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Immigrants per se are not the problem we are discussing, the problem is the unforeen ILLEGAL population crossing our borders and you as a military person should be one to understand this, so what part of ILLEGAL are you not seeing. America was a country built on true immigration not the wanton flaunting of our laws that exist today. I for one would like to know that our government cares enough about us to have a record on each person we allow to partake in this glorious country, the people who truly want to become an American and live here, obey our laws, make a contribution and thrive. I don't want people here who are only on the taking end, who desecrate our flag, break our laws and think the government has no right to say they can't be here. I don't mind helping out the other guy and our home has always been open to all who have needed help but I won't harbor anyone who has broken our laws or who would not help others if the situation were reversed, I won't help those who take part in social services when they have no need for them and thereby deprive those who really have a need from getting that help. I've seen illegals who are making more than $1000 a week (off the books income) with one child still claiming WIC benefits...........is this fair or right in your eyes? It happens everyday and is now more the norm than an aberation of the way ILLEGALS work the system and I am tired of my tax dollars going for this. I miss the place I grew up with a very mixed immigrant population, we truly learned about people of all nations and all worked toward becoming "American" alas that is no more............now it is "I am here ILLEGALY and I am here to take what you OWE me, your laws don't apply to me and my allegiance is only to my home country, I will not pay taxes to a goverment that is not mine and will not become a dirty American dog like the rest of you" Sorry but that is not what I believe immigration is, the older generations of immigrants came here looking to make a contribution and find oportunity and a better way of life for themselves, sadly that is no longer the case.
Location: In an illegal immigrant free part of the country.
2,096 posts, read 1,469,347 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Veteran60
I seriously question how "a country that prides itself as a nation of immigrants" allows itself to be duped by uninformed, bigoted, and racists like the author of this post. I also now wonder why I spent the bulk of my adult life in the military and fought in two wars to defend the right of people of his ilk to have the freedom to express his misguided opinion. It is probably the overreaction of a coward who is afraid he might have to compete in the job market against persons who are better prepared for, or are willing to take, jobs that he either cannot, or will not do. Nevertheless, it is high time that all Americans wake up and admit that had it not been for our immigrant forbearers he or she would probably be much less fortunate than they are today.
Get real, people! We have no legitimate reasons to shun today’s immigrants who only desire to live freely in what used to be “the greatest nation on earth.”. 99.999% of them are honest, hardworking people seeking the American dream. They are not terrorists and they pose no threat to our nation. The only people they might threaten are those of us who have the inability to compete with them in our capitalist marketplace. Let them come and let them contribute to the diversity that made our nation what it used to be and it can be once again.
You have it all wrong. We are "a country that prides itself as a nation of LEGAL immigrants" and we are sick and tired of not only supporting but being duped by anti-American, bigoted and racist illegal immigrants that have no respect for this country. Those that invade our borders do not want to assimilate yet demand everything they have no right to. As a veteran how do you feel about them desecrating and flying the American flag upside down, the very symbol of what you fought for?
I am sure we all would be very interested to know if you would support America adopting Mexico’s immigration laws.
I for one, hope that the majority of our soldiers are serving to defend and secure America and not the citizens of foreign countries.
Wow. There are literally unlimited numbers of ways to get into America and stay with impunity—and all of it legalized by this bill. I wonder what purpose is served by all the pages of this thing. I mean, are there any methods of actually stopping illegal immigration in this proposed legislation? What astronomical costs must have been assigned out of taxpayer contributions to pay for the actions of all those in government who participated in this colossal waste!
Wow. There are literally unlimited numbers of ways to get into America and stay with impunity—and all of it legalized by this bill. I wonder what purpose is served by all the pages of this thing. I mean, are there any methods of actually stopping illegal immigration in this proposed legislation? What astronomical costs must have been assigned out of taxpayer contributions to pay for the actions of all those in government who participated in this colossal waste!
Indeed. Thank goodness grassroots America responded with such moxie and reined the Senate in short before they completely destroyed those of us whose lives would be most affected by this onslaught--the middle class.
I seriously question how "a country that prides itself as a nation of immigrants" allows itself to be duped by uninformed, bigoted, and racists like the author of this post. I also now wonder why I spent the bulk of my adult life in the military and fought in two wars to defend the right of people of his ilk to have the freedom to express his misguided opinion. It is probably the overreaction of a coward who is afraid he might have to compete in the job market against persons who are better prepared for, or are willing to take, jobs that he either cannot, or will not do. Nevertheless, it is high time that all Americans wake up and admit that had it not been for our immigrant forbearers he or she would probably be much less fortunate than they are today.
Get real, people! We have no legitimate reasons to shun today’s immigrants who only desire to live freely in what used to be “the greatest nation on earth.”. 99.999% of them are honest, hardworking people seeking the American dream. They are not terrorists and they pose no threat to our nation. The only people they might threaten are those of us who have the inability to compete with them in our capitalist marketplace. Let them come and let them contribute to the diversity that made our nation what it used to be and it can be once again.
I seriously question how "a country that prides itself as a nation of immigrants" allows itself to be duped by uninformed, bigoted, and racists like the author of this post. I also now wonder why I spent the bulk of my adult life in the military and fought in two wars to defend the right of people of his ilk to have the freedom to express his misguided opinion. It is probably the overreaction of a coward who is afraid he might have to compete in the job market against persons who are better prepared for, or are willing to take, jobs that he either cannot, or will not do. Nevertheless, it is high time that all Americans wake up and admit that had it not been for our immigrant forbearers he or she would probably be much less fortunate than they are today.
Get real, people! We have no legitimate reasons to shun today’s immigrants who only desire to live freely in what used to be “the greatest nation on earth.”. 99.999% of them are honest, hardworking people seeking the American dream. They are not terrorists and they pose no threat to our nation. The only people they might threaten are those of us who have the inability to compete with them in our capitalist marketplace. Let them come and let them contribute to the diversity that made our nation what it used to be and it can be once again.
Your sentiments are probably based on a charitable heart, and for this I'll give you credit. But I bristle at the "racist" charge- I have an extensive record of past posts explaining my absolute opposition to racism. It is immoral, period. The border issue is not a "racist" issue; it is a legal and economic issue, complicated by cultural divisions. I know many Hispanics who are quite disenchanted by illegal immigration. Cesar Chavez was one (I didn't know him, but know several people who worked for him). Chavez recognized uncontrolled imigration as a threat to his union members' livelihoods.
We are not a nation of immigrants. We are a nation of the DESCENDANTS of immigrants. Big difference. You are probably correct in that the majority of us do not want to be thrown into competition with new arrivals who show up here illegally. But I believe your statement is hypocritical. I very much doubt that you leave your home or your car unlocked. I doubt that you have a homeless encampment in your backyard. The reason for this is that you undoubtedly don't want to compete with those who would enter your home or property. It's yours, you've earned it, and you don't want it open to the public. You shouldn't have to share your home with anyone, unless you invite them in.
I have strong ties to the Hispanic community. Most Hispanics that I know around here are very much against the continuation of illegal immigration. It threatens them, as it does all of us. Some of these people are the children of illegals, and I know a number of people who were THEMSELVES illegal in the past. Most of them recognize that it has to stop.
At one time America could find a place for poorly educated people with large families. There was plenty of work for anyone with a strong back. Those days are over.
America has had a tradition of immigration, it's true- legal immigration, that is. America at one time was a place where you could chop down trees all day long, build any kind of structure you wanted, beat your child, whip your horse, own a slave or two, and engage in a duel if you so desired. NONE of these features of American life survives to this day; their time has ended, and our society has passed laws so that these things are now no longer acceptable.
No decent person is advocating any ill-treatment of illegals; I've known many of them, admire many of them very much, and urge them to become legal when they can. No one realistically expects large numbers of decent families to be deported; this just ain't gonna happen. But we have every right to insist that something be done to slow down the present madness. No nation can survive indefinitely at the rate we're going. You have a right to lock your house, and we have a right to control who enters our country....period.
PS I Too am a Veteran
Thank you for your service. I fought in only one, but my father fought in three. I understand your frustration regarding having fought for the freedom of speech, but I’m sure you’re truly proud you did. Nirvana-Guy’s posts are difficult for me to stomach most of the time, but he has the right—and I have the right to counter him as often as I choose.
However, I have to disagree with you regarding immigration in our present-day circumstances. This is not another frontier to be settled; there are no more new frontiers anywhere on Planet Earth. It’s about survival now. The environmental impact on America—and I’m not addressing simply pollution, though it will be horrendous—will be disastrous if immigration is not slowed DRAMATICALLY.
The oft-used claim that they’re doing the jobs Americans don’t want to do is ludicrous rhetoric. There have always been, are now, and will always be jobs that people don’t WANT to do. And this is true in every nation on Earth. There are ways to get ALL jobs done by Americans if only we use our creativity and put a stop to elected officials in government at the US level directing traffic socially and economically.
I’m not only against illegal immigration, I’m against unfettered immigration altogether. I don’t want our resources stretched; I don’t want to import consumers to circulate funny money for the express purpose of eventually funneling it into the pockets of the plutocrats; I don’t want our nation for the most part to be one of servants; I don’t want our manufacturing of goods and services to be that of making hamburgers and lattes and selling them to each other; I don’t want to send far more capital out to other nations by buying their goods than we bring in by selling our own to them; I don’t want to see America—or any other nation for that matter—breed more consumers for the purpose of making a minority race a dominant race; and I don’t want America to become a harbor for those without the courage to clean up their own houses.
Yes, our ancestors fled Europe to escape oppression. But there was a new world awaiting. There is no new world awaiting now—ANYWHERE. There are only pastures that are either overgrazed or approaching that point. And humans, unlike the other critters in the animal kingdom, don’t pay any attention to such things as overgrazing—or fouling their own ground.
So . . . No more immigration, ESPECIALLY of the illegal type. That’s my wish. No more immigration for at least 5 years. Give the present population time to go to college and graduate or change jobs and settle in; give those in college time to finish and enter graduate school or become established in jobs; give those who will go to graduate school time to finish; give Americans time to become creative again after throwing off the smothering blanket of neoconservatism that has created such a travesty for America.
IF we need any immigrants, they can demonstrate what they can do for America BEFORE they can reside here permanently. It isn’t as if we Americans can run to another country to escape another form of oppression, one that is sure to emerge if this crashing of the gates continues. We’ll have to show what WE can do for THAT country.
Well said--a lucid, well-developed take on a very contentious issue. I can't see anything mean, nasty, or racist in your letter. This issue is very much in the news in my part of the country. As I've said repeatedly, white racists are going to be THRILLED to join you in your sentiments--that's not your fault. Those same racists might want low gas prices, too. Their actions in no way reflect on you, me, or anyone else in regards to this issue. The issue, as you so succinctly stated, is a matter of law, national sovereignty, and economic survival....good post!!
Your sentiments are probably based on a charitable heart, and for this I'll give you credit. But I bristle at the "racist" charge- I have an extensive record of past posts explaining my absolute opposition to racism. It is immoral, period. The border issue is not a "racist" issue; it is a legal and economic issue, complicated by cultural divisions. I know many Hispanics who are quite disenchanted by illegal immigration. Cesar Chavez was one (I didn't know him, but know several people who worked for him). Chavez recognized uncontrolled imigration as a threat to his union members' livelihoods.
We are not a nation of immigrants. We are a nation of the DESCENDANTS of immigrants. Big difference. You are probably correct in that the majority of us do not want to be thrown into competition with new arrivals who show up here illegally. But I believe your statement is hypocritical. I very much doubt that you leave your home or your car unlocked. I doubt that you have a homeless encampment in your backyard. The reason for this is that you undoubtedly don't want to compete with those who would enter your home or property. It's yours, you've earned it, and you don't want it open to the public. You shouldn't have to share your home with anyone, unless you invite them in.
I have strong ties to the Hispanic community. Most Hispanics that I know around here are very much against the continuation of illegal immigration. It threatens them, as it does all of us. Some of these people are the children of illegals, and I know a number of people who were THEMSELVES illegal in the past. Most of them recognize that it has to stop.
At one time America could find a place for poorly educated people with large families. There was plenty of work for anyone with a strong back. Those days are over.
America has had a tradition of immigration, it's true- legal immigration, that is. America at one time was a place where you could chop down trees all day long, build any kind of structure you wanted, beat your child, whip your horse, own a slave or two, and engage in a duel if you so desired. NONE of these features of American life survives to this day; their time has ended, and our society has passed laws so that these things are now no longer acceptable.
No decent person is advocating any ill-treatment of illegals; I've known many of them, admire many of them very much, and urge them to become legal when they can. No one realistically expects large numbers of decent families to be deported; this just ain't gonna happen. But we have every right to insist that something be done to slow down the present madness. No nation can survive indefinitely at the rate we're going. You have a right to lock your house, and we have a right to control who enters our country....period.
PS I Too am a Veteran
Very articulate and straight forward post. I wish I could give you more rep for that one, but it seems that I've got to "spread it around."
Well said--a lucid, well-developed take on a very contentious issue. I can't see anything mean, nasty, or racist in your letter. This issue is very much in the news in my part of the country. As I've said repeatedly, white racists are going to be THRILLED to join you in your sentiments--that's not your fault. Those same racists might want low gas prices, too. Their actions in no way reflect on you, me, or anyone else in regards to this issue. The issue, as you so succinctly stated, is a matter of law, national sovereignty, and economic survival....good post!!
I appreciate your comments. I wish I could make certain I was not classified by anyone as racist. I’ve been in a great many forums over the years and have experienced white Americans of a particular ideology promoting the tenet of breeding in sufficient quantities to eventually outnumber other races and ideologies. These people also insist on home-schooling to teach only “the correct way.” I’ve also read similar comments from Latinos and have read of such similar plans on the Internet and in published periodicals. These precepts involve race, but they are merely bizarre and dangerous goals that, if implemented, will do the same type of damage that illegal immigration or over-immigration will do. OVERPOPULATION IS NOT A SOLUTION FOR ANY PROBLEM! Not now, not EVER!
All people are of some particular race, so group actions by any particular race are going to be discussed overtly with racial comments or covertly by side-stepping race. It seems as though any issue that involves for the most part a group of a particular race that stereotypical attitudes automatically require racism to be assumed. It seems highly unlikely that race can be separated as an element of such an issue. At least, I haven’t figured out how to do it.
In any case, the problems in most discussions herein are about illegal immigration of Mexicans. That’s a nationality. If Americans were illegally entering Mexico then Americans would be the topic of discussion and American isn’t a race, it’s a nationality. It has to do with location. I hope I’ve somewhat clarified my position regarding race.
I will actively discriminate against bizarre and destructive ideals and actions, either potential or realized.
I do see your point about other organizations being interested in this topic (i.e. white racist types). I see this duplicity in various groups who are not normally environmentally conscious and have in the past been active in bashing environmentalists at every opportunity in various media. Now, because of the environmentally destructive actions of the gate crashers, these organizations are on the environmental bandwagon. It’s a good ploy in getting support for controlling the borders from environmentalists, and so I forgive their hypocrisy, especially if it helps both causes.
Nevertheless, it is high time that all Americans wake up and admit that had it not been for our immigrant forbearers he or she would probably be much less fortunate than they are today.
We have no legitimate reasons to shun today’s immigrants who only desire to live freely in what used to be “the greatest nation on earth.”. 99.999% of them are honest, hardworking people seeking the American dream. ...Let them come and let them contribute to the diversity that made our nation what it used to be and it can be once again.
I don't disagree about our immigrant forebears but IMO you are missing the important point that the great majority of those people entered the USA by legal means. That's not the case nowadays.
When you were in the service you were defending all that America stands for, were you not? That includes our laws (whether you agree with them or not, they are our laws unless or until they are changed or abolished). So how can you say that people "have no LEGITIMATE reason to shun today's immigrants" if those same immigrants have entered the USA illegally (broke the law) or overstayed their visas deliberately (broke the law) or have obtained fraudulent documentation (broke the law)?
I and most other people have no quarrel with immigrants who are here legally. As you say, they are contributing to the diversity that is part of America's strength. But I'm sorry, I part company with you if you're saying that the "desire to live freely in the greatest nation on earth" justifies someone deliberately breaking our laws in order to get or stay here.
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It is probably the overreaction of a coward who is afraid he might have to compete in the job market against persons who are better prepared for, or are willing to take, jobs that he either cannot, or will not do. Nevertheless, it is high time that all Americans wake up and admit that had it not been for our immigrant forbearers he or she would probably be much less fortunate than they are today.
We have no legitimate reasons to shun today’s immigrants who only desire to live freely in what used to be “the greatest nation on earth.”. 99.999% of them are honest, hardworking people seeking the American dream. They are not terrorists and they pose no threat to our nation. The only people they might threaten are those of us who have the inability to compete with them in our capitalist marketplace. Let them come and let them contribute to the diversity that made our nation what it used to be and it can be once again.
Why bother?!
