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Old 08-31-2013, 06:25 PM
 
Location: Knoxville
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In my area you can get them for next to nothing - even big ones.
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Old 09-03-2013, 07:50 AM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barking Spider View Post
Too bad they are an energy nightmare......
With storm windows, they are just about as efficient as modern windows.
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Old 09-03-2013, 09:07 AM
 
Location: The beautiful Rogue Valley, Oregon
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Except that with new windows, you can open them anytime during the year and you don't have to climb a ladder twice a year while carrying a huge heavy storm window (a task I remember doing). Frankly, that trumps the "esthetic" argument for me. Love my new casement windows and would immediately replace any old-style windows with them (and happily take the energy efficiency rebate the utilities here offer).
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Old 09-03-2013, 09:46 AM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW-type-gal View Post
Except that with new windows, you can open them anytime during the year and you don't have to climb a ladder twice a year while carrying a huge heavy storm window (a task I remember doing). Frankly, that trumps the "esthetic" argument for me. Love my new casement windows and would immediately replace any old-style windows with them (and happily take the energy efficiency rebate the utilities here offer).
I currently have old triple-track aluminum storms. They work all year. But, they are very ugly, so someday, I'll be replacing them with wood storms. (though I haven't explored all my options, yet) They would hang from the top like traditional storms, but they make special hardware that attach to the side, and allows them to awning out in summer. (you could even leave them open when it rains--unless it's really windy)
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Old 07-07-2015, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Mount Monadnock, NH
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I know this is an old thread, but I wanted to directly answer the question regarding when the sash and counter-weight (rope and pulley) windows stopped being installed in new construction homes.
Well, is is going to depend a bit on what area of the country you're talking about, but they were still being installed in new buildings well past the end of WWII actually, though one-unit type double-hung windows began to take over in the 1950s.

I have seen a number of houses built in 1951-55 which had, originally, 'rope and pulley' windows through-out. My former high school had a large addition that was built in 1955, that also had large wooden sash and rope/pulley windows (most were replaced in the 1980s, though). But, it seems as though by 1957-1960 they were quickly disappearing from new construction here in the US.

However, with the post-war building boom (starting in 1945), a lot of new materials entered the house building industry due to the massive increase in demand. The steel and aluminum pre-fab window units, often in the casement style were popular in the 1930s thru 50s, and you see them used extensively on earlier post-war homes. Wooden or aluminum double sash windows on tracks w9th tension or spring mechanisms were around in the 1950s, but seem to had overtaken the traditional rope and pulley ones in the middle to later 1950s.

They do last a long time, if properly maintained--I still have some in my house, which was built in 1892.
On the other hand, rope and pulled windows were developed in the mid-18th century, though they were not common until the mid-19th century here in the United States. Double-hung windows traditionally had sashes on wooden tracks, with no mechanism. One would lift the lower sash and as a stick or shim to hold it up---the upper sash was typically nailed in place. Around the time of the US Civil War counterweight window mechanisms became more common in houses, though not universally. They were more expensive than ordinary sashes on tracks, but they were also very desirable. Either kind will last a very long time, in excess of 80 years. Finding the parts can be a challenge, though places like eBay, Craig's List, even building salvage places can stock the pulleys, weights, etc.
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Old 07-07-2015, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Texas
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We had a supplier that still made them for new and replacement windows up until 1992. My last new home that we used them was 1991 and they were weatherstripped as good as anything out there today. Cost was out there though and obviously high. We are still able to have replacement wood window units made and yes, they are expensive.
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Old 07-07-2015, 07:50 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
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I use the weights as decoy anchors on my long lines of sea ducks.
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Old 07-09-2015, 12:05 PM
 
Location: Mount Monadnock, NH
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and I will add, the period from 1930 to 1960 saw substantial changes in the kinds of materials (and methods) used in house construction and remodeling, at least here in North America. The post-WW-II housing boom is really what caused a lot of these changes, with the sudden drastic increase in demand for new homes.
Pretty much all of the materials that became commonplace in new homes after 1945 existed for some time before, but their use was not widespread, or was only beginning to be, competing with more traditional materials and methods. The need to build a great quantity of houses quickly really necessitated certain materials be used which would speed up the building process and/or cut costs.
Probably the most important of these materials was drywall: it had been used here in the US well before 1945, but it competed with traditional lath and plaster for about twenty years...Drywall began to be used in building construction in America around 1920, but it didn't even start to overtake plaster until about 1935-1940...the housing boom all but eliminated traditional lathe and plaster or old-type plaster=board as the usual materials. Drywall could be installed and finished off much faster than plaster, required less skill and was a little cheaper. However, before 1945 drywall came in 4'x4' sheets---right as the housing boom got underway, the standard 4x8 foot size we are familiar with today came into being...this was done so to cut down on installation and finishing time: a lot of the post-war houses had 8 foot ceilings, so the 8x4 sheets could be installed without much cutting or taping halfway up, as would be so with the older 4x4s.

The other very important material to come into widespread use after WWII was plywood. It certainly existed before, but its use in home building was fairly limited until the 1950s. Even as late as 1960 the traditional plank or tongue and groove house roof/wall sheathing and sub-flooring was being used, but plywood was quickly outpacing it in the later half of the 1950s. Plywood had the advantage of quicker installation, slightly cheaper and was sold in a number of standard thicknesses and sizes for various purposes.

The other significant one would be electrical wiring: before 1945 rubber and/or rubber-cloth wire insulation and sheathing was standard, but right around 1948 plastic (PVC) wire insulation quickly replaced the old as the standard kind of wire insulator, though the outer sheath of cables remained cloth until about 1962, when plastic also replaced it. Armored cable was also used extensively in the 1940s and early 50s in houses, but the cloth or plastic sheathed cable was cheaper. Plastic/bake-light electrical boxes did not appear until about 1950, but they did not see widespread use until the mid-1970s.
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Old 07-14-2015, 11:19 AM
 
Location: Mount Monadnock, NH
752 posts, read 1,492,851 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrapperL View Post
We had a supplier that still made them for new and replacement windows up until 1992. My last new home that we used them was 1991 and they were weatherstripped as good as anything out there today. Cost was out there though and obviously high. We are still able to have replacement wood window units made and yes, they are expensive.
Yes, you can still have new wooden sashes milled by a woodworker, though you're likely to pay a haft price for them! On old or historic house restorations, often it is desirably (or mandated) to keep the old wooden windows and not simply replace them with standard plastic/wooden double pane units.
So, restorers will take any sashes in need of replacement to a craftsman and have new ones milled as replacements. If done right, they will last a very long time. Good new replacements are milled using hardwood and not standard pine or new-growth softwoods, as they will rot much quicker.

Before about 1900-1920 or so (depending on the area of the US you're in), window sashes were made from dense old-growth woods, and that is at least part of the reason for their longevity. So, modern replacements should be made from a hardwood of some kind, even then the new growth lumber might not last quite as long as the originals made from old growth did.
I saw an older restoration (c.1979) where many of the windows were modern replacements, high quality milled sashes to replace the old ones on a Civil-War era house in New England. Well, by 2010 or so, they were holding up alright, but many were already showing signs of some rot and were in need of repairs. So, after thirty years they were holding up alright, but not a well as the originals would had. Nonetheless, if properly maintained, they will last several decades, which is much more than the regular vinyl replacement window units.
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Old 07-14-2015, 11:43 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,327 posts, read 60,500,026 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Austin023 View Post
Yes, you can still have new wooden sashes milled by a woodworker, though you're likely to pay a haft price for them! On old or historic house restorations, often it is desirably (or mandated) to keep the old wooden windows and not simply replace them with standard plastic/wooden double pane units.
So, restorers will take any sashes in need of replacement to a craftsman and have new ones milled as replacements. If done right, they will last a very long time. Good new replacements are milled using hardwood and not standard pine or new-growth softwoods, as they will rot much quicker.

Before about 1900-1920 or so (depending on the area of the US you're in), window sashes were made from dense old-growth woods, and that is at least part of the reason for their longevity. So, modern replacements should be made from a hardwood of some kind, even then the new growth lumber might not last quite as long as the originals made from old growth did.
I saw an older restoration (c.1979) where many of the windows were modern replacements, high quality milled sashes to replace the old ones on a Civil-War era house in New England. Well, by 2010 or so, they were holding up alright, but many were already showing signs of some rot and were in need of repairs. So, after thirty years they were holding up alright, but not a well as the originals would had. Nonetheless, if properly maintained, they will last several decades, which is much more than the regular vinyl replacement window units.

Yep. Our windows are 100 years old, at some point the counter weight system was removed, but the windows remain.
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