South Side Indy:A discussion (Indianapolis, Anderson: neighborhoods, construction, income)

[MackOnMack]

This is my first post in this forum. I came across this browsing the web and it looks very interesting.

This is something I've been wondering ever since I've been here, and which I've been here for almost 3 years

Why does it seem like the city puts the south side on the bottom of it's priorities? I'm not saying that the city never fixes problems on the south side, but it seems behind when it comes to road construction and other developments compared to the north, west, and east sides. (Not saying that the east or west side is nice.)

Look at the I-465 project that's been going on for a while. The east, west, and north sides of 465 had work finished years before, and every interstate interchange with 465 throughout the circle is really nice, and traffic jams are rarely due to the merging of traffic onto the main 3, or 4 lanes, how ever many that might be. But here's the main point of what I'm about to say. They JUST NOW started work on the I-65 and 465 interchange ON THE SOUTH SIDE. I've been a common driver on I-65 north and south, I-465 east and west near that spot, and I've wanted the construction to start ever since my first rush hour experience on it. I've driven around the loop multiple times during rush hour since I've been here, and the only spots on 465 that are consistent problems are at the South Emerson Avenue exit, and the I-65 interchange. Once again, I know I'm late because construction on that has already started, but it just seems to me like the city puts the south side at the bottom of it's priority list

That hasn't been the only thing I've noticed. (Once again, I KNOW IM LATE. Please don't attack me for that.)

On Madison Avenue as soon as you get inside the loop, the traffic lights at the Shelby Street intersection were so old and you could barely see what color the light was on when the sun was shining directly on it. The next one at Mills Avenue was the same way. The next one after Hanna, National Avenue, was the same way. The next one, Sumner Avenue, was the same way. They have replaced the lights though, and I'm glad that they did. Other traffic lights on the Madison Avenue thoroughfare south of the loop looked worn out and chipped apart, but it looks as if they've replaced most of those as well. Why so late though? Other areas throughout Indy, besides some of the central neighborhoods, have been kept up with so well. The south side has potential to be one of the nicer areas in Indianapolis, if the city would keep up with it. Everything on the south side seems to be a step below of what it should be. Just my opinion, and I feel like the south side deserves better.

[rdwoelfe]

I left the south side moved to another city, moved back but this time on a different side of town. I regularly visit my father on the south side and I see what you are talking about. I have to just take a shot in the dark here and say it is probably due to the growth of the north side, the airport being on the west side, and without the direct knowledge I have to say that the east side is due to the fact that is a major route to the east coast.

Also if you take the time to look at the population maps on this site you will notice the townships of the south side are the lowest in density other than the west side, again see Airport. If you just let the colors do the talking Decatur, Franklin and Perry Townships are less yellow than the others. Adding Greenwood doesn't offset the north side townships adding Carmel, Fishers, and Noblesville.

The south side has some great things to offer. I will always love some of the places on the south side that I used to go to as a kid, but I can see why it is last on the list.

[MackOnMack]

I like your reasoning, rdwoelfe. What you've said makes good sense. Maybe to explain your guess on the East side in a better way, I-70 is one of nations heavy traveled interstates, more so than I-65.

According to the 2010 census, (cough cough i mean Wikipedia) Franklin township has around 54,000, Perry township has a little more than 100,000, and Decatur township has only around 32,000.

Many suspect that Franklin township will be the fastest growing township within the next several years. I tend to agree with those many people, and if that's the case, do you see a debate coming up for a new 4 lane highway that would connect Franklin township with I-465 or I-74? We're seeing that kind of thing now near Avon and Brownsburg with the Ronald Regan Parkway (which is turning out to be really nice I think.) There are 54,000 living there now, which probably equals out to 21,000 or so commuters, and I do know that there aren't many office buildings or companies located in Franklin Township that employ high amounts of employers... Franklin township is almost strictly residential. I assume that's a big reason why Emerson Avenue gets to be so bad because that's the only access to I-465 that many people in Franklin township have.

Anyways, if Franklin township does grow as fast as expected, the "peaceful" two lane roads with stop signed intersections Arlington Avenue, Shelbyville Road, Southport Road, will all become nightmarish to navigate, some would say that they are already.

I'm a criminal in most peoples eyes in this sense, I like seeing new development. I see it as a sign of prosperity and economic success of the city or metro that the developing takes place. I do know that some projects are unnecessary so I'm not in favor of ALL developments... but sometimes you just need to see a nice 4 lane divided highway get built and cut commute time in half.

[John7777]

Perhaps all the decision-makers live on the northside and somehow decide to fix their side of town first?

[sweetana3]

Statistics about income seem to control investment. That is why there are two Trader Joes, two Costcos, Whole Foods, etc. only on the north side. Nothing similiar on the southside. Business owners make their decisions based on such data.

[mike0618]

Theres 4 sides to the city. One was bound to be updated first and one last. I do know that northside has so much traffic at rush hr that it needed to be done first and 465 between keystone and past michigan is still too busy for the amount of lanes of 465. Same with a few miles on the east side.

I do think the south side has been neglected as the step child of the area. Its a solud jewel where most my friends live.

And mackonmack welcome to the site i hope you post often.

[MackOnMack]

Thanks Mike, I think I just might because this seems like a cool forum to discuss cities and states as an interest.

[tjfd88]

Southsider all my life and I agree that there is much neglect in comparison to the other sides of town, though I think the South Side has it better than the West and East Sides, they seem to get bogged down by being the "hood" even though that is not entirely true. The North and South Sides don't typically get the hood label put on them, but the North Side has much more to do and more people and most importantly, more money. We take it as a chip on our shoulders, of course those rich people should have better highways and roads than us.

Of course, this mentality of the north being preferred goes way back to the early years of Indy's development. Pogue's Run and Pleasant Run limited development south of the original Mile Square (the original plat of Indianapolis) and it focused more development to the north and east. For many years the development of the city has favored north first and east second with west and south bringing up the rear, given that the industrial sector of the city is to the southwest this shouldn't be a surprise. The belt railroad that goes along the south side of Downtown Indy was yet another barrier that focused more people to the north instead of the south. It's only once the railroad was raised over the city streets such as Meridian that people began to live south of the tracks as well, but by then the damage was done. The north side was well on its way of becoming the favored side of town and the South side has been playing catch up ever since.

[hapaleeretired]

I agree with everybody who has responded to this excellent discussion. Ever try to travel east or west across the south side. There are NO avenues with turn lanes at all intersections. Ever seen Southport Road and Meridian at rush hour? All that development west of 37 funnels into two lanes at Bluff. A right turn lane at Meridian would be a LITTLE help.
Sweetana's on the money too (as usual) Greenwood was begging for a Whole Foods but doesn't meet the necessary criteria set by the store. When Walmart was built Puccini's Smiling Teeth Pizza tired the south side without success. What a shame.

[ischyros]

I agree with what's been said already. I think much of the northside and eastside (at least on 465) is due to traffic volume. A lot of 69 south traffic funnels onto 465 south to go down to 70 into the city. That gets, I think, a lot of traffic from not just the Castleton area, but Fishers and Noblesville and commuters from points further north like Anderson. I think 465 going back to just 6 lanes south of I-70 on the eastside kind of shows that reasoning.

But there are projects stalled on the northside as well. Many will tell you that I-69 should have been upgraded years ago but it's just finally being completed. And the redo of I-465/69 interchange is now on the backburner with no timetable for when it will be done, likely after the 465/65 redo is complete, which means 465 is going to be a mess for a while still.