D-FW housing market gets bad marks for soaring prices (Dallas: best neighborhood, to rent)

[Rakin]

Originally Posted by octo

I don't understand this hype.

a quick search in the popular suburbs for SFH <$300k yields:

You are not seeing what's "Active" (not under contract) but what must include homes under contract that still show up in the system.

A quick search directly in the MLS shows in the 200-300k price range.....

36 Homes in Plano
12 Homes in Allen
5 homes in Flower Mound
6 Homes in Coppell

Don't go by Internet sites where you don't understand the status of properties to get your numbers.

[serger]

Originally Posted by synchronicity

The key words there are "Collin County". Where exactly in CC are they looking? Because CC is the hot happening "IT" place for the most part, mainly Plano, Frisco, Allen and McKinney.

Also, the comment about "it needs updating". What kind of "updating" are we talking about? How old is the house? DFW isn't just "cheaper than NY/LA/Chi/SF Bay", it's cheaper than pretty much every top 20 metro in the US (other than maybe Houston, I guess). I could dig into the data and post that.

I get that people in DFW are upset that housing is going up and that it's not easy to buy a house, especially in "desirable areas". But, it's even more difficult pretty much every place else (well, every place else that's a good sized city). Again, there is no god-given right to paying under 200K for a decent-sized, updated house in one of the "hot" areas of the Metro. Almost all (all?) of CC is top 5 to top 25 high schools out of the 140+ publics in the metro area. Those aren't just "good" schools, they're very good schools to excellent schools.

It stinks , but the reality that one can't get as much house for their money as they'd hoped isn't new. Same thing happened to me in 2004 up north (and that house was in much more "average" place than our current home). You see the market, face the reality, and deal with it. At least I didn't go into that assuming wondrous price appreciation going forward (my comments back then were an assumption of ZERO appreication over the next 5 years, given the market. 5 years later I chuckled at being foolish enough to think my house would at least keep its value).

Metro areas on the coasts were/are/will be more expensive, for obvious reasons. The question is about the differential, it used to be much more.



BTW, not much difference between Chicago metro and Dallas.

Infographic: Q4 2014 Metro Area Home Prices | realtor.org

[veuvegirl]

Originally Posted by synchronicity

The key words there are "Collin County". Where exactly in CC are they looking? Because CC is the hot happening "IT" place for the most part, mainly Plano, Frisco, Allen and McKinney.

Also, the comment about "it needs updating". What kind of "updating" are we talking about? How old is the house? DFW isn't just "cheaper than NY/LA/Chi/SF Bay", it's cheaper than pretty much every top 20 metro in the US (other than maybe Houston, I guess). I could dig into the data and post that.

I get that people in DFW are upset that housing is going up and that it's not easy to buy a house, especially in "desirable areas". But, it's even more difficult pretty much every place else (well, every place else that's a good sized city). Again, there is no god-given right to paying under 200K for a decent-sized, updated house in one of the "hot" areas of the Metro. Almost all (all?) of CC is top 5 to top 25 high schools out of the 140+ publics in the metro area. Those aren't just "good" schools, they're very good schools to excellent schools.

It stinks , but the reality that one can't get as much house for their money as they'd hoped isn't new. Same thing happened to me in 2004 up north (and that house was in much more "average" place than our current home). You see the market, face the reality, and deal with it. At least I didn't go into that assuming wondrous price appreciation going forward (my comments back then were an assumption of ZERO appreication over the next 5 years, given the market. 5 years later I chuckled at being foolish enough to think my house would at least keep its value).

Two different questions. Friends are looking in Allen, Frisco, Plano and Mckinney. All three 'it places'.

For me, updating when we were looking was the entire house. New bathrooms, kitchen and flooring. Not something that was necessary, but what I wanted in a house. I would absolutely put the money into it, if I was 100% sure getting it back. This of course, is my personal 'want'.

[octo]

Originally Posted by Rakin

You are not seeing what's "Active" (not under contract) but what must include homes under contract that still show up in the system.

A quick search directly in the MLS shows in the 200-300k price range.....

36 Homes in Plano
12 Homes in Allen
5 homes in Flower Mound
6 Homes in Coppell

Don't go by Internet sites where you don't understand the status of properties to get your numbers.

Realtor.com shows a lot more than that as new and active.

I trust that more than your unsubstantiated claim. Especially because you have an economic interest in a hot market.

[synchronicity]

Originally Posted by serger

Metro areas on the coasts were/are/will be more expensive, for obvious reasons. The question is about the differential, it used to be much more.



BTW, not much difference between Chicago metro and Dallas.

Infographic: Q4 2014 Metro Area Home Prices | realtor.org

A) thanks for the data, I'll have to add it to the hopper of sources for this stuff. Surprising to see as little difference in median home sale pricesbetween Chi and DFW 4q14, although if you average the last 5 quarters the difference is a little larger (8.2% instead of 2.9% higher). That said, it's still closer than I expected.

B) as previously noted, one of the main sources I look to for home price appreciation is Case-Schiller, and although it shows DFW over the last decade as being one of the strongest markets (behind only Portland OR out of the 20, due mainly to avoiding the worst of the downturn), over the last 3 years (which is the time frame it seems most people are concerned about here) it's been below the median in appreciation. So the differential from 10 years ago is lower, but the differential from 3 years ago is higher.

I will note that last 3 years, Boston, Chicago, Charlotte, Cleveland, NYC and DC have all lagged, so the differential has dropped there (Never noticed, but it appears Philadelphia isn't one of the 20 they track. Hmm...). However the West Coast has been going like gangbusters.

Anyway, it's a good discussion and all. I also get the general idea that rapid appreciation in home prices has both positive and negative impacts, with the latter possibly including impacts on income and wealth inequality, but that's a much larger ranging issue that probably belongs on a different thread if not a different forum.

[happycrow]

Octo,

::flag::
Ad-hominem, character assassination without supporting evidence, fifteen yards. First down.

There is a tremendous difference between "realtywebz" and active MLS listings, Octo. If there weren't, nobody in RE would bother with the latter, and if you're not involved in RE, lemme tell you, updated active-MLS listings are a much-sought commodity. Right now anybody at my income level, let alone median-income level, will be lucky to get into anything built after 1980 unless they're being house-poor or fiscally irresponsible.

As to "hot" spots or not, when the other side of the debate happily considers an entire county off-limits to everyday schmoes like yours truly, I consider that Quod Est Demonstrandum.

[NP78]

Originally Posted by serger

Metro areas on the coasts were/are/will be more expensive, for obvious reasons. The question is about the differential, it used to be much more.

Define "used to", because as synchronicity notes, home price appreciation in DFW has actually slightly lagged the large metro average over the last 3 years. As you extend the time frame back to before the downturn, DFW's numbers are stronger because they didn't see the large drop that other markets took.

[serger]

Originally Posted by NP78

Define "used to", because as synchronicity notes, home price appreciation in DFW has actually slightly lagged the large metro average over the last 3 years. As you extend the time frame back to before the downturn, DFW's numbers are stronger because they didn't see the large drop that other markets took.

Well, for instance, during the previous boom in house prices, median in W. Plano was probably about 1/2 of the median in Torrance (I took Torrance because of all this talk about certain company relocation). Now they are probably about equal or close.

(Of course, the median house In Plano is much bigger).

[Aceraceae]

Originally Posted by serger

Well, for instance, during the previous boom in house prices, median in W. Plano was probably about 1/2 of the median in Torrance (I took Torrance because of all this talk about certain company relocation). Now they are probably about equal or close.

(Of course, the median house In Plano is much bigger).

I'd like to see some actual data regarding this median home price claim.

[serger]

Originally Posted by Aceraceae

I'd like to see some actual data regarding this median home price claim.

Well, there are web sites, but I don't really want to argue which ones are more reliable or correct. And how dependable is the historical data.

But as a rough estimate, you could check for instance the total total number of houses for sale in 75093 on realtor.com (even though many of these are already in contract as discussed in other threads), and then move the upper or lower price range to see where the midpoint is. Then the same for Torrance. You'll find both midpoints pretty close. Again that's just a rough estimate.