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Old 08-27-2007, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Austin, TX
1,235 posts, read 3,770,514 times
Reputation: 396

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatless Wonder View Post
Obama scares me personally. Do we really want a Muslim as our President?

Obama isn't Muslim.
Who did you quote that from? Please use the "quote" button, it's very helpful. I want to ding the person who said this about Obama. It's too ignorant to comprehend.

And the fact that Obama does have some family history connected to Islam is a GOOD thing, making him a BETTER candidate. If we don't want to be at war with the Islamic world then we might want to have a president who can relate to them and cross the cultural barriers instead of taking the usual stance of Christian White Americans that we're better than everyone else. We're not. Obama would send a message to the world that the USA is serious about embracing cultural diversity instead of the current message being sent by the Bush administration, which I will refrain from discussing lest I go off on a profanity-laced tirade of rage.
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Old 08-27-2007, 11:25 AM
 
1,652 posts, read 2,551,138 times
Reputation: 1463
I think the only thing keeping me from jumping onto the Ron Paul train is his strong opposition to Roe v. Wade.
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Old 08-27-2007, 11:38 AM
 
Location: Austin, TX
1,235 posts, read 3,770,514 times
Reputation: 396
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sporin View Post
I think the only thing keeping me from jumping onto the Ron Paul train is his strong opposition to Roe v. Wade.
I think the most over-rated public policy issue in the last century is abortion. Well, gay marriage is even worse. These are not the issues that are going to change our quality of life or save the republic.

Just my two cents. But Roe v. Wade, if you study case law and the actual decision, is flawed and will probably be overturned someday. And even though I'm pro-choice, I think the extremist view that a fetus is just a lump of tissue to be discarded at will is a rather sick point of view.

It's sad that people toss out a great candidate based on a single trivial issue. Ron Paul has had a medical practice in which he delivered babies and provided health care for children without charging the parents if those parents were too poor to afford health care. This, to me, offsets his views on abortion by a long shot. He lives what he preaches, he's not a religious nutter who says one thing but does another. He has lived a flawless life of devotion to the betterment of human beings, regardless of whether they've been born yet or whether they could afford his services. Truly exemplary.
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Old 08-27-2007, 11:38 AM
 
1,290 posts, read 2,570,528 times
Reputation: 686
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sporin View Post
I think the only thing keeping me from jumping onto the Ron Paul train is his strong opposition to Roe v. Wade.
See if I can help you onto the wagon.

Dr. Paul's opposition to Roe v. Wade is primarily a State's Rights v. Imperial Federal Gov't issue. While he may personally oppose abortion, he is more strongly in opposition to the federal government making law covering all fifty states. The Constitution does not state that the fed or the supremes can dictate policy that should be decided by the states.
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Old 08-27-2007, 11:44 AM
 
6,762 posts, read 11,634,279 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Electron View Post
Dr. Paul's opposition to Roe v. Wade is primarily a State's Rights v. Imperial Federal Gov't issue.
That is exactly right. And even though I'm against abortion, I think people are foolish to think of Roe Vs. Wade as a ruling that will stand permanently. It needs to be dumped, and an ammendment made that STATES have the power to determine this issue.

Our founding fathers recognized states a lot differently than our DC clowns have for the last 150 years. Lincoln was the beginning of bigger federal government, and boy has it gotten WAY worse in the last 25 years.
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Old 08-27-2007, 12:33 PM
 
1,652 posts, read 2,551,138 times
Reputation: 1463
It is not a "trivial issue" and telling me an issue I'm concerned about is trivial and unimportant isn't the way to get my vote.

Like I said, I haven't jumped on the bandwagon yet, that doesn't mean I won't. Frankly on Ron Paul's own site his position comes across much stronger then you all make it out to be.

So I appreciate the clarification. I am pro-choice but like most think abortion is a horrible choice for anyone to make and not one I would personally endorse. My stance is still that abortions WILL happen regardless of law and I think a safe, legal process beats back-ally coat-hangers any day.

I agree that Ron Paul about states rights. In fact, I agree with Ron Paul on EVERY other issue which is why (despite our disagreement on abortion) he is at the top of my list right now... by far.
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Old 08-27-2007, 02:00 PM
 
Location: Tennessee
37,803 posts, read 41,036,241 times
Reputation: 62204
I saw my first 2008 Presidential Race sign today on the road. It was a small blue and white sign that said "Ron Paul For President" and it was in Tennessee. It made me wonder why I haven't seen more Presidential candidates' signs.
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Old 08-27-2007, 02:51 PM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,198,730 times
Reputation: 3696
I may be wrong, but wouldn't Ron Paul have more ability to try and change Roe v Wade now as a legislator than as a President in the executive?

I know I repeatedly hear about how Presidential candidates wish to, "change" particular directions in various laws, but the office of President is to execute the laws passed by Congress, not to create laws. Unless of course GW has went and penned in an exe order while no one was paying attention again.
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Old 08-27-2007, 02:55 PM
 
1,652 posts, read 2,551,138 times
Reputation: 1463
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
I may be wrong, but wouldn't Ron Paul have more ability to try and change Roe v Wade now as a legislator than as a President in the executive?

I know I repeatedly hear about how Presidential candidates wish to, "change" particular directions in various laws, but the office of President is to execute the laws passed by Congress, not to create laws. Unless of course GW has went and penned in an exe order while no one was paying attention again.
This is a very good point and one that keeps Ron Paul so "in play" for me. If the current administration with all their power and executive orders and SC nominations and neo-conservative social agenda and what not couldn't repeal Roe v. Wade, then I doubt ANY President will be able to.
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Old 08-27-2007, 02:57 PM
 
Location: Sacramento
14,044 posts, read 27,229,470 times
Reputation: 7373
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sporin View Post
It is not a "trivial issue" and telling me an issue I'm concerned about is trivial and unimportant isn't the way to get my vote.

Like I said, I haven't jumped on the bandwagon yet, that doesn't mean I won't. Frankly on Ron Paul's own site his position comes across much stronger then you all make it out to be.

So I appreciate the clarification. I am pro-choice but like most think abortion is a horrible choice for anyone to make and not one I would personally endorse. My stance is still that abortions WILL happen regardless of law and I think a safe, legal process beats back-ally coat-hangers any day.

I agree that Ron Paul about states rights. In fact, I agree with Ron Paul on EVERY other issue which is why (despite our disagreement on abortion) he is at the top of my list right now... by far.
Here is a respected analytical site (Pew) which may help explain Paul's position on the abortion issue:

Religion and Politics 2008: Ron Paul (http://pewforum.org/religion08/profile.php?CandidateID=15 - broken link)
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