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Thanks for the replies! It baffled me why my diploma said Computer Science, highest level math were a introduction to Calculus, and two physics classes if that counts. As for programming skills, I've learned a little Flash, Java, and HTML but nothing too extensive. Heck, I used to have my own website I've put together and maintained for years but none of the flashyness that websites have today. It's my own fault for not keeping up so my methods are out of date, I feel that programming isn't my forte to begin with as extensive as it is. I did enjoy website building, as I felt more in tune with it for doing it so long.
I don't see much of a job market for website builders anymore, that died a long time ago and left for the freelancers like when the graphic designer balloon popped. I've trained using 3Ds Max and Maya, two heavyweight 3D programs used for TV, movies, and videogames but I've soon realized I was only "taught" the minimum and I'd have to pay out of pocket for upgrades and as quick as technology changes, my methods became obsolete just after graduation. I shot myself in the foot for not getting any internship during school, I didn't get a shot at a real world experience in my career field and I think that also hurt my chances at finding work.
It's a very competitive field as it is, very tough to get in and now I'm seeing too many jobs disappear or lowballed.
Though I've heard of them, I can't think of any college that actually offers one.
Princeton, Rutgers, John Hopkins, Drexel, GWU, University of Delaware, Lehigh U all have bachelors of arts in CS if I recall correctly. Most offer a BS option as well, of course.
Thanks for the replies! It baffled me why my diploma said Computer Science, highest level math were a introduction to Calculus, and two physics classes if that counts. As for programming skills, I've learned a little Flash, Java, and HTML but nothing too extensive. Heck, I used to have my own website I've put together and maintained for years but none of the flashyness that websites have today. It's my own fault for not keeping up so my methods are out of date, I feel that programming isn't my forte to begin with as extensive as it is. I did enjoy website building, as I felt more in tune with it for doing it so long.
I don't see much of a job market for website builders anymore, that died a long time ago and left for the freelancers like when the graphic designer balloon popped. I've trained using 3Ds Max and Maya, two heavyweight 3D programs used for TV, movies, and videogames but I've soon realized I was only "taught" the minimum and I'd have to pay out of pocket for upgrades and as quick as technology changes, my methods became obsolete just after graduation. I shot myself in the foot for not getting any internship during school, I didn't get a shot at a real world experience in my career field and I think that also hurt my chances at finding work.
It's a very competitive field as it is, very tough to get in and now I'm seeing too many jobs disappear or lowballed.
CS programs have little focus on programming languages and development/content creation tools. Your (lack of) math requirements are quite baffling, however.
I don't see much of a job market for website builders anymore, that died a long time ago and left for the freelancers like when the graphic designer balloon popped. I've trained using 3Ds Max and Maya, two heavyweight 3D programs used for TV, movies, and videogames but I've soon realized I was only "taught" the minimum and I'd have to pay out of pocket for upgrades and as quick as technology changes, my methods became obsolete just after graduation. I shot myself in the foot for not getting any internship during school, I didn't get a shot at a real world experience in my career field and I think that also hurt my chances at finding work.
My son is working on a Computer Science degree from the College of Engineering at our local University,
he has had to take tons of Math - I think he is up to Calculus III right now.
05-29-2012, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by user_id
None of this sounds like Computer Science....
++
I'm not sure what I'd call that, but certainly not CS. It doesn't seem like that education leaves one qualified for much of anything, really.
To the OP: where did you go to school? Is it accredited?
It's a bit puzzling to me how one could possibly be "baffled" by what their major was. Presumably the student chose the major?
Well, I deserve to get made fun of because I just didn't know better.
It was the Art Institute. A for-profit college that offered a course in Computer Animation, they did require Calculus and Physics so they can get away with slapping CS on the degree. They're "accredited", but probably through the same guys from the Apollo group. I'm not too proud of it, but at the same time too stubborn to drop out.
There is nothing wrong with the Art Institutes, but its an arts college and they don't offer computer science degrees. What was your degree? Computer Animation? Game Design?
There are plenty of jobs available in computer graphics and your portfolio is going to matter more than where you went to school. For example, Blizzard is hiring numerous graphics related positions:
Your issue isn't a lack of jobs, its that you have a lack of experience and that is something you're going to have to work on. An art degree is almost useless outside of art related careers.
Here are some things I've learned about having a BS in CS and hopefully a career.
Programmers are a dime a dozen thanks to the zillions of people in India and China who have been trained since age 10 to crank out code. Mediocracy abounds. They cannot think outside the box. They are literally code slaves.
People with knowledge of various programming technologies (dot net, J2EE, Xcode, etc...) who can COMMUNICATE, INNOVATE, and THINK OF SOLUTIONS OUTSIDE THE BOX are what makes American and European IT Professionals so valuable. Corporations cannot outsource intelligence, creativity, and innovation. And from what I've seen, worked with, and experienced, that is not currently a threat from the 3rd world. So try to sell yourself to employers on those qualities. Most important to me as an employer now, the ability to communicate is the most valuable quality I look for, and I've yet to see that quality from ANY coders from those two places.
Learning Flash animator can be a perfect career focus, if that's what turns you on. You can really prove yourself with Flash. I'm learning CS6 now just for fun. It now comes with mobile templates, wow!
One last thing about the IT industry: You will NEVER be done learning. To be successful you must absolutely stay abreast of technology that moves quickly these days. There is no relaxing in this field. You gotta love it, imo, to succeed. I've taken classes annually to update my skills for many years, and you know what? I become obsolete if I rest for 6 months! It's insane and I hate it, but I also love the field and I refuse to give up my creative passion because of the competition to outsourcing. Believe in yourself man. That should be rule no. 1. Good luck.
If you want to try to get into actual code development instead of focusing on animation, here are some comments. First, a lot of people start to get into programming because they want to write computer games. That can be fun, and it certainly has some opportunity, but it's also probably one of the lowest-paid type of programmer at the entry level precisely because so many people wanted to do it. If you go that route, realize there are basically three ways to make decent money doing that: 1) Start work at a newer company that hasn't yet released a blockbuster game but that plans to, making sure you get some sort of equity or options. This is hard to do as an entry-level worker. 2) Work for some years for low pay, but always looking to pitch in and learn as much about the whole process as possible and then leave the company with some friends and start your own gaming company. 3) Make your name in the industry by playing key roles in game development and then take a senior leadership role in a larger, established company.
I've seen people do all three, but none are easy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by coldPlay
Here are some things I've learned about having a BS in CS and hopefully a career.
Programmers are a dime a dozen thanks to the zillions of people in India and China who have been trained since age 10 to crank out code. Mediocracy abounds. They cannot think outside the box. They are literally code slaves.
People with knowledge of various programming technologies (dot net, J2EE, Xcode, etc...) who can COMMUNICATE, INNOVATE, and THINK OF SOLUTIONS OUTSIDE THE BOX
...
I have a degree my college called a BS in Systems, major in Sociology. It was something like majoring in sociology and taking a computer science minor. I had to take two levels of statistics and calculus and a number of programming classes, but if I'd been a computer science major there would have been advanced calculus and even more advanced programming classes.
At any rate, I'm in the industry now partially because of when I graduated (1996), but mostly because of that last paragraph: you have to innovate, communicate and think outside the box.
And that applies not only to when you have the job, but how you get a job. You have to know what your skills are, what your limitations are, and then you have to sell what you can deliver. Now, I'm not telling you to make things up - a lot of people think just promising anything to get in the door is a good strategy - let me make it perfectly clear that that is a TERRIBLE strategy. Any company worth working for will be able to sniff out lies and exaggerations. That's not the first impression you want to make. So figure out what you can do, and then sell that hard, don't try to get their attention with things you can't back up. You will be rejected by a lot of places, but some of the people you talk to will be willing to offer advice and strategies on finding work. You might be surprised by that, but even managers at companies that don't think you're a good fit for them will be willing to suggest other places or types of work to look for leads. Like I said - you have to be creative even before you get the job.
Quote:
Originally Posted by coldPlay
One last thing about the IT industry: You will NEVER be done learning. To be successful you must absolutely stay abreast of technology that moves quickly these days. There is no relaxing in this field. You gotta love it, imo, to succeed. I've taken classes annually to update my skills for many years, and you know what? I become obsolete if I rest for 6 months! It's insane and I hate it, but I also love the field and I refuse to give up my creative passion because of the competition to outsourcing. Believe in yourself man. That should be rule no. 1. Good luck.
This is very true, particularly if you want to be a developers. I would say it's not *quite* that fast-paced everywhere, but certainly it can be. If you focus on a few big concepts, fitting in the new ones isn't as daunting as it sounds. There are also niche areas where you can become a subject matter expert. The main problem with that is that eventually niches get replaced and then, if you haven't kept up with at least the broad trends, you'll be screwed.
I would recommend a few things for a new grad, if you want to at least be able to talk about something to get your foot in the door:
0) Learn to work within an IDE. Use Eclipse if you don't already have a favorite. They save you a lot of time.
1) Learn a major object-oriented language, and learn it well. Java is obviously a big one, but C++ or C# are also good alternatives. Remember that at early stages *concepts* are more important than specific techniques.
2) Learn about operating system fundamentals by running a Linux PC or virtual machine at home. Learn to use the editor vi or vim. Don't just treat your Linux install - whether it's a separate machine or just a virtual machine - like a PC, read about what it actually does, and play around with it. Run an instance of Apache web server on it if you've never done that before. If you're ambitious, consider writing some deployable web applications and set up Tomcat (an Apache-based application server that's free) to deploy them with. Run mySQL (a free database program) on your Linux box to use as the backend for your web application. MySQL isn't Oracle, but it is a serious database commonly used in the web industry. Install either Subversion or Git version control systems and learn how to tie your IDE into them.
Even if you don't have work experience, if you can talk about those based on having actually done those things, you'll come across better in interviews.
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