Downtown Denver has gone so down hill (Ovid: appointed, to live)
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This is really sad. Like it or not, Denver bet the ranch on downtown since the 90s, that's the focus of infrastructure and investment and the draw of the city, much more than the suburbs. But with a failing transit agency and increasing continual plague of subpar vibes for locals and visitors alike, there's not too bright of a horizon for the core. The downtown a big reason why I left Denver and why I won't go back (even though I'd now have the salary to afford a decent lifestyle). It's not a great city experience for the premium price tag. My hope is to go remote and go to the western slope or a mountain town, working on getting that job now .
I do think there will be less homeless in 10-20 years. The rate of fatal drug overdoses is astronomical, and a disproportionate number of these are homeless individuals. That alone will reduce the numbers down significantly. And weed is essentially everywhere in the US now so to the extent that was a draw for vagrants, it's gone.
Denver is NOT like all cities. The homeless aren't endemic, they're migrants who came for the cultural experience. If they weren't sprouted locally, fixing things like home prices won't make them disappear. And there are cities in the US, like Greeneville SC, which really don't have a homeless presence.
Greenville actually has signs all over that discourages feeding the homeless. They have a link to donate elsewhere to help.
Denver is like all cities. An increase in real estate prices and more homeless. When you ignore issues for forty years this is what you get. I haven't been to one US city that doesn't experience the same issues that are discussed in the forum. Denver is like all US cities. Under funded. I drove for RTD for three years. I've seen everything. People just trying to survive. Not sure that I agree with the assessments on this forum. I ride my bike on Cherry Creek Trail all the time. No issues.
People weren't living in tents as recently as 2015, and Denver hasn't ignored or underfunded homelessness. Mayor Hickenlooper had a program to end homelessness and this article says Denver homeless funding has "rocketed." According to the Gazette article linked to, Denver and the greater metro area have been spending $70,000 per homeless person per year.
This would be a non-starter in frugal Indianapolis. Granted, the cold, wet winters discourage homeless from flocking here, but so does the fact that we don't recruit them. The city offers them $10 an hour to pick up trash downtown and our main mission's vision for them is to sober up, find Jesus and re-build their lives. The city has put more emphasis on mental health services and increased the number of police. Indy's homeless population is actually down from last year--and yes, housing prices have risen sharply, although they're nowhere near Denver levels. So--I disagree that Denver's homeless problem is something that comes with being a large city or that the answer is more money and services.
This is really sad. Like it or not, Denver bet the ranch on downtown since the 90s, that's the focus of infrastructure and investment and the draw of the city, much more than the suburbs. But with a failing transit agency and increasing continual plague of subpar vibes for locals and visitors alike, there's not too bright of a horizon for the core. The downtown a big reason why I left Denver and why I won't go back (even though I'd now have the salary to afford a decent lifestyle). It's not a great city experience for the premium price tag. My hope is to go remote and go to the western slope or a mountain town, working on getting that job now .
I do think there will be less homeless in 10-20 years. The rate of fatal drug overdoses is astronomical, and a disproportionate number of these are homeless individuals. That alone will reduce the numbers down significantly. And weed is essentially everywhere in the US now so to the extent that was a draw for vagrants, it's gone.
Denver is NOT like all cities. The homeless aren't endemic, they're migrants who came for the cultural experience. If they weren't sprouted locally, fixing things like home prices won't make them disappear. And there are cities in the US, like Greeneville SC, which really don't have a homeless presence.
If things are so dim for Denver and its future why has it been one of the fastest growing big cities? If Denver's downtown is dragging things down so much, why are rents and housing prices outside of downtown doing so well. Nobody compares things in Denver to Greeneville, that's mindless.
Hey we get it, you and a lot of other posters don't like what Denver has become. Hence the need to always pile onto these types of threads. Denver posts get almost no activity unless someone brings up something negative and then all the former residents come throw out the how horrible it is there story. And its never put into proper context like incomes are rising, employment continues to grow unabated and the economy remains about as diverse as you'll find. No, its always about how things were great back in XXXX but the things I liked about that time are no longer happening so that must mean that Denver sucks.
Denver is like all cities. An increase in real estate prices and more homeless. When you ignore issues for forty years this is what you get. I haven't been to one US city that doesn't experience the same issues that are discussed in the forum. Denver is like all US cities. Under funded. I drove for RTD for three years. I've seen everything. People just trying to survive. Not sure that I agree with the assessments on this forum. I ride my bike on Cherry Creek Trail all the time. No issues.
I agree that same problems we're seeing in Denver are also serious issues nationwide: a rise in homelessness and crime due to a variety of reasons, including rising rents, a shrinking safety net, decades of cutbacks in mental health services and almost 3 years of a destabilizing pandemic. Yes, we see the results to a much greater extent than we used to.
(I wonder if the people who are so shocked by it are people who live in suburbs or smaller metro areas, and don't know this is what's going on in MANY cities? They haven't seen this problem grow, the way we who live in Denver do?)
But that doesn't mean the city is going down hill. The city is growing, it's a destination for young people and businesses: these are not the signs of a city in decline.
And parallel to that infamous #15 is the #20 bus from downtown to the Anschutz Medical Center, a bus filled with young researchers, nurses, medical students (and well behaved high schoolers from DSA and DSST). Sane riders, decent buses. Not all of RTD sucks.
If things are so dim for Denver and its future why has it been one of the fastest growing big cities? If Denver's downtown is dragging things down so much, why are rents and housing prices outside of downtown doing so well. Nobody compares things in Denver to Greeneville, that's mindless.
Hey we get it, you and a lot of other posters don't like what Denver has become. Hence the need to always pile onto these types of threads. Denver posts get almost no activity unless someone brings up something negative and then all the former residents come throw out the how horrible it is there story. And its never put into proper context like incomes are rising, employment continues to grow unabated and the economy remains about as diverse as you'll find. No, its always about how things were great back in XXXX but the things I liked about that time are no longer happening so that must mean that Denver sucks.
Because it's NOT growing like it used to. I don't know if you were there back in 2015-17 and saw how many cranes there were dotting the skyline. Not many cranes left, at least from my last view over Christmas. Rents and home prices are slowing down from what they were doing, everywhere in the nation is rising now, including west Kansas. That's what we're saying is that trend appears to be going in the wrong way from what it was doing. Of course there's still stuff going on and the city hasn't fallen off of a cliff. But let's see how Denver does compared to the rest of CO this upcoming decade. The last one it was by far leading the growth, IDK if that'll be the case this time.
I only brought up Greeneville as an example that no, not every larger city in the US just has homeless carpeting the street. Even Atlanta is quite an improvement from Denver homeless wise and Atlanta is as expensive if not moreso in the core.
I have no data to back this up but there seems to be fewer homeless on the streets today than a year ago. Last year Civic Center Park was a no go zone, but they're now enforcing the camping ban fairly consistently. There are also fewer visible homeless person near Union Station. I also don't see entire sidewalks taken up by tents today.
Because it's NOT growing like it used to. I don't know if you were there back in 2015-17 and saw how many cranes there were dotting the skyline. Not many cranes left, at least from my last view over Christmas. Rents and home prices are slowing down from what they were doing, everywhere in the nation is rising now, including west Kansas. That's what we're saying is that trend appears to be going in the wrong way from what it was doing. Of course there's still stuff going on and the city hasn't fallen off of a cliff. But let's see how Denver does compared to the rest of CO this upcoming decade. The last one it was by far leading the growth, IDK if that'll be the case this time.
I only brought up Greeneville as an example that no, not every larger city in the US just has homeless carpeting the street. Even Atlanta is quite an improvement from Denver homeless wise and Atlanta is as expensive if not moreso in the core.
So you're comparing Greenville, population 70,000 to Denver, population 700,000? Yeah that's not disingenuous or anything. I realize many of the folks in this thread are crapping on Denver because it's become "lib," but this comparison is apples-to-walnuts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil P
Denver is NOT like all cities. The homeless aren't endemic, they're migrants who came for the cultural experience. If they weren't sprouted locally, fixing things like home prices won't make them disappear. And there are cities in the US, like Greeneville SC, which really don't have a homeless presence.
Dallas and Austin have a lot of homeless people, too. Assuming "cultural experience" means pot, well it isn't legal in Texas.
Last edited by Mike from back east; 08-22-2022 at 10:38 AM..
If things are so dim for Denver and its future why has it been one of the fastest growing big cities? If Denver's downtown is dragging things down so much, why are rents and housing prices outside of downtown doing so well. Nobody compares things in Denver to Greeneville, that's mindless.
Hey we get it, you and a lot of other posters don't like what Denver has become. Hence the need to always pile onto these types of threads. Denver posts get almost no activity unless someone brings up something negative and then all the former residents come throw out the how horrible it is there story. And its never put into proper context like incomes are rising, employment continues to grow unabated and the economy remains about as diverse as you'll find. No, its always about how things were great back in XXXX but the things I liked about that time are no longer happening so that must mean that Denver sucks.
Kind of amusing because my perspective is that when folks say something negative about Denver, the folks who tend to see nothing wrong with what Denver has become are the ones who get defensive and pile on. There are a lot of things to not like about Denver right now and sure, some of these are trends that are happening across the country. But I’m not sure why we should all feel okay about increased crime (as well as a tolerance for crime and DAs who don’t prosecute some types of crimes), tent cities, or increased COL simply because it’s happening in other places as well.
To answer the question about why Metro Denver continues to grow even if Downtown Denver isn’t that great, I think it’s because Downtown is irrelevant to most people. Unless you want to see sports, a concert, or some kind of cultural event, there’s really no need for anyone to go there. You can find entertainment, dining, employment, etc in many parts of the Metro Denver. I lived in the actual City and County of Denver for awhile but I live in the ‘burbs now, and now that I’m out in the ‘burbs and don’t work downtown anymore, I rarely go there as I see no need. Plus, I don’t want to deal with RTD and I don’t want to have my car or catalytic converter stolen while it’s parked downtown.
I go downtown every once in a while for a concert or other event, maybe a couple to a few times per year. I do notice that every time I go, it looks a little more run down. Not horribly run down by any means, but it's starting to take the appearance of a place I'd want to watch my back just a bit. It's certainly much dirtier now, which I think is the main driver for that feeling. But I've heard of the increase in crime.
I agree with some other posts in here saying there was a recent window where downtown was overall very pleasant. That was the mid 2000s to mid 2010s IMO. Of course, during that time frame so much of the downtown area was either under construction, being renovated, or was brand spanking new.
From an outsider's perspective it does seem like some things need to change. It's easy to blame city governments across the country for "allowing" this to happen to all of them, but maybe we should be looking at the big picture (example: inequality that continues to spiral).
I don't know if you were there back in 2015-17 and saw how many cranes there were dotting the skyline. Not many cranes left, at least from my last view over Christmas.
I counted 8 yesterday in the RiNo area alone.
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