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Old 12-26-2011, 09:10 PM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,707,823 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by libertylover7 View Post
But there are a couple of really good suits buried in all that.

It is not clear. May nevewr be. But as the Drivers license moves from a license to drive to a piece of identification it gets weird.

How can one be at "liberty to travel" down an interstate where only motor vehicles are allowed? Sounds like your "Liberty to travel" requires a license. I would think that unconstitutional .
Wrong again. Liberty to travel means you can take a bus, take a train, a plane, ride a bike, walk.

The Amish travel but they don't use cars or have drivers licenses.

 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:12 PM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,707,823 times
Reputation: 22474
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvocatusCenturion View Post
And what if his wife and kids don't want to? what if they like it here where there is more opportunity? Are you willing to say it's ok to put them in the system of welfare (which costs tax dollars) or how about we just allow the father to remain and force him to pay back tax fines while supporting his family so Americans don't have to.
Opportunity for what? The only opportunity would be the opportunity for completely free health care, food stamps, WIC, government provided housing and so on.

Mexico's unemployment rate is about half of that of the USA. They have more than enough opportunity to work for a living in their own country.
 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:17 PM
 
387 posts, read 337,622 times
Reputation: 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Wrong again. Liberty to travel means you can take a bus, take a train, a plane, ride a bike, walk.

The Amish travel but they don't use cars or have drivers licenses.
And you listen very badly. The right to travel on the roads is the guarantee. And if it requires a license you have converted a right into a privilege.

We may do that. As we often do things that are actually pretty clearly unconstitutional. But let us not act like it is alright. It is not.

By the way it is the Amish who should sue.
 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:20 PM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,707,823 times
Reputation: 22474
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertylover7 View Post
And you listen very badly. The right to travel on the roads is the guarantee. And if it requires a license you have converted a right into a privilege.

We may do that. As we often do things that are actually pretty clearly unconstitutional. But let us not act like it is alright. It is not.

By the way it is the Amish who should sue.
No. The Amish should not sue because if they are citizens, they opted not to have a license.

Drunk drivers get their licenses suspended fairly often. So do the elderly, the blind, those citizens (not illegals obviously) who could never pass a driving test. If driving is a "right" then that could not be done to them.
 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:22 PM
 
Location: Earth
313 posts, read 329,672 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Opportunity for what? The only opportunity would be the opportunity for completely free health care, food stamps, WIC, government provided housing and so on.

Mexico's unemployment rate is about half of that of the USA. They have more than enough opportunity to work for a living in their own country.
Yeah and make the equivalent of $12 a day and in fear of drug cartels and other criminals.

Hey you can find work in India, but who wants to live there? I know some people from England who moved here even.

Mexico isn't America.
 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:28 PM
 
Location: NC
6,032 posts, read 9,213,226 times
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You should include DWI's in this too... Illegals around here get away with them all the time. Whats to stop you when you don't worry about insurance or a license.


 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:28 PM
 
Location: California
2,475 posts, read 2,076,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by libertylover7 View Post
But there are a couple of really good suits buried in all that.

It is not clear. May nevewr be. But as the Drivers license moves from a license to drive to a piece of identification it gets weird.

How can one be at "liberty to travel" down an interstate where only motor vehicles are allowed? Sounds like your "Liberty to travel" requires a license. I would think that unconstitutional .
I added the part you are questioning to my original comment.
 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:28 PM
 
47,525 posts, read 69,707,823 times
Reputation: 22474
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvocatusCenturion View Post
Yeah and make the equivalent of $12 a day and in fear of drug cartels and other criminals.

Hey you can find work in India, but who wants to live there? I know some people from England who moved here even.

Mexico isn't America.
Many Mexican cities have lower homicide rates than many US cities. Certainly the homicide rates of cities like Puebla, Guanajuato are much lower than Los Angeles, Houston, Dallas, Phoenix.

And if Mexicans don't like the minimum wage laws of their own country, that's up to them to work to increase them. No one is stopping them from working for improvements to their country as they see fit - after all Mexico is a democracy.

Oh - and minimum wage in Mexico is going up.
 
Old 12-26-2011, 09:44 PM
 
387 posts, read 337,622 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
I added the part you are questioning to my original comment.
It is quite different than what I responded to.

It is bigger than that though. My though project is an Amish guy who insists on his right to drive his horse and buggy on an interstate. Be interesting. They have no reason I can think of to ticket him that is not unconstitutional. And he does not even have to identify himself.

I have always thought the whole thing bad law. A license to drive should be only that. I would remove any identification other than a picture or a thumb print. Make it into a license to drive not identify who you are...which purportedly is not the issue. Why should cops get to run your name and date of birth through their computer if they stop you for a traffic offense?
 
Old 12-26-2011, 10:05 PM
 
Location: California
2,475 posts, read 2,076,622 times
Reputation: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by libertylover7 View Post
It is quite different than what I responded to.

It is bigger than that though. My though project is an Amish guy who insists on his right to drive his horse and buggy on an interstate. Be interesting. They have no reason I can think of to ticket him that is not unconstitutional. And he does not even have to identify himself.

I have always thought the whole thing bad law. A license to drive should be only that. I would remove any identification other than a picture or a thumb print. Make it into a license to drive not identify who you are...which purportedly is not the issue. Why should cops get to run your name and date of birth through their computer if they stop you for a traffic offense?
States require the buggies to be licensed. An Amish recently got a drunk driving ticket while operating his buggy. Pennsylvania DUI for Amish buggy driver
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