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Why Mitsubishi? There are dozens of manufacturers of heat pumps, no need to point out just one. Unless you sell them and this is a thinly-veiled advertisement, in which case the post should be flagged.
I agree. We used them at work to heat/cool the office and the Mitsubishi products were less reliable than the Trane models we had.
I'm a heat pump fan myself, but there are a couple of caveats. For one, experience has taught me that if you live in an area where you need to use the heat quite a bit, you need to have a house that's been built or remodeled to eliminate as much air filtration as possible. Otherwise the heat pump will never keep the house warm and you will be running the electric resistance backup constantly which is about the most expensive heat you can find.
This is true....I have a heat pump in an old house (late 1920s) with leaky doors and windows, and when it gets below about 40, the heat pump part is useless. We dress warmly in the winter inside the house, run the ceiling fans in reverse, and use electric blankets at night, or we would go bankrupt trying to pay our electric bill.
Southern California within about 20 or 30 miles of the coast comes close. (I do agree with your general sentiment). Here, during a "cold spell", our overnight outside temps may be in the low to mid 30's and our daytime highs in the 50's. Some winters we have a light freeze or two and some winters we don't.
By using electric space heaters (and perhaps an electric oil radiator or two) and electric blankets I could get by here in the Los Angeles area without a heating system in the home, but I wouldn't want to. I only run my gas forced air heat maybe 15 days during a winter, but I just wouldn't want to be without it during those 15 days. (I heat to 63 degrees).
I feel the opposite. We live in SoCal (Orange County) and we never use heat--we have it, we just don't turn it on. Yes, it gets chilly, but chilly means 50s in the house--not freezing temps. We get along with layering clothes in the house and extra blankets and night. We also installed double-paned windows, which are not standard out here. That made a HUGE difference with helping regulate heat, cold, and also noise.
It is true that my sisters who live in Washington (one in Spokane, one in Wenatchee) complain when they visit in winter that my house is so cold. But I don't want to artificially heat it. I don't like the way that feels, and really in my opinion the cold weather is not so bad and doesn't last that long. Obviously you have to deal with more severe weather differently, and people differ in how sensitive they are to heat & cold.
You say your house is all cathedral ceilings; mine is too. I stay warmer in the winter by running my ceiling fans in reverse (blowing up) at low speed. It forces the warm air trapped in the tops of the rooms to move throughout the house.
Why Mitsubishi? There are dozens of manufacturers of heat pumps, no need to point out just one. Unless you sell them and this is a thinly-veiled advertisement, in which case the post should be flagged.
I'm a heat pump fan myself, but there are a couple of caveats. For one, experience has taught me that if you live in an area where you need to use the heat quite a bit, you need to have a house that's been built or remodeled to eliminate as much air filtration as possible. Otherwise the heat pump will never keep the house warm and you will be running the electric resistance backup constantly which is about the most expensive heat you can find.
The other is that the installation cost is much greater than baseboard or ceiling/floor coil heat, and there's a higher repair and maintenance cost as well. So if you live in an area where you only need to use the for a few weeks a year the energy savings may never overcome the initial expense.
Sorry I should have been more specific. What I meant is a ductless mini-split air source heat pump of which there are really only 2 (possibly 3) real players (Fujitsu, Daikin) and Mitsubishi makes the most efficient units out there as far as I am aware. They are rated 4 COP @ 47F effectively meaning 1/4 the cost of resistance heating. These are not the kind good only down to 40F or something. They're good down to -13F although their efficiency drops to about 200% at -4F, 300% at +17F and 400% and +47F. That is the power they consume versus the heat they put out in KW.
A good DIYer could install an 18k BTU unit for $2500 (I can't, at least I wouldn't on my new home, but someone a little adventurous could). I am not a dealer but plan on installing in my own home.
Sorry I should have been more specific. What I meant is a ductless mini-split air source heat pump of which there are really only 2 (possibly 3) real players (Fujitsu, Daikin) and Mitsubishi makes the most efficient units out there as far as I am aware. They are rated 4 COP @ 47F effectively meaning 1/4 the cost of resistance heating. These are not the kind good only down to 40F or something. They're good down to -13F although their efficiency drops to about 200% at -4F, 300% at +17F and 400% and +47F. That is the power they consume versus the heat they put out in KW.
A good DIYer could install an 18k BTU unit for $2500 (I can't, at least I wouldn't on my new home, but someone a little adventurous could). I am not a dealer but plan on installing in my own home.
Thanks for the clarification as to why you specifically mentioned Mitsubishi. But the fact remains that you need a very tight thermal envelope to make it work.
And the key word here is "mini". They're not made for large spaces, so if you have a larger home you may need multiple units especially if you have cathedral ceilings.
They're good at what they do when used as they are intended to be used. My mom has one in her ~400 square foot senior apartment, it keeps the place toasty in the winter and cool in the summer and her utility bill is always small. But the downsides are that they are noisy (because the unit with the fan is in the room with you rather than in the basement or utility closet) and they take up a significant amount of wall space.
Ultimately, frugal people need to buy or build tiny super-insulated homes. If you built a tiny "Earthship" type of home (earthship.com | Simple Survival) or something like that, you could reduce your electric and gas bills to near nothing. I don't know why this sort of thing hasn't taken off yet country-wide. You don't even need to go with the brand Earthship... just copy the idea of filling tires with dirt and then plastering your walls running water and electric lines the way they do... it's simple and super insulating and far superior to traditional "stick built" structures. There's also ICF (Insulated Concrete Form) homes which do really well insulation-wise and look much more traditional.
I think the electric blanket idea is only "ok" because it is like a bandaid to a real problem; that the OP's home leaks too much energy to be comfortable (or affordable).
I'm in Denver and I don't plan on turning on the heat. BF works all the time and it's just me so I'll layer up. At night we have the Dyson heat/cool fan we'll run and have a heavier comforter on.
Southern California within about 20 or 30 miles of the coast comes close. (I do agree with your general sentiment). Here, during a "cold spell", our overnight outside temps may be in the low to mid 30's and our daytime highs in the 50's. Some winters we have a light freeze or two and some winters we don't.
By using electric space heaters (and perhaps an electric oil radiator or two) and electric blankets I could get by here in the Los Angeles area without a heating system in the home, but I wouldn't want to. I only run my gas forced air heat maybe 15 days during a winter, but I just wouldn't want to be without it during those 15 days. (I heat to 63 degrees).
I don't see how the people in the Seattle area stand it without a heating system in the home. And yes, I realize Seattle doesn't have the severe cold of Minnesota or upstate New York, but still! It's NOT Los Angeles. Perhaps I have been spoiled by so many years living in our mild weather?
Quote:
Originally Posted by saibot
I feel the opposite. We live in SoCal (Orange County) and we never use heat--we have it, we just don't turn it on. Yes, it gets chilly, but chilly means 50s in the house--not freezing temps. We get along with layering clothes in the house and extra blankets and night. We also installed double-paned windows, which are not standard out here. That made a HUGE difference with helping regulate heat, cold, and also noise.
It is true that my sisters who live in Washington (one in Spokane, one in Wenatchee) complain when they visit in winter that my house is so cold. But I don't want to artificially heat it. I don't like the way that feels, and really in my opinion the cold weather is not so bad and doesn't last that long. Obviously you have to deal with more severe weather differently, and people differ in how sensitive they are to heat & cold.
We are opposites only in the sense that I wouldn't want to be without a heating system in my home and you would (as you don't ever turn yours on) and we live in an almost identical climate. But we are probably both on the "cold house" end of the spectrum - you further along it than I. I believe only a rather small minority of folks heat to only 63 degrees, as I do. But a much smaller minority would be able to accept "50's in the house". It works for you and you are used to it.
Do you use a space heater or heat lamp in the bathroom for showering? If you do not I would say you qualify as a true polar bear! My house was 68 this morning and I used the ceiling heat lamp for showering. It was only on for about 30 minutes (shower, shave, brush and floss) so the cost was negligible.
I find that turning the heat up in the early morning to get that super chill out of the house works wonders and allows you to keep it low the rest of the day. Also dressing for the weather helps -- wool is your friend. Go to the thrift store and get a good Pendleton wool shirt -- wear layers underneath and wool socks. Still -- no one should be shaking or miserable with the cold. I am frugal but sensible. Also hooded sweatshirts are great because keeping your neck warm helps preserve heat. Sometimes I wear a neck scarf in the house -- it's cozy feeling.
After fingers and toes, my neck is always cold. I'm thinking of buying some dickies.
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