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Another joker in the deck against NYC/DC/CHI/LA/SF is their collective overpriced housing for normal working people.
Anymore; with the Internet, de facto free Long Distance telephone service (no more of that ZUM crap in SoCal, etc) as well as many people whose job skills work almost anywhere (mechanics, physicians, police officers, nurses, plumbers, etc)-------I see little point in living in any of the above overcrowded cities.
That leaves places like Phoenix, Las Vegas. Houston, Dallas, Atlanta, etc. (warm winter) and Denver, Mnpls-St Paul, Indy, etc. (cold winter) as viable options.
Vegas is as overpriced as Cali now, actually moreso with the lower income base...average home price in Vegas(500,000). I think if money were no object, more people than you think would prefer the cultural and dynamic hustle and bustle you get with NYC and Chicago...I personally couldn't live in anyplace but NYC and Chicago at this point. That's just my preference. And those cities you mentioned as preferable are worse in many ways, besides Twin cities and Indy..Phoenix, Vegas, Houston, Atlanta, and Dallas are more sprawling than the others you mentioned, which at least have a higher core density. How about smaller cities/college towns for those sick of sprawl, or maybe even small towns? Can you honestly say Houston, Dallas, Atlanta, or Phoenix are alternatives to sprawl?
. Philadelphia has been losing population and status for many years, and is a non-player,becoming entirely dwarfed by NYC at this point.
I have to take issue with this, because you're grossly misrepresenting the picture. Philadelphia has certainly lost population as a whole, but looking at Center City (downtown) Philadelphia individually, it's been gaining popluation every year. This amounts to the 3rd largest downtown in the country behind only NY and Chicago. That's not something that San Francisco, Los Angeles, Atlanta, Houston, Boston nor Dallas can claim. Clearly something must keep drawing people there:
Philly may have also lost some attention due to the rise of Sun Belt cities, but it's still VERY relevant on a national scale, if only for its importance in American history. Not to mention it's the cultural and economic center of the fifth-largest metropolitan area in the country.
As for New York, it has been experiencing an inflation in real estate and cost-of-living for some time now. Philly has become and will continue to be the urban living alternative for a fraction of the price, as it is 90 miles away and just over an hour by train. Real estate opportunities abound, and it's right up the alley for someone looking for the urbanity/density of Chicago without the severe weather:
I would have to say San Francisco would be your only other option. If you could afford it, then that would be your safest bet. I don't think any other city comes close.
Philadelphia has been losing population and status for many years, and is a non-player, becoming entirely dwarfed by NYC at this point.
duderiono made some excellent points, just to follow a bit.
One could argue that any city not named Tokyo is dwarfed by NYC? Chicago would be a dwarf if it were 75 miles from NYC.
Philadlephia has its problems but its downtown is approaching a population of 100,000 and will be 125,000 by the year 2025. As a whole Philadlephias population decline has leveled off at 1.5 million. Philaldephia is alot of things(both good + bad) but a non-player certainly isnt one of them. If I had to take a guess- say 100 years into the future- due to Philadlephias impressive past infrastructure and its proximity to NYC and DC it just might be the next in line for the next truly great cosmopolitan city of the usa.
What is it with you guys and pizza, so funny! You'd think it was a leading indicator of civilization, mmmmm- quite
If you are from Chicago, it is! We once made up a song to the tune of "The Twelve Days of Christimas" about Champaign, Chicago's little step-child in downstate Ill.
I have to take issue with this, because you're grossly misrepresenting the picture. Philadelphia has certainly lost population as a whole, but looking at Center City (downtown) Philadelphia individually, it's been gaining popluation every year. This amounts to the 3rd largest downtown in the country behind only NY and Chicago. That's not something that San Francisco, Los Angeles, Atlanta, Houston, Boston nor Dallas can claim. Clearly something must keep drawing people there:
Philly may have also lost some attention due to the rise of Sun Belt cities, but it's still VERY relevant on a national scale, if only for its importance in American history. Not to mention it's the cultural and economic center of the fifth-largest metropolitan area in the country.
As for New York, it has been experiencing an inflation in real estate and cost-of-living for some time now. Philly has become and will continue to be the urban living alternative for a fraction of the price, as it is 90 miles away and just over an hour by train. Real estate opportunities abound, and it's right up the alley for someone looking for the urbanity/density of Chicago without the severe weather:
I stand corrected.....I've seen the city drop in rankings over the years per Phoenix and Houston, and heard that the inner city was having trouble attracting a inner density of gentrification in the DT area. Philadelphia has always been damned as well by being within earshot of NYC, like Milwaukee/St. Louis/Indianapolis per Chicago. Any city so close to a world-dominant city would have trouble establishing its own persona, let alone thriving. That NE area was established long before the automobile, so cities there are far closer than they are in any sector of the country. The Inquirer has also hd many articles over the years portraying Philly's demise. I do hope that they can get Center City to take off, much like the south or west loop in Chicago. Our first Mayor Daley was much like Mayor Rizzo, in that he was willing to do whatever it took to get Philly going. Mayor Daley bulldozed many neighborhoods, white and black, to get rid of delapidated housing in the core, and make room for future gentrification, that his son consolidated later in the 90's. Its very difficult to get that critical mass of folks back to the city. It took many years here in Chicago......everything has to be on the one..theater districts, condos, parks, recreation in general......then it seemingly overnight clicks, and you have that teeming mass in the center. I wish the best of luck to Philly in making that happen for themselves.
I just read the daily news article per renting a 1,200 sq. ft. loft for 1000 a month.........I might commute to Chicago for THAT
price...thats really reasonable...I can't believe tons of NYC and Philly yuppies aren't bidding those prices up!
If you want something that somewhat resembles Chicago without the harsh weather, I would only suggest Washington, Philadelphia, Baltimore, and Boston. Chicago is much more like these cities than the Texas' sprawls and car domination. Out west, San Fransisco or Seattle would come closest.
About downtown density:
As you can see there are some other cities that have a dense downtown area although probably not as dense for the entire city.
Great chart.....note all the cities with high DT densities except Seattle are
far older....shows you that much of that is just a vestige of past usage and
infrastructure patterns
MOVE TO PHOENIX! It is just like Chicago. It's downtown reminds me so much of walking down Michigan Ave in Chicago. It is such a cool town. You can drive 100 miles and see stripmall after stripmall for ever and ever! It is so great! Just like Chicago or N.Y.
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