprised to see that a certain amount of students ask for appointments with Deans, etc. to complain that instructors weren't fair or think that they deserve a good grade just for enrolling. Excessive entitlement.
College is not mandatory. If you want to approve, you need to obey the rules. As simple as that. If instructors are kind of severe it's because too many students have tried to take some advantage in the past
So degrees from many European universities are worthless then? How about my school in the US that made it into the top 75 (i know, rankings are never objective) despite attendance being mandatory only for 1 of my classes?
A degree is worthless if you have bad grades and if you do not study hard. Going to class does not ensure good grades or a good degree.
If someone can study the same stuff at home better - what's the big deal? He can still do good on exams, homework and papers.
College should make the students more independent and teach them how to acquire knowledge by yourself. Taking them by their hands by forcing them to class like high school students is not always favorable, especially not in the sciences. In the real world no one will tell you which chapter to read, which book to buy or where to gather information.
I didn't say places with mandatory attendance, I said places where you don't need to show up to class - there is a difference. If you're supposed to be learning everything on your own and coming to class isn't necessary, then what are you paying for? You aren't benefitting at all from being in college, you're essentially paying for a piece of paper and doing what you could do on your own in the library. One benefit of college is supposed to be that you have an experienced and educated instructor that conveys ideas and encourages discussion that you can't get just by reading the book. If you are at a school where it's possible to pass the class without needing to show up to class then obviously the quality of education is lacking. Somebody isn't doing their job. It's not "taking their hands and forcing them," it's getting what you pay for. Someone who went to a school where class attendance was required to do well (not forced by the professors) has a much more valuable degree than someone who's class was so easy that they didn't need to show up because they learned more. They engaged with other students, had experience with applying their knowledge and benefitted from the expertise of their professor. So I'll say it again: If you don't need to show up then it isn't a worthwhile education.
Many factors really. It could depend on how well you think you can absorb the material on your own, how easy or hard the teacher is, and of course your teacher's policies on absences.
I disagree with the notion that because you skip a lot you're lazy or dead set on failing though. Some people do have learning styles that negate the need for extensive lectures to absorb understanding of a topic. Therefore, they may get better results with self study that they might never achieve from lecture.
When I was in college back with Betsy Ross, et al, you had to attend the nursing clinicals for a certain number of hours. You didn't miss unless you were legitimately sick, and after you missed a certain number, you had to make up the time. I'm pretty sure the science labs had required attendance too. Sometimes in lecture classes, they would cover material not in the book, so it was to one's benefit to attend. Some teachers were more like that than others.
At my school, which is a small liberal arts school with around 15-20 people per class, if you miss a certain number of classes you receive a failing grade unless you can prove it was for a doctor's visit.
The old college system needs to be wiped out today. Every professor except for those who teach the science labs and medical technology labs need to be wiped out of their jobs. All other professor jobs need to be off-shored immediately. Everything needs to be online. That is the wave of the future. The old college system is extremely antiquated and virtually useless. Professors of the old have done nothing but harass and swindle money from clueless unthinking brainwashed students. If they want students to "learn on their own" then get rid of the bumbling lazy buffoons (i.e., tenured professors) and off-shore their positions to India, Mexico, Canada, Japan, Britain, Australia, etc. We all have adequate enough technology to do this.
How terrible and antithetical. So much for "liberal arts." You can't even do things your own way which is the core emphasis of "liberal" and "arts."
Quote:
Originally Posted by brinkofsunshine
At my school, which is a small liberal arts school with around 15-20 people per class, if you miss a certain number of classes you receive a failing grade unless you can prove it was for a doctor's visit.
How terrible and antithetical. So much for "liberal arts." You can't even do things your own way which is the core emphasis of "liberal" and "arts."
Yea not exactly, but nice try at bashing. Small, prestigious liberal arts institutions want you to actually get an education, which is why they require you to come to class. What a concept! Not being one of 300 in a lecture hall where the professor doesn't know your name and couldn't care less if you attend class or not. Sounds like a great environment to learn.
Not everyone learns the same. People are individuals. And I personally loathe collectivism. You are a college student. Shouldn't you be doing your sociology homework instead of wasting your time on this forum?
Quote:
Originally Posted by socstudent
Yea not exactly, but nice try at bashing. Small, prestigious liberal arts institutions want you to actually get an education, which is why they require you to come to class. What a concept! Not being one of 300 in a lecture hall where the professor doesn't know your name and couldn't care less if you attend class or not. Sounds like a great environment to learn.
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