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I don't live in Europe. I did for a few years in Italy and France so when I stayed I got to travel and see all the neighboring countries including the Netherlands. I am trying to save as much money here in the US for my retirement nestegg as possible. I was just saying that when I visited I really liked Italy, specifically Aosta and the Langhe of Piemonte. I am biased though Europe may be my retirement destination though.
True, corruption is bad in Italy. People still don't understand that in Italy life is very different from region to region. Northern Italy basically carries the whole country.
This could be a conspiracy theory but I truly believe Italy is just trying to break every EU rule to get kicked out of the ridiculous union that damages the poorer countries way more than the richer ones.
By the way, my reference to banking falls under "amenities" part of her post and taxation would fall under the "income to cost of living ratio". Taxation is a huge factor in determining the net income you get to play with and is definitely part of the "cost" of living.
what's so bad about retiring in the USA?
I agree it's unfair to put whole italy in the same bag since corruption is more well spread among southern italy than north.
Apologies for the late response (we've been travelling a lot). While I've been to Nice and to the Lake Como region, I don't know Aosta and Piedmont, in general. I suspect that it's best to earn income in the U.S. and be taxed as a U.S. citizen (even when living abroad while working or in retirement).
Italy is beautiful, but decaying. I really suspect, having travelled from the north on down to Rome, that corruption and bureaucracy have brought this rich land to its knees. The legacy is charming and endearing, the slow pace appealing (from a tourist perspective), but living there would be extremely frustrating, once you take off the rose-colored glasses and put down the blindly idealized chick-lit. Flying from Milano to Munchen/Munich, you could not have seen a more striking contrast of airports and cities.
I very much agree: taxation is a big factor in the ratio of income to cost of living. I recognize that it's a social contract (implicitly), to pay high taxes for generous social services. And I understand that people will disagree on the proper balance/value of taxes spent for those services. I suppose that I would prefer lower taxes (who wouldn't?), with a highly accountable government (good value for taxes). Just dreaming? From the outside, Switzerland seems to have its act together.
I forgot to thank you for the Galicia Guide link--great site! I would definitely like to see Spain. I suppose a city with good business activity, historic preservation, a university and reasonable cost of living (relative to income) would be my ideal. Madrid is too expensive. Galicia seems nice, but is it a bit too quiet? We're young-ish (mid-30s). Any cities in Spain that might be good to consider?
I'm from Southern California (Pasadena). Love the area, weather, lifestyle, although cost of living got out of hand (real estate prices, which haven't come down much in the desirable areas). I suppose I'm looking for adventure abroad in Europe for a few years.
Riviera...I'd be curious about us living in Valencia, Barcelona, Aix-en-Provence, or Piedmont, as a young couple with kids. I know almost nothing about Sardinia and Corsica--open to hearing more. Malta seems interesting, even if a bit overcrowded. I've even given Croatia some thought, although it seems to depend too much on tourism, and inflation has gotten out of hand...
Quote:
Originally Posted by jja100
This is a tough question because you want a job, family, good quality of life, and good weather.
I can only get you 3 of the 4 things.
For Europe I can get you the family, good quality of life, and good weather but not the job. For the US, southern CA specifically, you can get the job, family, and weather.
So, for Europe on those 3 things it would have to be the Spanish, French, or Italian Riviera, Southern Italy/Malta, Sardinia, Corsica.
For SoCal the best areas are from Thousand Oaks to Calabasas (the coastal region covering Ventura and LA counties), Orange County, and La Jolla in San Diego county.
This is pretty much it. If you can land a job in Switzerland, than more power to you. Then you will have everything but weather, it can get a bit nippy.
Avoid Germany. I'm from Germany and now living in the United States. There is no country that hates children that much than Germany. Neighbors are permanently complaining although it is totally natural that babies and infants are loud. In general you should stay in the United States if you want to start a family, seriously. E.g. some European countries such as Germany tax both couples so that it won't pay off that both parents work.
European teenagers don't have as much respect for their parents as in the United States and they stricly follow trends. Everyone who does not care has to struggle for years. Teens have way more rights and liberties in terms of sex and drugs which you, as an American, may don't like.
Avoid Germany. I'm from Germany and now living in the United States. There is no country that hates children that much than Germany. Neighbors are permanently complaining although it is totally natural that babies and infants are loud. In general you should stay in the United States if you want to start a family, seriously. E.g. some European countries such as Germany tax both couples so that it won't pay off that both parents work.
European teenagers don't have as much respect for their parents as in the United States and they stricly follow trends. Everyone who does not care has to struggle for years. Teens have way more rights and liberties in terms of sex and drugs which you, as an American, may don't like.
What German city are you from? What do you think of living in Munchen or Augsburg--preferably in the greener parts (suburbs or small town outside)? Ideally, with 2-3 kids, we could have a small house/townhouse, making neighbors' complaints less of an issue. I've heard benefits and social services in Germany encourage having children--is that not true? Disrespect, sex and drugs are issues here in the U.S., too, but we will raise our kids to be respectful, balanced and more spiritual.
Location: New Albany, Indiana (Greater Louisville)
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I've never been to Europe but Lisbon, Portugal looks absolutely awesome. I think if I was moving to Europe I'd go for Portugal, Spain, or Italy because of the milder climate and more colorful architecture.
I forgot to thank you for the Galicia Guide link--great site! I would definitely like to see Spain. I suppose a city with good business activity, historic preservation, a university and reasonable cost of living (relative to income) would be my ideal. Madrid is too expensive. Galicia seems nice, but is it a bit too quiet? We're young-ish (mid-30s). Any cities in Spain that might be good to consider?
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Europe may be my retirement destination though.
