Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Basically, the 2010 mid-terms should never have been regarded as an harbinger of what would happen in 2012 either way (any more than the 2008 Democratic wave should have been regarded as an indicator of what would happen two years later, in 2010).
So...which of the above describe the boost to the economy from QE? Was it made by humans, made in imitation of something natural, or insincere? How does this differ from any other economic activity, which again, is not an Act of God or Nature?
What? The tax cuts and state assistance were enacted immediately.
Stimulus? It's borrowed. The current rate for 10-year Treasuries is -0.68%. That being the case, why would allowing the economy to sink into depression be a superior course of action?
Quantitative easing? The "money" is essentially created by the Federal Reserve. That being the case, please explain why the quantity of money prior to QE (1, 2 or 3) was the "correct" amount, and why QE is therefore inappropriate.
Thanks!
Bingo, the stimulus is BORROWED, TAKING MONEY OUT OF THE ECONOMY, hence the net effect is ZERO. If I take money from you, and I spend it, I dont get to count my spending as a net positive because it ignores the fact that you would have spent it regardless.
Furthermore, the tax cuts were enacted immediately, but they are spread out over YEARS..
LOL...the economy is a human activity. By that definition, everything involving the economy is artificial. So decrying the stimulus as artificial is silly. You FAIL.
Haha, FAIL... the economy occurs naturally because people need to eat and drive, and work. it only becomes artificial when you MANIPULATE it
Remember the housing bubble? Yes, thats an effect of a manipulated economy.. Howd that work out for us?
I don't think Obama did much of anything to turn it around. If the economy had been better he would have sailed through without much of a hick-up. But the economy was terrible, and still not very good, and he was very vulnerable. What turned things around for his campaign was by playing rope-a-dope with Republicans and not taking attention away from their very unlikable attitudes and policy stances.
Case in point:
Going around screaming about how much you love Jesus and America while deriding most Americans and lazy moochers not deserving of quality healthcare, or a minimum standard of living because they aren't rich isn't going to endear you to the masses.
Sure, they will win local races and likely hold congress for a while due to redistricting, but the Presidency is lost to the GOP until they can shed the extremists who hold so much disdain for their fellow countrymen.
Good analysis! And the Bible the right wing pretends to thump explicitly states: YOU ARE YOUR BROTHER'S KEEPER!
Going around screaming about how much you love Jesus and America while deriding most Americans and lazy moochers not deserving of quality healthcare, or a minimum standard of living because they aren't rich isn't going to endear you to the masses.
Sure, they will win local races and likely hold congress for a while due to redistricting, but the Presidency is lost to the GOP until they can shed the extremists who hold so much disdain for their fellow countrymen.
More likely, most americans are too dumb to understand that you getting to determine your healthcare needs is quality and not the same as government determining what you cant have.
Or people who dont understand that Obamacare had NOTHING to do with healthcare.
Case in point, people like you,
Quote:
Originally Posted by notasmoker
Good analysis! And the Bible the right wing pretends to thump explicitly states: YOU ARE YOUR BROTHER'S KEEPER!
I'm agnostic, dont give a rats ass what the bible says.
Haha, FAIL... the economy occurs naturally because people need to eat and drive, and work. it only becomes artificial when you MANIPULATE it
Remember the housing bubble? Yes, thats an effect of a manipulated economy.. Howd that work out for us?
What? So using leverage is manipulation? And therefore artificial? What kind of cockamamie logic is that?
Calling the stimulus "artificial" is making a distinction without a difference. Everything that happens within the economy (since the economy is man-made) is artificial. No one has to buy an i-phone. No one has to farm. Agriculture is not natural. Riding on an airplane is not natural. Putting money in a bank is not natural. These are all human inventions. So to attack the stimulus as "artificial" or "unnatural" betrays a deep lack of understanding of how human society operates. The stimulus was a man-made response to man-made problems.
What? So using leverage is manipulation? And therefore artificial? What kind of cockamamie logic is that?
Calling the stimulus "artificial" is making a distinction without a difference. Everything that happens within the economy (since the economy is man-made) is artificial. No one has to buy an i-phone. No one has to farm. Agriculture is not natural. Riding on an airplane is not natural. Putting money in a bank is not natural. These are all human inventions. So to attack the stimulus as "artificial" or "unnatural" betrays a deep lack of understanding of how human society operates. The stimulus was a man-made response to man-made problems.
Pumping money into the economy by printing it and/or borrowing it, is indeed artificial because you need to remove it at some point.. Even worse, you need to remove it and then pay interest on it.
Even Keynesian economic theories rely upon spending money YOU HAVE, not taking it from other places to spend.
After the Nov 2010 Mid-term GOP landslide, President Obama looked like a long shot for reelection in 2012. But, with five weeks to go, Obama has a lead in all the polls, and has an excellent chance to win. Let's say Obama wins- how will historians say he turned things around?
I put together a chronological list of what I think we're the turning points, inflection points, game-changers, etc:
1) Jan 2011- Giffords shooting- Gave Obama chance to be "healer in chief", exposed Sarah Palin as a egotistical drama queen.
2) May 2011- Osama bin Laden killed.
3) July-Aug 2011 - Debt Ceiling fight- GOP Congress exposed as radicals who would destroy world and US economies rather than give Obama a "win".
4) Summer 2011- Obama finally wakes up, realizes he can't make deals with GOP, starts to act like a Democrat, decides to run AGAINST the radical GOP House and filibuster-infested Senate
5) Dec 2011- Last US combat troops leave Iraq.
6) Winter 2011- One by one, top-tier Republicans decline to run for president.
7) Spring 2012- GOP presidential debates-"C" list candidates take turns making fools out of themselves.
8) June 2012- Obama exempts "Dreamers" from deportation.
9) June 2012- SCOTUS overturns most of SB1070.
10) June 2012- SCOTUS upholds Obamacare (Yay, my kid's insured! )
11) Summer 2012- GOP House and state houses alienate woman voters by boorishly attacking their health care rights
12) Summer 2012- Romney becomes presumptive GOP candidate, embarks on an inept campaign (a book in itself! )
13) Aug 2012- Party conventions, no bounce for Romney, bounce for Obama. Great speech by Bill Clinton.
14) Sept 2012- Romney "47%" tape
15) Throughout- Economy slowly coming back, voters continue to blame Bush for bad economy.
That's all I can think of, for now, pending the debates!
Did I leave anything out?
I think the "47%" video by Romney has PO'ed a lot of people to his campaign. Also Ryan and his Medicare Voucher program has pushed a lot of Seniors towards Obama's camp in the last few weeks especially in swing states where every other commercial Obama's is nailing them on the voucher program. It certainly is working here in Florida.
After the Nov 2010 Mid-term GOP landslide, President Obama looked like a long shot for reelection in 2012. But, with five weeks to go, Obama has a lead in all the polls, and has an excellent chance to win. Let's say Obama wins- how will historians say he turned things around?
I put together a chronological list of what I think we're the turning points, inflection points, game-changers, etc:
1) Jan 2011- Giffords shooting- Gave Obama chance to be "healer in chief", exposed Sarah Palin as a egotistical drama queen.
2) May 2011- Osama bin Laden killed.
3) July-Aug 2011 - Debt Ceiling fight- GOP Congress exposed as radicals who would destroy world and US economies rather than give Obama a "win".
4) Summer 2011- Obama finally wakes up, realizes he can't make deals with GOP, starts to act like a Democrat, decides to run AGAINST the radical GOP House and filibuster-infested Senate
5) Dec 2011- Last US combat troops leave Iraq.
6) Winter 2011- One by one, top-tier Republicans decline to run for president.
7) Spring 2012- GOP presidential debates-"C" list candidates take turns making fools out of themselves.
8) June 2012- Obama exempts "Dreamers" from deportation.
9) June 2012- SCOTUS overturns most of SB1070.
10) June 2012- SCOTUS upholds Obamacare (Yay, my kid's insured! )
11) Summer 2012- GOP House and state houses alienate woman voters by boorishly attacking their health care rights
12) Summer 2012- Romney becomes presumptive GOP candidate, embarks on an inept campaign (a book in itself! )
13) Aug 2012- Party conventions, no bounce for Romney, bounce for Obama. Great speech by Bill Clinton.
14) Sept 2012- Romney "47%" tape
15) Throughout- Economy slowly coming back, voters continue to blame Bush for bad economy.
That's all I can think of, for now, pending the debates!
Did I leave anything out?
I would add: Repealing DADT and supporting marriage equality. More & more people are viewing that topic for the civil rights issue it is, particularly the younger generations. Repubs were able to use anti-gay voting to their advantage 8 years ago, but the majority of us are now moving forward.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
