Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I just wanted to address this post. I think that holds many black teachers back is how they speak. As long as they use any sort of ebonics in their speech patterns, they will be undesirable as educators in a good school system. What parent wants their child picking up ebonic speaking patterns? I cringe every time a black manager pronounces "ask" as "axe". Children mimic the adults around them. So of course parents want their children taught by people who speak English well and properly. Slang and ebonics are for outside of school time.
But isn't it interesting that the MANY Asians who do not speak proper English or whom speak in a very clippy/choppy manner are not vilified in the same manner?
I wonder if Asian teachers are held back for pronouncing "R" as "L" as many Asians are known to do. I once worked at a company with an Asian female manager (of a different department) who had such poor English skills that it made her very difficult to understand her in conversations and in meetings.
But isn't it interesting that the MANY Asians who do not speak proper English or whom speak in a very clippy/choppy manner are not vilified in the same manner?
I wonder if Asian teachers are held back for pronouncing "R" as "L" as many Asians are known to do. I once worked at a company with an Asian female manager (of a different department) who had such poor English skills that it made her very difficult to understand her in conversations and in meetings.
This is a good point. There was a black woman at my job a few years ago who was in an administrative position. She was smart and a hard worker and had the potential to move up. I heard second-hand that the manager didn't want to give her more responsibilities, which would have entailed working with our client departments and going to meetings, because of the way she spoke. She said "axe" and "mines" and the other mispronunciations usually associated with black people.
However--some of the people she would be working with were foreign-born engineers with heavy accents--Indians, Pakistanis, Russians, Chinese, you name it. While it probably would have been to her advantage perception-wise to management to be a little more careful about how she spoke at work, I believe that was not a fair reason to hold her back. She would have been good at the job. She eventually left for another company.
In short, there are those individuals who just don't want to live around any Black persons, no matter what the content of character is.
You got it Green_Mariner
There are exceptions to the rule but for the most part that is the case. I don't like to sugar coat stuff and we can have a discussion for days so when I made the first comment naming specific groups as the cause of white flight I really should have included White people first on that list.
Look, the underlying issue typically begins as an economic issue (Jobs going away/ tax bases become less thus effecting schools in the tax depressed areas). It's a domino effect. Once you got money problems in families, other things begin to roll down hill. Now some people Families split apart.
I generally think there are a lot of misconceptions when it comes to when, where and to what extent white people started moving out of cities and that the reasons are multitude and complex and trying to distill it down to "white people left cities to get away from x race of people" is, in and of itself, a racist supposition.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mightyqueen801
However--some of the people she would be working with were foreign-born engineers with heavy accents--Indians, Pakistanis, Russians, Chinese, you name it. While it probably would have been to her advantage perception-wise to management to be a little more careful about how she spoke at work, I believe that was not a fair reason to hold her back. She would have been good at the job. She eventually left for another company.
People naturally give some slack to people who speak english as a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th language. Most people in a professional environment understand that learning another language is difficult and that someone from a non-english speaking country isn't going to have the same command of it as someone who grew up in the US and don't assume it's because that person is less intelligent or less capable.
OTOH, when english is your only language and you don't have a very good command of it people make assumptions (right or wrong) about your professional capabilities. We all grow up with accents and slang and a dialect particular to the place we grew up in but most of us learn to tone it down by adulthood.
I have a black friend who's mother owns an insurance agency and even she, as a black person, wouldn't hire minorities who spoke in slang or sounded too "urban." Her policy was that when a person called her business they should not be able to identify your race over the phone.
As far as white flight, I do think there's racism involved in that phenomenon, but I also thing people just prefer to live amongst their own. White and Black culture are very different, even when you neutralize socioeconomic status.
it common nature to want to live with your own kind, like the scottish clan. so is white flight still around, yes. I myself want to live my own kind, my own style of people, and yes i will move if i have too, in a heartbeat, its not racism or discrimination, its human nature.
White flight is caused by rich liberals promoting diversity... However what they don't tell you is they only like diversity in other neighborhoods. They will tolerate a certain amount of diversity in their own neighborhoods as long as that diversity is upper middle class. If it gets too diverse they will leave, hypocrites...
Of course this is just my opinion. I do think people are happier in most instances when they live around their own kind. This is not racist, it works both ways. Look at ferguson, MO. A mostly black neighborhood patrolled by a mostly white police force, how messed up is that? I am glad for diverse cities and all they offer but choose not to live in one. I do not think it is a bad thing for people of all races to have their own places to live if they choose not to live in a diverse city.
it common nature to want to live with your own kind, like the scottish clan. so is white flight still around, yes. I myself want to live my own kind, my own style of people, and yes i will move if i have too, in a heartbeat, its not racism or discrimination, its human nature.
If this is the case, then why are there many non-Whites moving to White areas? Why do so many Blacks who have money and good jobs move to predominantly White areas?
l lived in Ferguson MO for twenty-plus years. Before that my family lived in St. Louis city. Until the mid 1950s we lived four to a bedroom in my grandma's house because there was a serious housing shortage after WW-II and returning soldiers couldn't find a place to live. Finally homes were available at affordable prices out in the suburbs so we moved. Grandma died and my aunt moved into her house. For us in the suburbs, new highways made the commute easier. Fast forward 20+ years...kids grew up and out of the home. Parents were aging and were faced with empty nests. Some downsized or went into apartments or retirement homes. Some moved in with kids. Some just died. Lots of homes came on the market this way...not as much 'flight' as it was an aging process. These houses were more affordable as resales than newer homes being built. There was a lot of people engaged in White Flight where race was a factor but not as many as is assumed. The ''white flight'' issue is much more complex than some folks think.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
