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I posted this thread in the Chicago suburb section as well but I wanted to see if any of you had any suggestions/comments that might be helpful? See below please....thank you!
We are planning on installing a fence on our property in the next month or so. I have been researching what is the best wood to use and western red cedar keeps popping up as the best wood that lasts. Has anyone recently gone through this process recently that cares to share any tips or pointers on what to look out for, what not to do, what is the best wood, or care to share any good companies to use in the chicagoland area? We are moving to La Grange area if that helps any....thank you in advance!
I posted this thread in the Chicago suburb section as well but I wanted to see if any of you had any suggestions/comments that might be helpful? See below please....thank you!
We are planning on installing a fence on our property in the next month or so. I have been researching what is the best wood to use and western red cedar keeps popping up as the best wood that lasts. Has anyone recently gone through this process recently that cares to share any tips or pointers on what to look out for, what not to do, what is the best wood, or care to share any good companies to use in the chicagoland area? We are moving to La Grange area if that helps any....thank you in advance!
I've rebuilt a few backyard fences with 4x4 redwood. The one thing that is very important is to reinforce the wood with something like a metal pole. What you do is bolt a a pole to the 4x4, in parallel so as when you sink the 4x4 into the cement base, the pole is also sunk in with it. The pole is both in the cement and above the ground. WHen the 4x4 eventually rots at ground level, the metal pole will retain the rigidity for the whole post. It is really easy and it works.
We are planning on installing a fence on our property in the next month or so.
If the fence is on a property line, make sure what the future looks like.
Built on your part of the property, entirely *your* responsibility.
Built *on* the property line, you need to make arrangements with your neighbour.
In our case, we *shared* the cost AND labor.
Then there are the different ways, of assembling/building the fence.
The *good neighbour* one.
The *looks good* from your view point only.
The looks good from the neighbours point of view.
I have been researching what is the best wood to use and western red cedar keeps popping up as the best wood that lasts.
There is wood fence material, and there is wood fence material.
Cheap stuff will not last that long compared to the *good* stuff.
The material that is pressure treated correctly is what you should be looking for.
The wider the boards, the less work to assemble/build.
Has anyone recently gone through this process recently that cares to
share any tips or pointers on what to look out for, what not to do, what is the best wood,
or care to share any good companies to use in the chicagoland area?
Just my opinions.
Place the fence posts and follow the advice of one of the posters above.
There is a really easy way to anchor the posts.
Dig a hole, use the dry stuff that you just shovel into hole all around the post, and then add water later.
The stuff dries rather quickly and NO mixing required.
We did not use wooden posts, but the round metal ones.
Do NOT forget to add the gravel in the bottom, for drainage !!!!
We built the *good neighbour* type. The metal poles are now *hidden* behind each section.
If the fence is to the street, make sure, the horizontal beams/rails are *on your side*,
else kids can climb on the beams.
Do some planning and when you *plan* the upright parts,
put a small space in between the boards.
The top of the fence can be whatever the boards look like or
you can place a *cap* on the fence that is secured from post to post.
Put at least three horizontal beams/rails all along the fence to secure the boards to.
Use *outdoor* type screws to secure the boards to the horizontal beams.
Figure out where you will put the screws, and *pre-drill* the holes before you attach.
LBNL, if there is grass right next to the fence, apply killer stuff,
so you do not have to trim right underneath the fence.
We are moving to La Grange area if that helps any....thank you in advance!
You asked about *good company to use* ....
If you are *having this done*, forget all the above, and just make sure you are getting what you pay for.
See if he has pics on what it looks like after it is all done.
What is the height of the fence you want to have in the end ???
We have a short (height) fence between the drive way and the yard (for the sake of the grand-kids).
We used ready made iron type stuff, and it took 2 hours to install 50 feet of it !!!
Between the properties, we use wood (looks good and a bit more privacy ...)
irman, sorry should have been more clear...I am not doing it myself, I am going to hire a fence company...I just want to make sure I choose the correct wood and that it that will last. There are also composite fences now...not sure if I should go that route either? So I should also make sure the company adds a metal rod into the cement along with the wooden post?
If you have an HOA, be sure to check for all their rules concerning fences. We had an HOA that dictated the type of wood (no composite or vinyl), the height, the setback from the front of the house, which side the "nice" side had to be on, etc. etc.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gunner0325
irman, sorry should have been more clear...I am not doing it myself, I am going to hire a fence company...I just want to make sure I choose the correct wood and that it that will last. There are also composite fences now...not sure if I should go that route either? So I should also make sure the company adds a metal rod into the cement along with the wooden post?
2" steel pipe isn't going to be cheap. That probably does enhance the structure a good bit, but it isn't strictly necessary. A successful tactic in my neck of the woods is to coat the portion of the posts that will be below grade with tar before pouring the concrete around it and ensuring that the concrete around the base of the post is mounded to prevent water from sitting in contact with the wood.
I would probably not tolerate a contractor pouring dry concrete into a post hole and filling it with water. It may work fine but you have no control over your slurry that way and if I'm paying for labor I want the labor to be worth paying for. Also, that far north heaving is going to be a concern and you will want to know that you have a good cure in the footing. Get familiar with your local building codes to ensure that they dig deep enough for the posts. Insist that a permit is pulled (assuming a permit would be required).
I love the look of cedar. To me, it is one of the most beautiful woods and ages extremely well... BUT - low quality cedar (such as one finds in the lumber section of Home Depot) isn't necessarily going to outperform untreated pine in terms of weather resistance. There are things you can do to extend the working life, however. Ask this sub-forum's resident expert about a product called Total Wood Protectant. If I get a wild hair I'll post a picture of a four year old fence that was treated with TWP on the day it was completed. Still looks like it was completed yesterday.
Properly treated southern pine lumber or posts will last for a hundred years even when in contact with the wet soil (For above ground use, the amount of preservative required is 0.25 pounds per cubic foot- for ground contact the amount of preservative is increased to 0.40 pounds per cubic foot).
Just make sure that the treating is certified with a stamp or label from the AWPB (http://global.ihs.com/news/temp/standards/AWPB.html).
The heartwood of western red cedar and Alaska cedar are known to be very decay (and insect) resistant and will also last for a long time (not a hundred yrs.). However, the sapwood of cedar (white in color and the second growth cedar (often lighter red than normal) do not seem to possess the same level of decay resistance as the heartwood of old growth. Much of the cedar available today contains some sapwood, which will decay within a year or two.
You could put in a cedar fence (the "show" part) and the structural part is treated pine. I think the cedar has a better look as it ages, but will need occasional checking for weathering damage (especially where they contact other boards- these areas tend to harbor moisture for long periods of time. And ground contact- like the bottoms of the individual planks) as the fence ages because fence boards are usually not the highest quality wood to begin with.
Also, even though the chemicals we use for treating are not entirely without environmental risk (we use copper and chromium), the fact that the wood will last for 20 times longer than untreated seems to justify their use.
Treating/sealing should be relegated to PT-and as soon as possible. Don't wait a year or 6months like some believe. Cedar can be sealed but, it "performs" better without. The best sealant on the market right now-
http://cart.mfgsealants.com/products/TWP-200-Series.html (broken link)
So, for a low maintenance fence I highly recommend PT. If you want/need to keep up with the Jones, go for the cedar.
Things to ask from a fence company-
W/C Insurance
General Liability Insurance
Lien waivers
and most importantly- You should negotiate a one (1) year warranty for material and construction. A fence needs to go through all seasons to acclimatize the wood. A PT fence will have a few renegade planks and possibly a post. A good company will know this and should stand behind their work. Of course there's no guarantee that the replacement will be any better but...
Did a fence 3 yrs ago at our old house in Cary, IL Used Action fence Action Fence Contractors, Inc.
(they work all over chicagoland) They were great, fence was built fast and well. We used Cedar, It looked great, got stain from Lowe's and stained the fence ourselves. Our old Neighbors said its 3 yrs later and still looks brand new.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimboburnsy
I would probably not tolerate a contractor pouring dry concrete into a post hole and filling it with water. It may work fine but you have no control over your slurry that way and if I'm paying for labor I want the labor to be worth paying for.
The dry stuff is NOT just dry concrete.
It is some special stuff especially made to be used like that (as described above). Forgot the name ...
Location: Visitation between Wal-Mart & Home Depot
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irman
The dry stuff is NOT just dry concrete.
It is some special stuff especially made to be used like that (as described above). Forgot the name ...
I'm definitely not a concrete expert and am relying heavily on knee-jerk intuition, but I've played around enough to be convinced that concrete is not that difficult to screw up if the water ratio isn't right. I wasn't aware that there was a mix specifically for the application.
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