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I currently have a house that has masonite siding over black press board, nailed to framing. I want to install a high grade insulated vinyl on the house. I think it will be best to remove the masonite, install house-wrap and put up the vinyl, but I am concerned that the black press board & insulated vinyl will not be very strong. Should I remove the press board and put up an OSB type board / plywood and then the wrap & vinyl? OR, should I just put up the vinyl over the masonite?
I would suggest taking it all down to the studs. You can look to see how much insulation you have in the walls too. Depending on the age of the home, it may have the old steel wool insulation that had a whopping R6. You may also find that the builder used the impregnated sheathing and hardboard siding as the rack control. If so, you'll need to either inlet 1x 4 bracing or use the Simpson steel bracing. Unless you take it down, you'll never know and the hardboard will fall apart under the vinyl siding leaving it loose and wrinkled over time. Start from the studs and you'll know exactly what you have.
I would suggest taking it all down to the studs. You can look to see how much insulation you have in the walls too. Depending on the age of the home, it may have the old steel wool insulation that had a whopping R6. You may also find that the builder used the impregnated sheathing and hardboard siding as the rack control. If so, you'll need to either inlet 1x 4 bracing or use the Simpson steel bracing. Unless you take it down, you'll never know and the hardboard will fall apart under the vinyl siding leaving it loose and wrinkled over time. Start from the studs and you'll know exactly what you have.
Mineral Wool and Rock Wool are basically the same thing with different names. It's made from steel slag. When I first got into the industry I was loading apartment buildings with Gold Bond Steel Wool insulation. Seems the politically correct name is now mineral wool. I've never been very politically motivated.
Depending on the age of the home- that black insulating board may also be structural grade. The only way you'll know for sure is to do a little investigating. If the corners of the house are sheathed in plywood or OSB, then it isn't structural. But, if the corners are sheathed with the black insulating board check the imprint on the board- if it's structural it will say so. If there is no indication or imprint visible you'll have to dig further into the wall and see if there is diagonal let-in bracing as mentioned before.
If you do have some type of structural component, just cover with housewrap, and install siding. If you can't determine a structural element- remove the sheet at the corners and replace it with OSB.
If you have any wall that is over 30' in length, somewhere mid-span where there are no windows or doors you will need a full sheet there.
Thanks for the advice. Based on your responses, I probably should have added in a bit more detail: The house is a Colonial with an attached garage. The front, side w/out garage and garage face are brick, but the back, FL room on back and side where the garage meets the house are masonite. My guess is that there is no OSB or plywood on any of the corners. Does this change you response?
That black board could be that fiber stuff they used in the early 1970s. It is horrible stuff. Wicks water and feeds mold. If so you need to remove it. However it may well just fall apart when you rmeove the dising anyway.
Prsoanlly I think it is nuts to use OSB ont eh exterior of a house. OSB is not really OSB it is flake board. real OSB is hard to find and expensive. Flake board does not hold up well to moisture. Better than it used to, but I woudl not put it in my house. (In fact I had a strict rule that they could nto use it at all - even made them remove it when they ignored me). That stuff is awful stuff.
That black board could be that fiber stuff they used in the early 1970s. It is horrible stuff. Wicks water and feeds mold. If so you need to remove it. However it may well just fall apart when you rmeove the dising anyway.
OMG! Run for the hills- We're all doomed. That's what happens when people spout misinformation.
Black board; or more specifically Fiberboard, when properly installed and protected from the elements by an exterior grade sheathing absorbs little if any water because it's impregnated with asphalt. Which also doesn't really promote the growth of mold.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldjensens
Prsoanlly I think it is nuts to use OSB ont eh exterior of a house. OSB is not really OSB it is flake board. real OSB is hard to find and expensive. Flake board does not hold up well to moisture. Better than it used to, but I woudl not put it in my house. (In fact I had a strict rule that they could nto use it at all - even made them remove it when they ignored me). That stuff is awful stuff.
Did ya hear the one about OSB isn't really OSB? Well, you know what that means?
There are literally millions of homes that are on the verge of collapse.
"Flake board" is a generic term for OSB (Oriented Strand Board)- like Klennex is to tissue, and Windex is to window cleaner.
"Flakeboard" on the other hand is the name of a company that makes hardboard, MDF (Medium Density Fiberboard), particle board and waferboard. Waferboard looks a lot like OSB- EXCEPT, it is not structural!
OSB is a structural manufactured panel. Depending on the final thickness of an individual panel, there are at least 7 layers of wood chips that are aligned in a perpendicular manner for each layer. All the chips are coated with resins and other proprietary ingredients and are then pressed under significant pressure to bond together. The finished product has similar properties to plywood, but is uniform, more stable, and cheaper. When tested to failure, OSB has a greater load bearing capacity than milled wood panels. And if anyone was ever taken a close look at a cross section cut of plywood you will see voids within the panel.
OSB actually came about as a way to solve a growing environmental problem. What to do with all of the scrap, and non usable/trees or tree parts. Because up until the late 70's mills just burned the stuff. The windfall was the relatively inexpensive manufacturing process.
Incorrect. Flake board and OSB are two completely different products. However Flakeboard is often sold with the misnomer OSB. (Note: Irf you want to make an issue of my leaving out the space, then you should learn to spell Kleenex before you start to throw stones).
Oriented strand board is wood made of squished trees where the resulting wood fiber strands are all oriented in the same direction. It is made up of long sinuous fibers all aligned in the same direct and held together with glue. It is extremely strong and durable and it is not sold in Home Depot or Lowes. You can readily identify real OSB by looking at it. However odds are, you have never seen OSB.
Flake board or chip board or whatever name you wish to apply is made up of small flakes or chips of wood squished together with glue. The grain fibers are not oriented. The flakes or chips are aligned in all different directions. They are not long fiborous strands, they a readily defineable chips or flakes of wood. This is not OSB, but for some reason they can get away with calling it OSB. This is what they sell in Home Depot or Lowes and use on many modern construciton sites.
Does that mean the houses will fall down? Only very rarely. It does mean that I would not want to live in those houses. It also means that those houses are more likely to have long term problems, especially if the flake board is used on the exterior. Are million s of houses on the verge of collapse? Doubt it. Are millions of houses suffering or on the verge of suffering from expensive problems? Absolutely. That geenrates a lot of my income.
Here is a simple and cheap test. Buy two sheets of "OSB" and two sheets of plywood. Leave them laying in your back yard for two years. put them on somethng and jump on them. The plywood will still be structurally sound, the "osb" (flake board) will break if it does not simply fall apart when you pick it up.
Another intersting test, but more difficult, is to hurl a 2x4 at 60 MPH at a sheet of plywood and at a sheet of flake board. See what happens. Then decide whether you still want OSB.
Flake board "OSB" is fine if it never gets wet or stressed and you do not care how long your house lasts as long as you get 10 years out of it.
Real OSB is actualyl quite strong and is a decent match for plywood. Stronger in some ways and almost as strong in others. Real oSB is not made of flakes. It is made of strands.
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