Train to NYC (Philadelphia, Allentown, York: 2013, university, live)

[Eastonian_ABE]

Will Easton have a train to NYC soon?

[julian17033]

The very short answer to that question is NOOOOOOO.

Paco Martin will give you the details as to why.

[gwillyfromphilly]

Does Easton even have bus service to NYC?

[PacoMartin]

Yes, roughly 18 buses per day, 7 days a week from EASTON PA Bus Terminal
35 South 3rd Street

There is also bus service from two other nearby locations

WILLIAM PENN HIGHWAY
Park & Ride Rt. 33

PHILLIPSBURG NJ
Phillipsburg Mall

The train track was torn up west of Clinton NJ when I78 was built, and it will be very expensive to build a bridge. There is very limited service west of Raritan Valley anyway. I find the NJ Trains to be too slow and expensive, and they are not even worth it for a weekend trip. The buses are cheaper and faster. For a large group it pays to drive to Harrison NJ, and catch an inexpensive PATH train across the river.

[PacoMartin]

To compare trains and buses consider the closest train station from the Lehigh Valley (exit mile #18 from I78) which is 18 miles into NJ from the Delaware River.

Consider a normal commute. The first train of the morning takes 101 minutes (partly because you must change trains in Newark, where you must change to a PATH train for the World Trade Center downtown.

The fourth bus of the morning takes 75 minutes to get to downtown where it proceeds to eight different stops circling Wall Street. You get off at the bus stop with the closest walk to your office The fourth bus stop is closest to the World Trade Center. Bus time in NYC is not on a schedule since it depends on traffic, but the stops are only a few blocks apart

TRAIN: First train of the day
Depart : ANNANDALE at 5:57 AM
Arrive : NEWARK PENN STATION at 7:10 AM
Depart : NEWARK PENN STATION at 7:16 AM
Arrive : WORLD TRADE CENTER PATH at 7:38 AM

BUS: Fourth bus of the morning to Wall Street
Depart : Clinton - Annandale Sq. 6:10
Arrive: Franklin & Varick Sts. 7:25
continues on to 7 addition stops near Wall Street

Annandale Station for the train (in Clinton NJ)is about 1000 yards from Annandale Square where the Wall Street buses pick up passengers.

So, if you lived in NJ hypothetically within walking distance of the train station, you may still choose to commute by bus. Partly because there are more options for leaving early, less commuting time, and more drop off locations to minimize walking in downtown NYC. Costwise is about even.

So if the bus has many advantages from near the current train station, it will only get worse if they extend the train to Phillipsburg. The bus will still have more departure times, shorter commuting distances, and more options as to when to get off.

In some ways the train can be perceived as more comfortable, but remember the train makes 21 intermediate stops including the requirement to change trains at Newark. The final segment from Newark to World Trade Center may require you to stand as it is very crowded.

There are many discussions about improving train service in NJ, primarily by building new tunnels under the Hudson River and eliminating the need to change trains in Newark, but so far they always get killed because they are too expensive.

FOR PURPOSES OF COMPARISON: I considered a working commute to Wall Street area. Most buses go to Port Authority Bus Terminal, and many trains go to NY Penn Station. But bus always wins out by commuting time and choices of when to leave.

Personally, I see no reason to extend the train to Phillipsburg, unless billions of dollars are spent improving the bottlenecks across the Hudson River. If you are standing at the train station, and it still seems more sensible to get on the bus instead, you have a real problem with the trains.

[PacoMartin]

Just to emphasize, the train takes 73 minutes to get from Annandale Station in Clinton NJ to Newark Station.
A bus can leave from half a mile away, and be through the Holland Tunnel in the same time period.

So the train will probably never catch the bus.

[jimmyrocks]

Every few years, someone will commission a study about it. Hopefully one day, something will actually happen. There was something on WFMZ about it today:
Allentown takes the lead in calling for LV passenger rail study | Regional: Lehigh Valley - Home

[PacoMartin]

Originally Posted by jimmyrocks

Every few years, someone will commission a study about it.

Transportation studies are the meat and potatoes of government. There were over 50 commissioned regarding the San Diego airport (which is 600 acres downtown with 1 runway), and the airport will probably not move for another 50 years.

There are 20 stations on the Raritan Valley line (HIGH BRIDGE-RARITAN-NEWARK) and it takes at least 77 minutes. The trains are diesel power, and you must change to an electric train in Newark to go through the Hudson river tunnels to Manhattan. Ridership is only 12K passengers per day out of the multiple people on route 78 headed to NYC. As of right now only 7 trains per day go further west than Raritan Station.

High Bridge to Phillipsburg was discontinued in December 1983.

The Raritan Valley line as it exists is slow and inefficient. Most people take a bus who live on the line. So the idea of extending it to Phillipsburg NJ without a multi-billion upgrade is unlikely, let alone Lehigh Valley.
==========
The Exclusive bus lane (XBL) through the Lincoln Tunnel carries 1,700 buses and 62,000 commuters, mainly to the Port Authority Bus Terminal. The high ridership on the XBL is higher than New Jersey Transit's commuter rail into Penn Station
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Philadelphia desperately needs a 12 mile extension of their commuter rail from Lansdale through Souderton to Perkasie. If they haven't done that in decades, why would they even consider Quakertown or the Lehigh Valley?

[PacoMartin]

TRAIN: First train of the day
Depart : ANNANDALE at 5:57 AM
Arrive : NEWARK PENN STATION at 7:10 AM
Depart : NEWARK PENN STATION at 7:16 AM
Arrive : WORLD TRADE CENTER PATH at 7:38 AM

An advocacy group wants Raritan Valley to add dual use locomotives to the train.

Dual use locomotives will run diesel until you get to Newark and then switch to electric for the tunnels under the Hudson.

The belief is that they can cut 15 minutes off the schedule above with such a locomotive.

Personally, I have my doubts. The layover is currently only 6 minutes, and you would now have to coordinate NJ trains and Path trains so that they share a track. That would probably require all new signalling equipment.

The other problem is massive congestion in the tunnels under the Hudson. They opened in 1908.

Finally there is a problem of putting more trains that go further west than Raritan Valley. Faster service will increase ridership up to a point.

Even if you cut 15 minutes, the train would still be slower than the bus which is currently about 25 minutes faster.But it would be a first step to faster rail which might make it feasible to return train service to Phillipsburg.

[PacoMartin]

An Article on Dual Use locomotive ordered by NJTransit

These trains are already used on the Montclair-Boonton Line.

Times from Montclair State University Station to New York Penn Station
04:51 minutes= 47
05:10 minutes= 54
05:53 minutes= 53
06:29 minutes= 59
06:46 minutes= 58
07:08 minutes= 69
07:25 minutes= 56
08:04 minutes= 54
08:18 minutes= 53
08:56 minutes= 54
09:38 minutes= 62
10:02 minutes= 54
10:52 minutes= 56
11:47 minutes= 57
12:47 minutes= 55
13:47 minutes= 62
14:45 minutes= 63
16:17 minutes= 53
17:06 minutes= 52
18:03 minutes= 59
19:21 minutes= 55
20:04 minutes= 56
21:09 minutes= 56
22:25 minutes= 51
23:16 minutes= 52

You can see how some trips are longer if you can't take advantage of the dual use locomotive