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Old 05-09-2016, 01:23 AM
 
Location: Somewhere below Mason/Dixon
9,470 posts, read 10,800,718 times
Reputation: 15971

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoppySead View Post
Who exactly do you think could play the bobble head for this capitalist society? Just how do you think we've built America? On the backs of others would be the correct answer. History lesson, we're a young and stupid country based on greed as a method and motivator for our economy. We have no social obligations in government. Money is our great motivator. What did you think it would come down to???? Morals? lol There are no morals in capitalism.

You can either hire a businessman for our capitalist throne, or you can hire the socialist and change the job of our government. Either way change is what people want, and it's the American way to make it happen. It's just another revolution. I doubt it will ever return to how it was. Bank bail outs and healthcare mandates were the last straw. Camels back is broken.


Socialism does not work and it never has. Before you cite the Norwegian nations as an example of how it can be here just remember we are not them. We are not a small nation, we do not have a homogeneous society and we already have a lot of social problems. Most nations that have socialist systems fail, if you know history you already know that. Also the transition to socialism in the USA will not be peaceful, a huge part of the population will never accept it. Its likely any attempt to change to a socialist system will cause a civil war. The movement toward socialism in the past 8 years has already caused unrest (race violence, violence at Trump rallies, occupy movement), and people now speak about things that once no one would. (secession, rebellion etc)

 
Old 05-09-2016, 01:49 AM
 
17,614 posts, read 17,656,125 times
Reputation: 25677
One can be an intellectual without being an elitist. Some intellectuals have an elitist attitude and tend to look down upon or talk down to those they feel are beneath them. Why would a voter wish to vote for one who looks upon them with disdain and disgust? Being an intellectual does not make one a good leader. A good president will surround himself with good people who can advise the president. These people should generally be intellectuals with a vast knowledge of the field they're appointed for. A good politician will speak to the voters. If you look upon the voters as stupid ignorant people, then this attitude can show regardless of the words used.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 03:00 AM
 
Location: New England
2,190 posts, read 2,232,387 times
Reputation: 1969
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielj72 View Post
I agree with other posters who say that we Americans distrust intellectuals. That is true. However Donald Trump embraces what looks to be complete ignorance and yet the people love him. You cite President Bush (two I assume) as another example of this. There is a big difference though, President Bush was an intelligent man, one who could really make some public speaking gaffs (similar to Vice President Biden). President Bush could speak in a way though that related to the regular folks. President Clinton could too, yet he was really intelligent. Both Bush and Clinton seemed to be the kind of guys you could have a beer with, yet both were quite capable (no matter what you thought of their policies). This ability to be real and relate with the regular folks is why they both got return trips to the White House. Trump is a new phenomenon. He is likely to be incompetent, and yes he speaks as if he is in grade school. He acts as if he is in grade school as well with his petty feuds, and soon he may have his hands on the nuclear football. He will be the face of our nation to the world, and yes the world we see us in the light they see him. This scares me to death. I don't understand why people don't see this. I get that people hate PC, and this is in some way a rebellion against the politically correct society. I am all for bringing down PC as I hate it as well, however just spewing ignorance is not what we need. We need someone who will say it like it is, but they need to be right about what they say and they need to display some tact and decency. There were other qualified candidates but yet this populist movement has taken over the republican party and put a circus carney in charge of the party. After watching this happen I am concerned that the movie "Idiocracy" is prophecy and not just a movie.
I 100% agree with you. George W. Bush probably wasn't the best example to use. Sure its easy to look in hindsight and criticize Busch for Iraq and the financial crisis however the man was far from an idiot. In fact Bill Clinton is just as much to blame for some of the neo-conservative policies that allowed 2008 to be such a bad recession. One thing that I admired about Bush was his behavior after 9/11. He worked to bring the country together even visiting a mosque to quell any sort of hate/violence towards Muslims after that fatal day. Trump is doing the exact opposite spewing hatred and fear.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 03:02 AM
 
17,614 posts, read 17,656,125 times
Reputation: 25677
Quote:
Originally Posted by tysmith95 View Post
Hey if it snows where I live than global warming must be a farce. All of these damn unbiased scientists trying to tell us the truth, they must work for the big oil companies and the liberal elite!
I'm very skeptical of the global warming or global climate change. I don't doubt that the climate is changing, it's always changed. I'm skeptical of the scientist who promote and push this program. For more than 50 years there have been intellectuals who've declared some climate emergency based upon the scientific evidence they'd found. Global warming, an oncoming ice age, a global warming, and now climate change. Back in the early 1970s some intellectuals were saying there would be famine because the earth could not support food enough to feed the growing population and that within ten to twenty years the earth would run out of oil. The more bold the claim, the more skeptical I become. Do you know why some preachers are almost always yelling a fire and brimstone type sermon? It's to put enough fear in their faithful that they'd be willing to part with their money handing it over to the preacher. I dare say some or most of these scientist are the same way. Government research funding, published books and magazine articles to expand the resume for increased salary talks with current or prospective university employer.

Sometimes people need to ask simple basic questions. For example, there were articles written that stated things like mollusk growing at a particular water level or glacier ice retreating to the point of exposing remains of a mine. The articles stated this hadn't happened since 18something. OK, if man is causing global warming and these two cases were further proof of global warming as listed in the articles then what caused the warming to have happened way back then and why did the earth cool back down again?
 
Old 05-09-2016, 03:14 AM
 
Location: New England
2,190 posts, read 2,232,387 times
Reputation: 1969
Quote:
Originally Posted by victimofGM View Post
I'm very skeptical of the global warming or global climate change. I don't doubt that the climate is changing, it's always changed. I'm skeptical of the scientist who promote and push this program. For more than 50 years there have been intellectuals who've declared some climate emergency based upon the scientific evidence they'd found. Global warming, an oncoming ice age, a global warming, and now climate change. Back in the early 1970s some intellectuals were saying there would be famine because the earth could not support food enough to feed the growing population and that within ten to twenty years the earth would run out of oil. The more bold the claim, the more skeptical I become. Do you know why some preachers are almost always yelling a fire and brimstone type sermon? It's to put enough fear in their faithful that they'd be willing to part with their money handing it over to the preacher. I dare say some or most of these scientist are the same way. Government research funding, published books and magazine articles to expand the resume for increased salary talks with current or prospective university employer.

Sometimes people need to ask simple basic questions. For example, there were articles written that stated things like mollusk growing at a particular water level or glacier ice retreating to the point of exposing remains of a mine. The articles stated this hadn't happened since 18something. OK, if man is causing global warming and these two cases were further proof of global warming as listed in the articles then what caused the warming to have happened way back then and why did the earth cool back down again?
You make some good points. I think there is a difference between someone who poses legitimate questions to the presence of global warming i.e. Ted Cruz and someone who dismisses global warming as a lie created by the Chinese in order to make US manufacturing more competitive. However I believe we can all agree that is in the best interest of our country to work towards securing energy independence. Renewables and alternative energy sources, along with continued drilling, will help make this country stronger.

Personally I take global warming seriously. This is because even if there is a 50% chance that global warming is true and the scientists are right that is enough to do something. There aren't many downsides to pursuing the development of renewable energy sources, only the upside of energy independence and less harm to the environment. I think increasing the gas tax so that it fully funds our road infrastructure would be a good option. It could be combined with tax cuts for the poor/middle class so that we don't pay more taxes. However the American voter hears the word Gas Tax and immediately denounces it without much thought about the pros/cons of its implementation. The gearhead in me hates the idea of a gas tax so I can understand the skepticism towards one, however even the gearhead in me understands that roads aren't free.

I understand why some would be doubtful about global warming. None of us are climate experts and few of us personally know a climate expert. You've always got to be objective when absorbing information.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 03:46 AM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
10,065 posts, read 7,235,755 times
Reputation: 17146
I don't know how much "grit" it really took to succeed when you were born to one of the most prominent real estate developers in New York and decide to go into real estate yourself. Fred Trump may not have "given" Donald a ton of money but being the scion of the old man certainly couldn't have hurt Donald's rise in Fred Trump's company. Fred loaned him an awful lot of money over the years and guaranteed a lot of his early real estate deals. Donald borrowed against his father's trust to get him out of bankruptcy more than once.

Donald Trump has done one thing successfully without a doubt, and that is sell the brand of Donald Trump. It's not surprising that translates well to a presidential campaign in an era when people have no patience to listen beyond 30 seconds or read beyond 140 characters.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 03:53 AM
 
Location: Oregon, formerly Texas
10,065 posts, read 7,235,755 times
Reputation: 17146
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielj72 View Post
Socialism does not work and it never has. Before you cite the Norwegian nations as an example of how it can be here just remember we are not them. We are not a small nation, we do not have a homogeneous society and we already have a lot of social problems. Most nations that have socialist systems fail, if you know history you already know that. Also the transition to socialism in the USA will not be peaceful, a huge part of the population will never accept it. Its likely any attempt to change to a socialist system will cause a civil war. The movement toward socialism in the past 8 years has already caused unrest (race violence, violence at Trump rallies, occupy movement), and people now speak about things that once no one would. (secession, rebellion etc)
Northern European economies work because their people want them to. It has nothing to do with their small size or homogeneity. Do you think Germany was always "homogeneous?" It has only been a country since 1871! The U.S. pre-dates it by almost 100 years! Before that it was dozens or hundreds of principalities. Somehow they were able to unify that.

Sweden has 9.8 million people - about as many as Burundi and Dominican Republic. If small size = ease of implementing social safety nets than why is Burundi not a paradise?
 
Old 05-09-2016, 04:11 AM
 
Location: New England
2,190 posts, read 2,232,387 times
Reputation: 1969
I'm amazed at how there aren't many trump defenders angrily commenting on this form. I was expecting a barrage of angry comments. However it seems like a good chunk of the commentators on here basically agree with what I was trying to convey in my first comment.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 05:50 AM
 
Location: Type 0.73 Kardashev
11,110 posts, read 9,810,680 times
Reputation: 40166
There is a definite segment of the populace that is deeply distrustful of education. These tend to be social conservatives (emphasis on the 'social') because social conservatism revolves around an embrace of the social status quo and education is information which is a path to new ways of doing things.

These people are so distrustful of education/information that they send their children to private schools or they home-school them to shield those children from information that they find threatening - evolution, sciences that all clearly demonstrate that the Earth is old, history that doesn't jibe with their favorite ancient holy book, etc.

They're afraid of information and they deeply distrust people who advocated learned consideration of things. They prefer instinctual reactions, regardless of the negative consequences that might ensue - in the final analysis, they would rather feel good about a course of action even if that course of action is ill-advised and produces worse results than one produced by well-informed reasoning.

Reason and facts and the world which deals with these things - education, intellectualism - is their enemy. And certain politicians are happy to dumb it down and rail against the 'elites' ... ... in order to pander to these folks.
 
Old 05-09-2016, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Texas
38,859 posts, read 25,531,346 times
Reputation: 24780
Lightbulb American Voters Anti-Intellectual?

Trump has activated the know-nothing "religious right" in a manner that hasn't been seen in many election cycles. But I think he'll have no success attracting anyone else. Even within his precious GOP there's a lot of resistance to his nomination.

It'll be a very entertaining campaign this fall. Look for some solid Dem gains.

But anti-intellectualism is nothing new.

It brought us such big hits as slavery, women banned from voting, and prohibition.

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