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Now, you really do have my curiosity piqued. How many dogs have you had stolen from your car at rest stops, how many car windows have you had broken at rest stops, and/or how many times have the police been called on you because your dog has been left in a car at a rest stop? Or, for that matter, anywhere?
I have traveled once every other month 12 hours each way and the alternate months 7 hours each way with my dogs to visit my kiddos. The dogs and I stop about every two hours at rest stops and not once have I taken a dog in a bathroom or had anyone react in anyway to having them in the car with the window cracked (and air conditioning running if over 72 degrees). Not once. Nor has anyone else I know.
Good for you. It's too bad you couldn't offer me advice instead of bullying and attacking me. Judging by the messages and reputation comments I've received, this appears to be your standard MO.
I clearly created a thread in which it was pointed out that it has been problematic for me to travel solo with my dog as well as use facilities at hiking trails when my dog is with me.
This site needs to reevaluate your involvement here.
My preferred solution is to take the dog out of the car and tie her down to anything outside (preferably in the shadow, but she'll survive a few minutes without a roof). That way she's "under control" and my car is safe.
In a treeless area, you can tie down the dog to your car, and your dog would love hiding under the car. But I don't like it much because dog is better away from car parking lot.
I've received two tickets for leaving my car running. It's illegal in a lot of jurisdictions, just fyi. One of the tickets was in a place where it was illegal to leave a dog in the car, illegal to keep the car running, against the rules to take the dog into the bathroom, illegal to pee well hidden behind a bush. The cop wasn't even willing to hold the leash or watch my dog for the few moments it would take me to go to the bathroom. It was so exasperating.
Yes, it is illegal in Ohio, Maryland, West Virginia, Pennsylvania, Colorado, Texas, Wisconsin, South Carolina, and in Arizona you get a 5 minute limit. Those laws originated to prevent car theft back in the day when people mainly did it to warm up their car in the winter or to make a quick run into the store. In my trips I go through Maryland, Ohio, and West Virginia and have left the dogs with car running, including stops with a state policeman on location. I am genuinely surprised you got ticketed. These kinds of low level legal boo-boos usually result in an offical warning at worse, but more likely a gentle lecture on the law. Either you got a cop who was in a bad mood or perhaps you put the cop in a bad mood, but I do get your frustration in that situation. It does seem there was no good answer. However, this is not the norm and is not an excuse to disregard the rights of people uncomfortable around dogs (for any reason, whether you think they are being whiny or not). Rest stop bathrooms were designed for humans, and if the signs say 'no dogs' then you should follow the rules and come up with an alternative solution. It is your dog and therefore the only person who sure shoulder the inconvenience of him is you.
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How do you go on a road trip alone with a dog? I've never been able to even properly manage a day trip with my dog. I can pack all of my drinks and food, but I can't not go to the bathroom. My windows are tinted so occasionally I leave him there (in a shaded spot, inside a car that had the air conditioning blasting for a good ten minutes if it's hot outside) for the few minutes it takes to pee and wash hands. But the entire time I'm worried that someone will see him and think he's in danger and break my window to get him out. I've tested it numerous times, the temp doesn't rise that quickly. It will go from 73 to 75 degrees in the five minutes it takes in the bathroom.
It's hard with hiking or trail walking, too. I'm not talking backcountry stuff where I can pop a squat. Usually places that have facilities and don't allow hikers/walkers to pee off the trails. They are dog friendly places, but there really isn't anything to do when I desperately need to pee because it's not like I can take my dog into the bathroom with me.
Nearly three years and I still haven't figured this one out. What does a solo person do for bathroom breaks when they have their dog with them on road trips or hiking days?
Although you present in your first post that you would like to know what other dog-owners do when they have to pee and are faced with the problem of "what do you do with Fido?", your subsequent posts would indicate that you are going to do whatever is easiest for you.
As so frequently happens, when the overwhelming responses are not in agreement with the OP's thinking, the OP can become argumentative and even attack people who stepped in to take the time to reply.
I neither have a dog nor do I have a desire to own a dog. But IF I had a 100% disability, I'd hardly be likely to "forget" to renew my support animal permit. Oh, wait! Maybe forgetting things is the disability.
You seem to be under the impression that the dog would be using the facilities as well. He wouldn't. He'd be standing there while I pee.
But thanks for the idea! I'm actually disabled (100% disabled veteran) and my dog has an expired support animal license. I'm going to update that and maybe even upgrade it to service animal. I'll enjoy shoving it in the idiot's faces next time I have to do something so outrageous as pee while my dog is in my care.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyeBright
Sigh. Making good decisions for my dog doesn't change the fact that my body produces waste that must be eliminated.
The issue is that there are people who would break your windows or steal your dog because they have been told by the media that leaving a dog in a car for any period of time is bad bad bad. There are now even laws in many places that make it illegal to leave any living creature in the car no matter what. Except these laws never take into consideration that humans have to do things like pee.
No, it's not at all a completely different scenario. The scenario is going to the bathroom in certain locations (we're talking trailheads and such, not the local 7-11) when you have the dog there. In both cases, the dog is in the bathroom. The existence of a dog in a facility where people pretend to have deadly allergies doesn't change just because I whip out a service or support license. It just changes the way jerks react.
It's extremely easy to get a service or support card for a pet. My being able to prove an actual disability would only serve to make jerks who don't want me to pee and don't want me to leave the dog in the car and don't want me to leave a barking dog tied to a tree (because my well-behaved dog would bark if I leave him like that) feel like even bigger jerks simply because my best option would be to take the dog into the bathroom with me after a long hike.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyeBright
Oh geez, learn some risk analysis.
If I stopped doing everything just because there was once a murder or a rape or a robbery or some sort of crime in a specific situation, then I'd never be able to leave a hermetically sealed bubble wrapped room. Even then, I'm sure someone has suffered in some way due to that.
Tragic news of a woman murdered. Basic risk analysis and common sense shouldn't lead anyone to the idiotic conclusion of no longer using rest areas.
Hey to break it to you, child, but veterans come in all types. We aren't some monolithic thinking block where we all have the same opinions. Some hate animals. Some love pets and would avidly support my need to pee. Those are the same vets who told me to get a support license for my dog so that I could have housing because landlords feel like it's ok to discriminate against pet owners. They think twice when you have paperwork.
I haven't missed any point. I need to pee. Other people's feelings does not supercede my need to pee. Maybe those alleged allergy sufferers should come out in support of disbanding laws and practices that make me unable to leave my animal in the car for the three minutes it takes to pee. But I know they won't, instead, they are often the same type of people who will call the cops or break my window if they see my dog.
Ok, let's hit the brakes here.
You say your dog has an "expired support animal license".
You then say it's "extremely easy to get a service or support card for a pet".
You then say "being able to prove an actual disability would only serve to make jerks....feel like even bigger jerks..."
In other words, YOUR DOG IS NOT LICENSED AS AN ADA SERVICE ANIMAL. Your dog is a companion animal. That is how you got your dog in to the apartment with you, and a companion animal does NOT have the same clout as a service animal.
That explains why the "license" is "expired". That explains why you keep threatening to make your dog a certified service animal (which is WAY different than a companion animal), that is why people are having problems with what you're saying.
To those of you not aware: Everyone understands the basic concept of a service animal. Those are animals that serve humans with disabilities such as blindness, seizures, inability to walk, etc.
The type that the OP is talking about, that they are incorrectly calling a "service animal", is actually a companion animal. You can go to any psychiatrist and tell them that you can't live without Fluffy and Snuggles because it will set off your depression and anxieities, the psychiatrist will write a letter stating that your pet is a necessity to have in your home with you, and you present that to a landlord so that they cannot deny you your pets, even if the place has a 'no pet' policy, and you don't have to pay the pet deposit...because it's a 'necessity' and it's 'not fair' to charge someone for a 'necessity'.
Yeah.
The OP does not have an actual ADA certified service animal, they have a companion animal that they got a letter for (not a license) so that they could go in to an apartment with their pet, who gives a damn what the landlord wanted.
That companion animal has NO OTHER RIGHTS with the OP. You cannot take a companion animal in to a store that doesn't normally allow pets, unlike a service animal. You cannot take your companion animal with you everywhere that you go that would otherwise prevent an animal from attending, unlike a service animal.
Service animal is not the same as companion animal.
Per the ADA: "Dogs whose sole function is to provide comfort or emotional support do not qualify as service animals under the ADA."
That is what the OP has.
Now that's cleared up...I gave you a suggestion. I have moved across this country, up one side and down the other...and I mean literally, I have gone from northern west coast to east coast, from southern east coast to northern east coast, from east cost to southern west coast...and I stopped in the south for a year halfway throught it all.
I have been to so many rest stops in this country, it's not even funny. In all of those rest stops, not once have I ever had a problem with my dogs. Ever. The only times I would NOT take my dogs in with me are if the bathrooms were inside a building or it was night time or a cooler day.
Regardless, at night I've left them in the car, or if it was a rainy day out on the roads, I would leave them in the car. Not a single time has anyone ever said a thing to me about leaving my dogs in the car. Not a single time has anyone ever said anything to me about taking my dogs in to the restroom with me.
This is not the big issue it's being made out to be.
By the way, a 100% disability does not always mean you automatically get to have a service animal.
"A service animal is a dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for a person with a disability." According to the ADA...your pet doesn't just "become" a service animaml. If that dog is not performing trained tasks, and that means "trained" by a program that is certified by the ADA to provide service dogs, which that dog clearly is not because the OP is functioning without an actual certified ADA service dog, then you don't get one just because.
Although you present in your first post that you would like to know what other dog-owners do when they have to pee and are faced with the problem of "what do you do with Fido?", your subsequent posts would indicate that you are going to do whatever is easiest for you.
As so frequently happens, when the overwhelming responses are not in agreement with the OP's thinking, the OP can become argumentative and even attack people who stepped in to take the time to reply.
I neither have a dog nor do I have a desire to own a dog. But IF I had a 100% disability, I'd hardly be likely to "forget" to renew my support animal permit. Oh, wait! Maybe forgetting things is the disability.
I became argumentative only with the person who provided no advice and who decided himself decided to create a hostile exchange. I think that's fair. I readily accepted the advice from those who contributed.
I had no reason to renew my support animal permit. I got it to secure housing with a landlord who discriminated, then found something different. The only reason to have a service dog or support permit is if you actively need it for something. I haven't until now. I'll gladly renew it if it means I can shut people up when they want to prevent me from peeing while also keeping my dog safe. Anyone can get one of these things, whether they have a disability or not. My having all of the credentials for my disability (car tags, ID cards, etc) isn't really relevant, like I previously mentioned. It's merely more helpful in certain situations.
If you have no desire for a dog and don't have a dog, you have no business posting or responding in a dog forum.
You say your dog has an "expired support animal license".
You then say it's "extremely easy to get a service or support card for a pet".
You then say "being able to prove an actual disability would only serve to make jerks....feel like even bigger jerks..."
In other words, YOUR DOG IS NOT LICENSED AS AN ADA SERVICE ANIMAL. Your dog is a companion animal. That is how you got your dog in to the apartment with you, and a companion animal does NOT have the same clout as a service animal.
That explains why the "license" is "expired". That explains why you keep threatening to make your dog a certified service animal (which is WAY different than a companion animal), that is why people are having problems with what you're saying.
To those of you not aware: Everyone understand the basic concept of a service animal. Those are animals that serve humans with disabilities such as blindness, seizures, inability to walk, etc.
The type that the OP is talking about, that they are incorrectly calling a "service animal", is actually a companion animal. You can go to any psychiatrist and tell them that you can't live without Fluffy and Snuggles because it will set off your depression and anxieities, the psychiatrist will write a letter stating that your pet is a necessity to have in your home with you, and you present that to a landlord so that they cannot deny you your pets, even if the place has a 'no pet' policy, and you don't have to pay the pet deposit...because it's a 'necessity' and it's 'not fair' to charge someone for a 'necessity'.
Yeah.
The OP does not have an actual ADA certified service animal, they have a companion animal that they got a letter for (not a license) so that they could go in to an apartment with their pet, who gives a damn what the landlord wanted.
That companion animal has NO OTHER RIGHTS with the OP. You cannot take a companion animal in to a store that doesn't normally allow pets, unlike a service animal. You cannot take your companion animal with you everywhere that you go that would otherwise prevent an animal from attending, unlike a service animal.
Service animal is not the same as companion animal.
Per the ADA: "Dogs whose sole function is to provide comfort or emotional support do not qualify as service animals under the ADA."
That is what the OP has.
Now that's cleared up...I gave you a suggestion. I have moved across this country, up one side and down the other...and I mean literally, I have gone from northern west coast to east coast, from southern east coast to northern east coast, from east cost to southern west coast...and I stopped in the south for a year halfway throught it all.
I have been to so many rest stops in this country, it's not even funny. In all of those rest stops, not once have I ever had a problem with my dogs. Ever. The only time I would NOT take my dogs in with me is if the bathrooms were inside a building.
Regardless, at night I've left them in the car, or if it was a rainy day out on the roads, I would leave them in the car. Not a single time has anyone ever said a thing to me about leaving my dogs in the car. Not a single time has anyone ever said anything to me about taking my dogs in to the restroom with me.
This is not the big issue it's being made out to be.
By the way, a 100% disability does not always mean you automatically get to have a service animal.
"A service animal is a dog that is individually trained to do work or perform tasks for a person with a disability." According to the ADA...your pet doesn't just "become" a service animaml. If that dog is not performing trained tasks, and that means "trained" by a program that is certified by the ADA to provide service dogs, which that dog clearly is not because the OP is functioning without an actual certified ADA service dog, then you don't get one just because.
Sigh. I said "service or support". Your rant here is completely invalid, but thanks for trying. Not to mention that you have multiple inaccuracies listed.
If you'll all excuse me. Now that the babysitter has arrived, I'm off for a bimonthly Friday hike at a nearby trail where using the facilities has proven especially problematic with my dog. This time, I'll be taking him inside with me. I'll, of course, have no problem waiting a few moments if someone asks me politely to wait a few minutes until they are finished.
Last edited by SkyeBright; 09-09-2016 at 09:31 AM..
Sigh. I said "service or support". Your rant here is completely invalid, but thanks for trying. Not to mention that you have multiple inaccuracies listed.
If you'll all excuse me. Now that the babysitter has arrived, I'm off for a bimonthly Friday hike at a nearby trail where using the facilities has proven especially problematic with my dog. This time, I'll be taking him inside with me. I'll, of course, have no problem waiting a few moments if someone asks me politely to wait a few minutes until they are finished.
I have no inaccuracies when it comes to ADA. This used to be a part of my job that I had...I'm WELL versed on the ADA and the difference between service animals and companion animals. All of those posts of people clearly thinking you had a service animal and yet you made zero effort to correct them. Yet you want to tell me my "rant" is "invalid". No, it wasn't.
For the record, someone calling you out doesn't make it a rant. You don't get to pin that label on it just because you got a little uncomfortabe about being exposed.
Good for you. It's too bad you couldn't offer me advice instead of bullying and attacking me. Judging by the messages and reputation comments I've received, this appears to be your standard MO.
I clearly created a thread in which it was pointed out that it has been problematic for me to travel solo with my dog as well as use facilities at hiking trails when my dog is with me.
This site needs to reevaluate your involvement here.
Disagreeing with you is not bullying you. Substituting equitable alternate variables in a quote using your own words is not bullying you, it is a established debate method used for pointing out the inherent weakness of the logic used in the original declaration. If the statement using alternate equitable variables is whatever, be it insulting, bigoted, or anything else, then there is the same problem with the original.
My advice to you was and remains that there are alternatives that do not involve breaking rules or imposing on other humans, for whom the facilities are designed. I have made some suggestions, as have others. Just because you do not like the advice given does not negate its legitimacy.
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When I post in bold red that is moderator action and, per the TOS, can only be discussed through Direct Message.
Moderator - Diabetes and Kentucky (including Lexington & Louisville)
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