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Momonkey I also remember the Carter era. And yes this election reminds me of it. I hope the older generation prevails and the Democrats don't have all 3. If they do I believe this time could possibly be worse.
how do they stop a Democratic filibuster? I never said the reps didn't have thier fingers in the coockie jar too. their's plenty enough blame to go around. a lot folks don't realize that McCain isn't necissarily loved by either side, but he is certainly respected. as for the meltdown, how can you or I with just one vote change the government when hords of confused voters with single digit IQs show up each cycle with their heads full of soundbites and mainstream media misinformation from the likes of olberman, matthews and maddow
as for the Republican congress, it doesn't subscribe to any higher ethics, thats why we need McCain.
never said either was a better candidate. Ford had, rightly or wrongly, the stigma of Watergate. the counrty was looking for change . change in and of itself is neither good nor bad, it is just change.
Didn't Carter's being a Southern Baptist preacher score a bunch of points with the evangelicals? One case where voting on the basis of religion didn't turn out so well. I thought the whole furor over Ford's pardon of Nixon had largely blown over by the time he was seeking re-election.
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Originally Posted by momonkey
I do remember what happened after "read my lips", he got canned, and rightly so!
And, thus, when it comes to election-year promises, a pledge not to raise taxes amounts to a hill of beans to me. And rightly so. Personally, I think our taxes are going up no matter what. We can't keep financing this boondoggle Iraq war, bailing out Wall Street and have no way of paying for it. China's going to stop accepting the IOUs eventually. Just like borrow-and-spend Reaganomics led to Bush (H.W., that is) reneging on "Read My Lips."
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Originally Posted by momonkey
I also remember Candidate Bill Clinton pommissing to raise taxes on only the wealthiest Americans.
do you remember to joke from that era? " great news, I just found out I'm one of the wealthiest Americans" in '93 and '94, I was a waiter making less that $20k/yr and my taxes went up. then we had the Republican revolution in '94
So, which is it? Are you glad that Bush lost or are you sorry that Clinton won? You're contradicting yourself too. Unless you wanted Ross Perot to be president, I guess.
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Originally Posted by momonkey
don't worry if old timers like me seem to be raining on your parade, it's just that we've herad all this before, young people haven't.
See my point above re: "Read My Lips." I may not be as old as you, but I didn't fall off the turnip truck last week.
I am old enough to remember the 1976 race between an unpopular Republican president left over from the Watergate scandal and a little known governor from Georgia.
I'm old enough to remember what an utter disaster Carter was: American hostages held by Iran for 444 days, the failed rescue mission that went up in flames in the Iranian dessert, the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan and 18% inflation. A decent man but the worst President in 100 years. His one accomplishment was the Camp David Accords.
Well, I'm old enough to remember when a country tried to fight a massive war in South East Asia while funding all sorts of domestic spending through both Democratic and Republican administrations. I am also old enough to remember that inflation first hit the double digits under Ford, anyone remember "Whip Inflation Now?" if there is to be a repeat of the Carter economic malaise, the beginning of deindustrialization, under an Obama administration it should be hard to trace where the economy started to move southward.
Frankly, if I were Obama, or at least a close confidant, I would say, "dude, I understand this "urgency of now" thing, but you've got to be nuts to want to take over and be saddled with two wars, and a crap economy. They accuse you of acting like the messiah but even Jesus isn't going to be able to work a miracle on this crap, why be the whipping boy?"
I'm old enough to remember what an utter disaster Carter was: American hostages held by Iran for 444 days, the failed rescue mission that went up in flames in the Iranian dessert, the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan and 18% inflation.
Um, okay...you had me until you're blaming him for the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. What's next, blaming Reagan for Iran-Contra or giving Saddam Hussein chemical weapons? Oh wait...
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Originally Posted by ZGACK
A decent man but the worst President in 100 years.
But only the second worst in the last 30.
Also, wouldn't Herbert Hoover at least give the peanut farmer a run for his money on the whole "worst in 100 years" thing?
Ok, one more time. Clinton was elected in the fall of '92, he had a dem house and senate. They decided to raise taxes. in '94 reps took over both houses (the Republican revolution) the republicans lowered taxes, the economy recovered reveue increased and Clint has been taking credit for it ever since. do you remember when the government was shut down for a couple days in the mid 90s, do you remember why? the reps were cutting spending (but only over Clinton's dead body, so to speak)
Ok, one more time. Clinton was elected in the fall of '92, he had a dem house and senate. They decided to raise taxes. in '94 reps took over both houses (the Republican revolution) the republicans lowered taxes, the economy recovered reveue increased and Clint has been taking credit for it ever since. do you remember when the government was shut down for a couple days in the mid 90s, do you remember why? the reps were cutting spending (but only over Clinton's dead body, so to speak)
Another one who doesn't know his history.
There is only one sure fire way to douse the fires of inflation, a recession (once again basic econ) and that is the real story behind supply side economics, just plain good old Robert Keynes.
Ok, one more time. Clinton was elected in the fall of '92, he had a dem house and senate. They decided to raise taxes. in '94 reps took over both houses (the Republican revolution) the republicans lowered taxes, the economy recovered reveue increased and Clint has been taking credit for it ever since. do you remember when the government was shut down for a couple days in the mid 90s, do you remember why? the reps were cutting spending (but only over Clinton's dead body, so to speak)
I followed that. That wasn't my question. First you went saying that Bush rightly lost in '92 but then complained about Clinton.
I suppose that if the GOP hadn't FUBARed everything, we wouldn't be in the position where we'd be facing the prospect of Dems controlling Congress and the White House, now would we? The Republicans didn't cut spending to go with those nifty tax cuts of Dubya's. Instead, they beat the Iraq war drum while we were still busy in Afghanistan hunting for Osama bin Laden - you know, that guy the CIA trained to help fight the commies in Afghanistan during the aforementioned invasion in '79. Borrowed and spent our way into a hole halfway to China, and turned a blind eye to the shenanigans on Wall Street we're now paying to fix.
One thing I don't understand is how people are harping about the Dem-controlled Congress we have now. For one, people act like it's the cause of the financial mess we're in, but the subprime meltdown got under way in mid-2006 when the Dems were not in control. And even now, the Dems only control ~55% of the House and their control of the Senate is tenuous at best (49-49 with two independents who vote with the Dems...most of the time - see also: Lieberman, Joe - whose name is dirt with Dems these days anyway).
BTW - Don't know if you've picked up on this or not, but I am not a Democrat. Independent, and damn proud of it.
At first, you say that it's better that Ford lost (in other words, that it's better that Carter won), but then you say that Carter made it worse. Your statement is contradictory.
No, it is not contradictory.
If Ford wins the US goes into a recession and Ford loses the 1980 Election putting a Democrat in power.
If Carter wins the US goes into a recession and Carter loses the 1980 Election putting the Republicans in power.
Obviously it was better that Ford lost because it left the Republicans in power for 12 years.
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