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As far as investments goes the end result is pretty dramatic. The average SUV driver will save anywhere from 100~200 a month in gas by buying a more fuel efficient. If you put this money in some fund and assume a 8% gain over 30 years, you end up with $150,000 to $301,000. I would say thats a pretty good investment. Now if you also include the increase cost of the SUV vs other smaller cars (save anywhere from $5k~$10) and assume you get 3 cars over 30 years, you end up with $213,000 to $426,000. And this still excludes the increase in maintenance costs!
Anyhow, an extra $213k to $426k for retirement for just driving a smaller more fuel efficient car is pretty damn dramatic.
But this is the problem people don't calculate the long term effect of their spending, just that "oh an extra $100 in gas a month, that isn't such a biggie".
The amount you can save by buying generics instead of brand names is even more dramatic! From my figures I'll have an extra million in 30 years for just driving fuel efficient vehicles, buying in bulk and buying generics whenever possible.
Rep point for doing the math that I was too lazy to do. H and I have done it in the past, and that's why we choose more fuel efficient cars- and in his case, a bike.
This is just the point, they are stealing from you. Its just not as obvious as with taxes.
They are not stealing from me because that is all part of doing business... I don't blame fat people for increasing food prices nor do I blame the U.S. treasury for driving up copper prices... that is business... stealing from my paycheck for no other reason then to give half of it to entitlements and handouts and pocketing the rest is outright theft by the government... that is my retirement money not theirs...
They are not stealing from me because that is all part of doing business...
If I want to bury nuclear waste by your house is that just part of doing business? If I want to open up a factory and unload pollutant in your local river/lack is that just part of doing business? Where do you draw the line between what is and isn't just "part of doing business"?
Ummm... cars use gas like SUVs, fat people eat just like normal people, the U.S. treasury makes coins for people to use... there is NOTHING in people USING nuclear waste or unloaded pollutants (those are waste products and those are the responsibilities of the company)... I don't sue an SUV driver because they "use" gasoline nor do I sue every American who has a carbon footprint... last time I check, my car used gasoline too... when you want to use examples... use REAL applicable examples instead of inflammatory off-based ones...
use REAL applicable examples instead of inflammatory off-based ones...
You aren't getting the point, you can't brush this off as "business as usual" etc. The issue is that its a matter of degree. If you want something that uses gas, take one of the multiple businesses that use a lot of industrial vehicles/equipment that runs on gas and put it right next to your house. In this case the added population is very noticeable, because its from a single source. When you get sick you can sue this single source.
There are many acts if only one person did them the world would function just fine, but when millions start to do it then the world is a worse place for everyone. This is actually a classic ethical dilemma. For example, many people have no problem ripping off big companies because they are big companies. The idea is that there actions have no noticeable effect on the companies profits. But if millions did the same thing....well the company wouldn't exist. Similar here, a single SUV driver doesn't change things but millions of them do. As individuals their actions make little difference as a group they are rather dramatic. But since each individual's contribution to the problem is very small it does not make sense to sue them.
In cases like this we have a few options. You can ban them like smoking in public places has been done in many states or you can make sure people are paying for all the costs they are incurring on others. In the case of SUVs I think making better externality charges is best. The current gas prices are actually creating new charges and people are responding pretty well to them.
I don't brush off laws that ban that kind of crap either and use it as something as a business model. I don't pretend that the U.S. doesn't have zoning laws either, applying your scenario of Houston and saying how "bad" it is... someone should tell Houston, last time I heard, the people voted against zoning laws THREE times.. apparently your scenario didn't play out too well where it actually existed... Who is talking about lawsuits? I am talking about commerce and prices which has nothing to do with violating laws already in effect on nuclear dumping and such problems...
Bad effects when millions do it? Like using the government to steal? The SUV is like ANY car at the beginning stages, do you think when cars where invented they used 30 MPG at the get-go? Not even close, it was with time and effort that the MPG was increased. Last time I check, SUV's MPG were increasing and not decreasing.. but lets ban them anyways because we don't "like" them... I wish they started like that when cars were invented... we all be riding horse buggies now... wow, wouldn't that be "great"... In fact for the better "externality" of everything lets all eat hay... if it works horses, its better for everyone because if millions eat meat (and they certainly do) we will have a lot of heart disease, obesity, and other problems... FAT CHANCE... you think rolling over to accept something because it is the "hip" thing to do for the common "good" is something that should be mandated? I think we live in a world where you have that choice and you pay for your choices.. by the way, I haven't stopped eating meat yet... have you?
So instead of banning them, we should charge them more? So we steal from them... when is externality in favor of Stealing... millions steal = good thing? We steal because well, it gives me cheaper gas... wow... that makes it soooo righteous... Gas prices are high and I don't pretend that number of SUV drivers out there isn't increasing its been there since 1990s when gas prices didn't go up very much... then it went up when we invaded Iraq and oil productions were slowed and halted... could that be what's driving gas prices???? Could the oil commodities price be influencing gas prices? Could greed be the culprit in OPEC nations driving the gas prices? Nope, lets blame the SUV owner... BS
we should charge them more? So we steal from them...
It is not stealing its simply making them pay for the true cost of their actions. They cause more pollution among other things when they buy an SUV. Like I said, partly they are getting charged more because they have to pay more fuel tax. But fuel tax in this country is too low to act as a real externatility charge, in Europe on the other hand it works just fine.
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Nope, lets blame the SUV owner... BS
You have trouble sticking to the point. I never blamed SUV owners for increased Gas prices, of course they are part of the demand side of the equation but so is everyone.
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In fact for the better "externality" of everything lets all eat hay... if it works horses, its better for everyone because if millions eat meat (and they certainly do) we will have a lot of heart disease, obesity, and other problems...
Firstly we can't eat hay. And I do think there should be externalities for your eating habits, in some degree there already is. When you are obese you have to pay more for health insurance and things of that nature. But most get health charge from their work and don't realize the cost. If people actually realized all the costs for their lifestyle choices there would be far less obese people. Why is that a bad thing? Its not about banning something its about charging people for what they do to others and themselves.
Then stop complaining about taxes. Either the individuals will pay the costs they or everyone will via taxes, increased insurance rates etc.
You simply can't complain about taxes on one hand then reject any effort to charge people for externalities.
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