Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This guys explained it quite well, all to the point, in a sharp way. He is not a supporter of Trump but he just despises America's left and their way of doing things and judging people for years.
One thing I particularly like is "why the hell is Hilary Clinton even considered a left in the US"? That question baffles me very much as well. How can someone so explicitly represents large corporate interest be regarded as a left wing politician? Just because she talks about women, gays and latinos?
Key point: the left/liberal should stop throwing insults and start conversing with people with different opinions. Let people talk and express concerns before labeling them as "racist, sexist, homophobe" so quickly. People aren't sick of equality, but are extremely sick of this liberal speech tyranny as if nothing else should be tolerated except their own views. Why was the poll all so wrong? Because such tyranny is so pervasive and so violent that people just stop telling their true opinions. In a university or any intellectual field, if one has a more conservative view, that's like social suicide because that essentially says you are morally corrupted and intellectually inferior. Is that really how we want things to be from now on?
I know it is pure American politics but I thought it would be helpful to Canadian liberals to understand things a bit better, to have a different perspective and maybe start to behaving in a more respectful way toward those with different opinions. People who dismiss any different political views with such disdain are not different from religious fanatics who persecuted infidels in the middle ages. Personally I have been called “homophobe" or even "racist" on online Canadian forums many times just for expressing different opinions, although I am far from either of these.
Last edited by botticelli; 11-13-2016 at 01:33 AM..
Key point: the left/liberal should stop throwing insults and start conversing with people with different opinions. Let people talk and express concerns before labeling them as "racist, sexist, homophobe" so quickly. People aren't sick of equality, but are extremely sick of this liberal speech tyranny as if nothing else should be tolerated except their own views. Why was the poll all so wrong? Because such tyranny is so pervasive and so violent that people just stop telling their true opinions. In a university or any intellectual field, if one has a more conservative view, that's like social suicide because that essentially says you are morally corrupted and intellectually inferior. Is that really how we want things to be from now on?
THIS is what makes me most upset around the whole world: People who call themselves "liberal" (with the term itself meaning liberty, freedom of opinion) are often the most ignorant when it comes to people who think differently. In Europe, they try to force the majority to accept millions of muslim refugees, to accept a leftist economical redistribution agenda, to support greenish sinkholes for billions of Euros, and if you disagree with that agenda, you are an racist *******. IF that behaviour does not stop, the Trumps in this world will gain and gain.
There is a good comment on that video:
This Election does not prove that America is Racist, it proves that crying Racism no longer works.
Well, the guy is infatuated with the eff-word to the point of it being distracting. Without the drama and the eff-word his argument could have been made in two minutes, and there is something there...and there is also a bit of one-sided BS.
I must say his point about Clinton being considered on the Left almost made me like the jerk. If the other side had spent more time pointing this out in some detail it would have made for a much more interesting campaign. My own very considerable lack of enthusiasm for her candidacy had to do with her connections.
I suppose it is necessary in the light of this argument to state that while I am opposed to hateful speech and discrimination, I think what is called PC has by this time gone so far beyond the territory of decency into that of lunacy that it sometimes pushes me over the edge of good behavior when confronted with it.
But, the OP's "Key point" first sentence leaves me totally cold. Trump behaved like a thug during his campaign, and he encouraged people at his rallies to behave likewise at times in the face of dissent. And, unfortunately, he much too often presented himself as if he were air-headed nutter on a Reality TV show. Mr. Trump is too much of a ham to be an intelligent speaker and he resorted to exactly the sort of labeling that the OP deplores.
And one has to go no farther than the threads in many of the C-D forums to see what I presume should be called the right/Conservative to find exactly the same type of behavior that the OP finds repellent when it comes from the "left/Liberal."
The problem cited in the "Key point" is pervasive, not one limited to a single political view. Neither God nor the good is sitting on one side or the other. And by pointing the criticism in only one direction provides a fine example how at the end of the day no one is willing to accept that the problem contaminates the entire American society, and not just those with one particular political point of view (or the other.)
In the past thirty-six years the America and American society we have been used to has been on its death bed, and it mattered not the slightest which party held the Presidency or the Congress its expiring continued. None seemed to grasp the rather obvious fact that America's place in the world had changed because the entire world was changing radically, much less be able to articulate this to the American people and energize them to face an era perhaps as unsettling and painful as the Great Depression.
And now Americans have Mr. Trump.......yet another president who has promised them a ride Back to the Future. Surely, somewhere in the Cosmos a voice is echoing, "Good luck, suckers."
Mr. T. needs to get the "again" buzz word out of his sloganing, and manifest the intelligence and courage to lead his country into the unknown future. The nostalgia crap has been used to manipulate Americans for a dangerously long time. Please, Mr. Trump - get real; and when you have show us all - Right, Left and the Who Gives a Crap folks - how to get real too. Bacause "real" is not located in the past. In case no one has told you, THE PAST IS OVER.......now get that simple fact across to all Americans and help us move FOWARD together.
Brilliant. I wish Trump had lost, because he terrifies me. I do think Clinton would have been the lesser of two evils, but I agree: she is no true leftist. But then, I have spent the past eight years hearing people call Obama a Socialist, which makes me roar with laughter. There are very few true leftists in the US; we've been conditioned very thoroughly to associate the left with Iron and Bamboo Curtain dictatorships. If "racism" is a trigger word for many on the left, "Socialism" has a very similar effect on those on the right (and, sadly, on many who would most benefit from more left-leaning policies: it is very sad, indeed, to see people trapped in dead-end, low-paying jobs vote again and again for people who oppose a higher minimum wage, mandatory paid sick leave, etc...)
I don't think all Trump voters are racists or fools (although I don't think his core support is particularly lacking in either - his rallies looked very ugly, even cultish to me.) I think a lot of the people who ended up voting for him did so because of an absolute hatred for the Clintons, and, unable to reconcile themselves to what Trump was saying, comforted themselves by saying, "oh, he doesn't really mean this, he wouldn't really do that." This isn't just idle speculation: I have talked to people who chose him when their preferred candidates dropped out of the race, and I have heard their arguments evolve. Maybe they will prove to be right. I hope so. Unfortunately, if he backs off of some of his harsher rhetoric, won't the most extreme of his followers feel betrayed yet again, and become more embittered than ever?
The right has done one thing brilliantly: it has pitted against each other those whose self-interest actually has a great deal in common. Undocumented workers and poor Americans should not be enemies. The enemy of both is the business who exploits the immigrant as a cheap source of labor, and the politician who somehow convinces the minimum wage American worker that any increase in this pitiful floor would destroy the economy, or that universal health care will result in the death of choice. Isn't a complete lack of care also an absence of choice?
Clearly, the left has made mistakes. We failed to choose Bernie Sanders as our candidate, a decision I think we should reflect on for the next four years. I believe he could have won. He wouldn't have gotten the people who voted for Trump because they are racists (don't even try to tell me there are none), but he could have gotten some of the people who feel that the left, in its current state, has forgotten them. And I don't believe the man has a dishonest bone in his body, which was a huge problem for Clinton. He lost, I believe, for two reasons: Clinton had more name recognition, and the too many people are still afraid of anything labeled "Socialist." We were afraid to take a chance.
Another error, one I approach with trepidation, is this: Democrats have largely ceded the Christian vote to the right. This started years ago, and has reached the point that many people seem to assume that to be a Christian is to be a Republican. When was the last time you heard anyone use the term "Christian Left?" Sure, there are factions that are lost to us, primarily those who will not tolerate abortion or same-sex marriage under any circumstances, but these are hardly the whole story. There are also many whose concern for the poor, the environment, and a peaceful world make them natural leftists. People go where they are wanted, and I have to wonder how many Christian votes have been lost since Democrats stopped fighting for them.
If the left ever gets its act together and *stops running away from BEING the left,* it will be a force to be reckoned with.
This guy, though very crude, IS right. Liberals have pushed opinion and thought underground - to their detriment. They cut off conversation and discussion at the pass with accusations and insults. That strategy will not bring out those who are always quiet and it even stopped most of us who normally are happy to discuss and learn from others.
And just as swearing too liberally interrupts communication (if every 2nd word is apple in a sentence people don't listen any more - the same goes for the f word) so too the insults and accusations wear down people and drive them underground. When we could not wear Trump stickers or hats or put stickers on our vehicles any more for fear of persecution - the left lost track of who they were fighting against. They tried tyranny - and that is what their approach is ... it didn't work - and it will never work for long or at least until the smart among us die off.
But even in the face of reality, the left is not stopping now - the riots are just another (Soros funded) 'act' in the liberal playbook. Predictable - unlike (according to the polls) Trump winning. They aren't stopping now - and they will continue to lose until and unless they do stop. But, that is a lot to unlearn - it is now so entrenched in their nature and their followers and in the school system that it has trapped them inside their own 'ghetto'. Might doesn't always make right, as 'they' say. They misjudge us .. we are not how they want to label us and never will be.
There was a big backlash from those who are normally patient, who did their best ... all alone .. to understand why the liberals/left/Democrats/establishment (and that is establishment on both sides - the right side didn't hear us either) appeared to think what they seemed to think and promote. But, we couldn't understand because they never discussed or explained it - just told us we had to toe the line. So they got major kickback - and frankly, it serves them right. And now they are surprised?
They should also stop blaming Trump. Trump is just a symbol of what is wrong in society today. He was/is just the voice that finally appeared to help us talk without having to do it on the streets ourselves - where we were being blocked and insulted at every turn. It was, before he came along, hard to imagine who might be able to wade through the mess to give us that voice. You cannot run for president if you are not rich and if you don't already have great name recognition - and honestly most of us felt there was no one left in that kind of position who had anything in common with us any more. And if you try to run for the presidency, the very first thing you need to do is get attention - and Trump did just that. Most of us knew when he began this journey that he would have to tone it down - and honestly I think most of us cringed at first (and occasionally even along the way after he began to be far more presidential - whatever that is supposed to mean - when he said some one-liners/zingers that seemed somewhat crude) - but I think there was great method to his madness. I 'knew' intuitively he had the right ideas (though they needed to be tempered with reality - and they are being now), I knew that despite his age he had the stamina (he darn well worked his butt off -going to the people where they were), I knew that he is smart and insightful (the You're Fired thing doesn't begin to explain who Trump is), I knew he was not the kind of man that most in the media have portrayed him to be - and so far he has not let me down (but, I like everyone else who voted for him will, because we are smart, always keep an eye out just in case).
The left are like one trick ponies - they just run on mantras, memes, and lack of logic. And when that fails to get enough attention, they riot or cry or both. Sounds so mature to me. Not. And it is definitely tiresome.
The left (my apologies for using that word to describe the masses out there - not all of them are true 'leftists' I know) taught kids Alinsky/Rules for Radicals techniques (gee, I wonder where that came from .. take a look at the current president and what HE used to do in the inner city and who introduced him to all that - and take a look at Clinton's thesis in college) - impressionable kids who now are ruined for life most likely because they cannot unlearn those. They will never be 'reasonable'. They only know one way to 'think' and are now trapped in their little boxes forever. I'd like to think they could learn to be decent and worthy opponents but I fear that will never happen.
The left is deliberately 'literal' when it suits them. They cling to short phrases that allow them to isolate and personalize their target and then destroy it. All the while the right is trying to explain what is meant by everything, to compromise, to discuss. No wonder there is such a gap between us.
Brilliant. I wish Trump had lost, because he terrifies me. I do think Clinton would have been the lesser of two evils, but I agree: she is no true leftist. But then, I have spent the past eight years hearing people call Obama a Socialist, which makes me roar with laughter. There are very few true leftists in the US; we've been conditioned very thoroughly to associate the left with Iron and Bamboo Curtain dictatorships. If "racism" is a trigger word for many on the left, "Socialism" has a very similar effect on those on the right (and, sadly, on many who would most benefit from more left-leaning policies: it is very sad, indeed, to see people trapped in dead-end, low-paying jobs vote again and again for people who oppose a higher minimum wage, mandatory paid sick leave, etc...)
I don't think all Trump voters are racists or fools (although I don't think his core support is particularly lacking in either - his rallies looked very ugly, even cultish to me.) I think a lot of the people who ended up voting for him did so because of an absolute hatred for the Clintons, and, unable to reconcile themselves to what Trump was saying, comforted themselves by saying, "oh, he doesn't really mean this, he wouldn't really do that." This isn't just idle speculation: I have talked to people who chose him when their preferred candidates dropped out of the race, and I have heard their arguments evolve. Maybe they will prove to be right. I hope so. Unfortunately, if he backs off of some of his harsher rhetoric, won't the most extreme of his followers feel betrayed yet again, and become more embittered than ever?
The right has done one thing brilliantly: it has pitted against each other those whose self-interest actually has a great deal in common. Undocumented workers and poor Americans should not be enemies. The enemy of both is the business who exploits the immigrant as a cheap source of labor, and the politician who somehow convinces the minimum wage American worker that any increase in this pitiful floor would destroy the economy, or that universal health care will result in the death of choice. Isn't a complete lack of care also an absence of choice?
Clearly, the left has made mistakes. We failed to choose Bernie Sanders as our candidate, a decision I think we should reflect on for the next four years. I believe he could have won. He wouldn't have gotten the people who voted for Trump because they are racists (don't even try to tell me there are none), but he could have gotten some of the people who feel that the left, in its current state, has forgotten them. And I don't believe the man has a dishonest bone in his body, which was a huge problem for Clinton. He lost, I believe, for two reasons: Clinton had more name recognition, and the too many people are still afraid of anything labeled "Socialist." We were afraid to take a chance.
Another error, one I approach with trepidation, is this: Democrats have largely ceded the Christian vote to the right. This started years ago, and has reached the point that many people seem to assume that to be a Christian is to be a Republican. When was the last time you heard anyone use the term "Christian Left?" Sure, there are factions that are lost to us, primarily those who will not tolerate abortion or same-sex marriage under any circumstances, but these are hardly the whole story. There are also many whose concern for the poor, the environment, and a peaceful world make them natural leftists. People go where they are wanted, and I have to wonder how many Christian votes have been lost since Democrats stopped fighting for them.
If the left ever gets its act together and *stops running away from BEING the left,* it will be a force to be reckoned with.
No the Democrats need to stop shoving crap down our throats-Obama did NOTHING for 8 years but put more people on the government tit-
You are terrified? Give me a break-you know what would be terrifying? Hillary allowing so many refugees into our country-go to Europe to see what has happened-
Oh and all of us that voted for Trump-most voted for Obama so your racist bullsh** has expired
This guy, though very crude, IS right. Liberals have pushed opinion and thought underground - to their detriment. They cut off conversation and discussion at the pass with accusations and insults. That strategy will not bring out those who are always quiet and it even stopped most of us who normally are happy to discuss and learn from others.
And just as swearing too liberally interrupts communication (if every 2nd word is apple in a sentence people don't listen any more - the same goes for the f word) so too the insults and accusations wear down people and drive them underground. When we could not wear Trump stickers or hats or put stickers on our vehicles any more for fear of persecution - the left lost track of who they were fighting against. They tried tyranny - and that is what their approach is ... it didn't work - and it will never work for long or at least until the smart among us die off.
But even in the face of reality, the left is not stopping now - the riots are just another (Soros funded) 'act' in the liberal playbook. Predictable - unlike (according to the polls) Trump winning. They aren't stopping now - and they will continue to lose until and unless they do stop. But, that is a lot to unlearn - it is now so entrenched in their nature and their followers and in the school system that it has trapped them inside their own 'ghetto'. Might doesn't always make right, as 'they' say. They misjudge us .. we are not how they want to label us and never will be.
There was a big backlash from those who are normally patient, who did their best ... all alone .. to understand why the liberals/left/Democrats/establishment (and that is establishment on both sides - the right side didn't hear us either) appeared to think what they seemed to think and promote. But, we couldn't understand because they never discussed or explained it - just told us we had to toe the line. So they got major kickback - and frankly, it serves them right. And now they are surprised?
They should also stop blaming Trump. Trump is just a symbol of what is wrong in society today. He was/is just the voice that finally appeared to help us talk without having to do it on the streets ourselves - where we were being blocked and insulted at every turn. It was, before he came along, hard to imagine who might be able to wade through the mess to give us that voice. You cannot run for president if you are not rich and if you don't already have great name recognition - and honestly most of us felt there was no one left in that kind of position who had anything in common with us any more. And if you try to run for the presidency, the very first thing you need to do is get attention - and Trump did just that. Most of us knew when he began this journey that he would have to tone it down - and honestly I think most of us cringed at first (and occasionally even along the way after he began to be far more presidential - whatever that is supposed to mean - when he said some one-liners/zingers that seemed somewhat crude) - but I think there was great method to his madness. I 'knew' intuitively he had the right ideas (though they needed to be tempered with reality - and they are being now), I knew that despite his age he had the stamina (he darn well worked his butt off -going to the people where they were), I knew that he is smart and insightful (the You're Fired thing doesn't begin to explain who Trump is), I knew he was not the kind of man that most in the media have portrayed him to be - and so far he has not let me down (but, I like everyone else who voted for him will, because we are smart, always keep an eye out just in case).
The left are like one trick ponies - they just run on mantras, memes, and lack of logic. And when that fails to get enough attention, they riot or cry or both. Sounds so mature to me. Not. And it is definitely tiresome.
The left (my apologies for using that word to describe the masses out there - not all of them are true 'leftists' I know) taught kids Alinsky/Rules for Radicals techniques (gee, I wonder where that came from .. take a look at the current president and what HE used to do in the inner city and who introduced him to all that - and take a look at Clinton's thesis in college) - impressionable kids who now are ruined for life most likely because they cannot unlearn those. They will never be 'reasonable'. They only know one way to 'think' and are now trapped in their little boxes forever. I'd like to think they could learn to be decent and worthy opponents but I fear that will never happen.
The left is deliberately 'literal' when it suits them. They cling to short phrases that allow them to isolate and personalize their target and then destroy it. All the while the right is trying to explain what is meant by everything, to compromise, to discuss. No wonder there is such a gap between us.
No the Democrats need to stop shoving crap down our throats-Obama did NOTHING for 8 years but put more people on the government tit-
You are terrified? Give me a break-you know what would be terrifying? Hillary allowing so many refugees into our country-go to Europe to see what has happened- Oh and all of us that voted for Trump-most voted for Obama so your racist bullsh** has expired
Sorry, but...huh? Can you please repeat this in a way that makes sense?
US liberals can be as ignorant, thickheaded and intolerant as conservative rednecks
Actually I call them "Coastal liberal rednecks"
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
