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I don't really know the actual boundaries for the Mason Dixon line but I think this map will have a good representation of real Northern and Southern territories from back in the day;
This gives a better idea about where the line was generally meant to be.
Exactly.
And if you notice, the Ohio River is the boundary between the South (Red) states of Kentucky and Virginia and the North (Green) states of Illinois, Indiana and Ohio.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyingwriter
It doesn't always go along state lines. There is a lot of Southern culture north of the Ohio river.
You mean in like a city such as Cincinnati, right?
That's true, but being on the borderline for a cultural region would mean it would be influenced. Look at Pittsburgh, it's got Northeastern and Midwestern characteristics.
The line does run on the Ohio River officially. Now where the influence of Southern culture can extend to, that is debatable for locations in any borderline state.
The official line doesn't run it's course through Illinois, IMHO.
not sure how youd figure that, just another line posted up randomly. there is no cultural shift around that line in most of the states it runs through (and bisects)
Yea, but the 36 30 line was put up to separate slave states and free states, and it goes all the way across the country.
Apparently I live in the south and have never seen any line that separates the south from the Midwest.
Places in extreme northern Ohio have worse drawls than we do, while places in the south, specifically areas in Georgia and Alabama, have no drawl at all.
AKA
It doesn't matter. There are rural "southern" people all over America and urban people at our lowest latitudes.
We're no longer confined to dirt roads and horsebuggies. The south doesn't have a beginning or an ending, neither does the north. Nowadays there is a mix of everybody all over. I've met extremely "non-southern" people in rural GA and some of the most "Good Ol' Boy" type people I've met north of 45 degrees in latitude.
Apparently I live in the south and have never seen any line that separates the south from the Midwest.
Places in extreme northern Ohio have worse drawls than we do, while places in the south, specifically areas in Georgia and Alabama, have no drawl at all.
AKA
It doesn't matter. There are rural "southern" people all over America and urban people at our lowest latitudes.
We're no longer confined to dirt roads and horsebuggies. The south doesn't have a beginning or an ending, neither does the north. Nowadays there is a mix of everybody all over. I've met extremely "non-southern" people in rural GA and some of the most "Good Ol' Boy" type people I've met north of 45 degrees in latitude.
Great post. I would argue that what is referred to as 'southern culture' occurs the further one tends to gravitate from an interstate highway corridor, at least as it pertains to the current environment of the Mason-Dixon line region, and arguably nationally. Consider where that line is located between PA and MD today. The inverse effect, if anything, is what I have experienced, traveling away from Baltimore northwest, once you get into Pennsylvania, that's when the confederate flags begin to emerge. As you go into the urban I-95 corridor section of Maryland, these symbols will dissipate. The northeast urban/rural, red state/blue state divide isn't by state, it's by the I-95 corridor. Rural areas are more pronounced in the western part of Maryland or central PA, as you continue to trend away from I-95. So that imagined Mason-Dixon line isn't really a linear east to west one, separating north and south, but the opposite. It kind of runs North North East to South South West. The Appalachain Mountain range might be more of a boundary, culturally, than the Pennsylvania-Maryland state line.
As it pertains to in a geographical sense, the Mason Dixon Line is situated latitudinally at 39° 43' 11" North, at the point in which it ends before West Virginia. It's actually about 14" further north at the 'wedge' section of the Delaware/MD/PA boundary. If you extend this line into the midwest, and to Illinois, the following map gives you a reference of where 39° 43' 11" is (just below the capital, Springfield).
Yea, but the 36 30 line was put up to separate slave states and free states, and it goes all the way across the country.
no it wasnt, missouri, kentucky, virginia and maryland were all slave states and were all north of that line. the 36 30 line simply made the border between north carolina and virginia (both slave states) and then was extended west to form the border of kentucky and tennessee (both part of the previous two states). missouri was a slave state as well, and the bootheel dips below that line.
however the missouri compromise did make it known that kansas wouldnt be a slave state because it was north of that line. however the territory below it was not a state but indian territory, and the current border of oklahoma and kansas is further north of the 36 30 line. a map of the slave territories has already been posted.
also, it doesnt go all the way across the country, you notice from oklahoma to arizona the line is north of the 36 30, although it is parallel, and obviously it doesnt go through california.
Last edited by JimmyJohnWilson; 05-21-2010 at 12:04 PM..
IMO Illinois does have southern Characteristics. Cairo is far closer to Memphis than Chicago. Not to mention it's south of Paducah! Always felt southern influence in Indiana too.
I have a friend from Freeburg in Southern Illinois and she definitely has a Northern accent. The line is further South, probably South of Carbondale & Marion
There are southern influences in much of the midwest. Ohio, Indiana, Illinois and southern Michigan seem to have the most southern influence of all midwest areas because those places were the destination of southerners moving north for jobs in the early 20th century. Alot of the auto workers in Detroit were southern transplants, heck there are several old country songs that reference this fact. To this day there are blue collar suburbs of Detroit that seem to have a bit of a southern drawl to them. There is one city down that way called Taylor Michigan, people jokingly call it "taylortucky". This is due to the large number of people who moved there from Kentucky during the mass migration north. I live out in the center of Michigan far from Detroit and the automotive areas, and even here many people I know (myself included) are the decendents of people who moved north during the boom days of Michigan. Having said that, the midwest is still the midwest. No part of Ohio, Indiana, or Illinios is southern. Just because there are southern influences does not mean ANY part of the midwest is south of Mason Dixon. (as pointed out earlier, mason dixon seperates only Maryland and Pa anyway) Here in Michigan we may have some historical southern influence, (like Il, Ind and Ohio do) but your much more likely to hear the phrase youbetcha, than Yall. After all, this IS the midwest, so its midwest culture that is dominant.
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