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Old 10-31-2014, 02:50 PM
 
Location: Someplace Wonderful
5,177 posts, read 4,789,609 times
Reputation: 2587

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This is something I've been mulling for some time now. We are a nation of laws. Yet it seems that as such, we find our only recourse is through the legal system, which is based upon law.

So if there were no law against murder, under what authority can government prosecute for murder?

Same goes for robbery, rape, and jaywalking.

Granted, all of these things are immoral. But morality does not equal legality or illegality.

Anyone?
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Old 10-31-2014, 02:53 PM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,868 posts, read 24,380,865 times
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Loss of revenue for the remainder of that individuals life, that would be one way. Pain and suffering, for rape.
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Old 10-31-2014, 03:56 PM
 
Location: Someplace Wonderful
5,177 posts, read 4,789,609 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Loss of revenue for the remainder of that individuals life, that would be one way. Pain and suffering, for rape.
Both assume appropriate laws covering those specific circumstances. Besides which, those are civil matters not criminal matters.

I believe that after the mortgage meltdown, congress passed a law making it illegal to lend money to someone who could not afford to repay the loan. Which is probably why we cant go after those who did so.
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Old 10-31-2014, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Twin Cities
5,831 posts, read 7,708,200 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckmann View Post
This is something I've been mulling for some time now. We are a nation of laws. Yet it seems that as such, we find our only recourse is through the legal system, which is based upon law.

So if there were no law against murder, under what authority can government prosecute for murder?

Same goes for robbery, rape, and jaywalking.

Granted, all of these things are immoral. But morality does not equal legality or illegality.

Anyone?
I don't follow. Are you suggesting that the government be allowed to prosecute people for legal acts? Why? The legal system should be used to resolve legal matters.
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Old 10-31-2014, 04:23 PM
 
7,280 posts, read 10,945,411 times
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People can be prosecuted for violations against the Constitution. Specifically, a person could be prosecuted to taking away one's right to pursue liberty and happiness.

There are many laws that in and of themselves are grounds for prosecution. If the murder itself wasn't against the law, the laws applying to use the use of the weapon could be used.

It would be a simple matter, impose the same penalties for other law violations as for murder. It becomes an argument of semantics, theory and intent but in the end, if the penalty is the same, the who, what, when, where and why don't really matter too much.
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Old 10-31-2014, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Twin Cities
5,831 posts, read 7,708,200 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack Knife View Post
People can be prosecuted for violations against the Constitution. Specifically, a person could be prosecuted to taking away one's right to pursue liberty and happiness.

There are many laws that in and of themselves are grounds for prosecution. If the murder itself wasn't against the law, the laws applying to use the use of the weapon could be used.

It would be a simple matter, impose the same penalties for other law violations as for murder. It becomes an argument of semantics, theory and intent but in the end, if the penalty is the same, the who, what, when, where and why don't really matter too much.
The Constitution is law.
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Old 10-31-2014, 07:40 PM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,868 posts, read 24,380,865 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckmann View Post
Both assume appropriate laws covering those specific circumstances. Besides which, those are civil matters not criminal matters.

I believe that after the mortgage meltdown, congress passed a law making it illegal to lend money to someone who could not afford to repay the loan. Which is probably why we cant go after those who did so.
There was no law associated with a wrongful death claim. Ask OJ. Its a civil matter
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Old 10-31-2014, 08:16 PM
 
Location: Wyoming
9,724 posts, read 21,228,721 times
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If there was no law against it, it couldn't be prosecuted. In some circumstances another law may be broken that one could be prosecuted for, such as kidnapping, assault, etc., but one can't be prosecuted for a legal act.
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Old 11-01-2014, 11:22 AM
 
Location: El Paso, TX
3,493 posts, read 4,551,135 times
Reputation: 3026
Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckmann View Post
This is something I've been mulling for some time now. We are a nation of laws. Yet it seems that as such, we find our only recourse is through the legal system, which is based upon law.

So if there were no law against murder, under what authority can government prosecute for murder?

Same goes for robbery, rape, and jaywalking.

Granted, all of these things are immoral. But morality does not equal legality or illegality.

Anyone?
I believe in the concept of natural rights. In it is in our nature to protect our lives and that is why even in a very primitive group today or thousands of years ago the protection of life was important. Some of those groups may not have a 'written' law against murder but I believe anyone that harm the safety of security of group members were dealt with.
Heck, I believe penguins do have some type of social expectations and do punish those that violate them. Do they have written laws to punish wrongdoing?

Why is jaywalking immoral? I do not think the act per say immoral. It may be a safety concern and society may think it is necessary to have such law.

As far as morality equating legality or illegality, that is an interesting comment. Many laws are based on moral views. Others may be based on utility. Others may be based on needs whereas others may be based on other issues like economic promotion.

In some of those cases people may label jaywalking as immoral because people disobeyed a law. When is disobeying a law immoral? Is a subjugated and abused group wrong by breaking a law that oppresses? Is civil disobedience immoral?

I suppose that you can somehow attach morality to anything because any subjective topic is based on personal views; they are not objective like trying to argue whether 2+2=4. Take care.
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Old 11-05-2014, 07:18 PM
 
Location: Fredericksburg, Va
5,404 posts, read 15,990,921 times
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If there is no law against is, why would it be prosecuted?
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