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There is a structural deficit in WI, but it has very little to do with the Unions.
The public sector workers of any state factor into the budgets of any state as public sector workers are usually a type of cost center*. And since those public sector workers are represented by unions, the Unions have a lot to do with any deficit of any state. You can't take them out of the equation.
*(Some state workers do generate money, for example the V/ABC).
I think people loose sight of the fact that unions just didn't reachi in and take everything that they have. Someone was on the other side of the table giving it to them. And folks in Nassau County know it was not always the GOP.
This is why I see no need to revoke the right of collective bargining or change how unions elect their members and collect their dues. Who ever is on the other side of the table needs to bargin better on behalf of the people.
Good, this will weaken their stronghold on the country, the unions are too big anyway. They need to end this collective bargaining crap where special interest union groups are essentially blackmailing politicians with unreasonable demands, otherwise they threaten to vote him/her out. These unions in NY are the worst.. We're going on 5 years of deflation/stagflation for the majority of us, yet the unions have been thriving and getting all their raises and other goodies on the backs of struggling taxpayers. The more states that follow Walker's lead, the better it is for the majority.
You can take the $1000 in union dues per employee and put that toward their salaries. The unions extracted too much from WI, and WI is now facing a $3.7 Billion deficit. Why is there such a huge deficit? Please don't blame the economy -because you'd be wrong. It's a structural problem. Every state needs to pay these workers total compensation that tracks the CPI.
This is like a business trying to operate in a down economy, yet their costs rise 8% or whatever % above CPI every single year. Hence, why every union heavy state is facing similar massive budget deficits.
Unions are a dying breed and it's a common misconception about how big they are... Shocked someone like you would fall for the typical blurb lines.
Only 14% of employed people in WI are unionized! What backs are you breaking here - they're dying on their own.
This is a ONE HUNDRED PERCENT political move by the GOP to cripple The Dems politically... It's like Terminator, go after the source of the money. Kill the unions and clean-up in the elections. It is not about anything else.
The reason these budgets are so flipped "in union heavy states" (WI is not one of them so you need to take off your NY glasses) is because of the criminals on Wall St who destroyed these peoples pension funds. It's all misdirection.
I'm glad you see the wisdom in how Germany has handled things.
In how Germany has handled things? Do you understand how Germany has become a "strong" economy? They joined the EU and naturally devalued their currency and the cost of their exports by joining with weaker economic nations. That's like the United States joining with Canada and Mexico and rolling out a new currency that is weaker than the dollar, then patting ourselves on the back for our new found "economic brilliance."
I think people loose sight of the fact that unions just didn't reachi in and take everything that they have. Someone was on the other side of the table giving it to them. And folks in Nassau County know it was not always the GOP.
This is why I see no need to revoke the right of collective bargining or change how unions elect their members and collect their dues. Who ever is on the other side of the table needs to bargin better on behalf of the people.
Franklin Roosevelt understood the danger in allowing public unionism back in the 1930s and 1940s even while he was passing pro-union legislation. The problem is that through political donations the unions, could effectively, end up on both sides of the bargaining table. The natural triggers that control unions in the private sector, namely a business going bankrupt, don't exist on the public side. A public union and the politicians who's pockets they fill can just keep handing concessions without any fear of short term risk. However, decades of this going on has lead us to where we are now.
I think the Gov of WI is trying to not only fix the problem short term, but also make sure it doesn't happen again. However, I think he is doing it wrong. He should aim to take away their ability to bargain over salaries and benefits, while leaving public unions the ability to bargain over things like safety and job duties. Where as, Cuomo is trying to put a band aid on the problem with the goal of ruffling as few feathers as possible. However, a governing body with always run up against a loud and boisterous minority opposition whenever they push for austerity of any kind. Cuomo should take this opportunity to fix the system, or else we will be back in this situation in another 5-10 years.
Only 14% of employed people in WI are unionized! What backs are you breaking here - they're dying on their own.
This is a ONE HUNDRED PERCENT political move by the GOP to cripple The Dems politically... It's like Terminator, go after the source of the money. Kill the unions and clean-up in the elections. It is not about anything else.
The reason these budgets are so flipped "in union heavy states" (WI is not one of them so you need to take off your NY glasses) is because of the criminals on Wall St who destroyed these peoples pension funds. It's all misdirection.
It's actually 15+% and 15% too many. Wait a sec, if the whole argument for union members having defined-benefit pension plans vs. 401k type plans was supposedly because the unions "didn't want to leave their members' retirements in the hands of Wall st", then how are you blaming Wall street for destroying their pensions?!? That makes no sense.
I see how it works, they use Wall street as a scapegoat for why they don't want 401k plans, but they really are investing in the stock market anyway. It's all a front, they should just come right out and say taxpayers will cover any shortfall if we have a bad year or two in fund performance.
Again, it's a structural problem. There is no such thing as 7.5% risk-free annual gains, which the pensions use as their target. And if that target isn't reached, they force the taxpayers to cover the shortfall. Real risk-free rates are around 3%, that is what the pension fund growth rates should be based on (7-10 year treasuries, not fantasy 8%).
That's one structural problem. The other is the unions don't pay enough towards their benefits. Even with the concessions, it's well short of what is needed to balance the $3.7 Billion deficit. The concessions need to be double what they agreed to, to match what private sector workers are paying and even federal employees pay. And, the pay should be based off CPI, not self-given raises. I took a quick look at the budget, it would have been a $1.9 Billion deficit even if the economy grew at 2007 levels, so right there should be enough evidence that they are spending more on public service entitlements, than the WI taxpayers can afford.
I think people loose sight of the fact that unions just didn't reachi in and take everything that they have. Someone was on the other side of the table giving it to them. And folks in Nassau County know it was not always the GOP.
This is why I see no need to revoke the right of collective bargining or change how unions elect their members and collect their dues. Who ever is on the other side of the table needs to bargin better on behalf of the people.
Maybe I don't understand this correctly, but aren't the ones on the other side of the table in an unholy marriage with the unions. Ya know, union bosses give big campaign donations to get officals elected, then they give it back to unions with nose bleed high contracts, and on and on, in WI or NY.
So, isn't NY still a democracy? The OP asked could it happen here? The answer is doubtful--without a vote in that direction. So, if the people of NY complain about high taxes, then vote differently, not just continue jaw exercises. I'm all for fairness, and I don't believe extreme liberal or extreme conservatives have all the answers. WI, OH, IL, NJ, and NY soon are all very bankrupt in the billions, and everyone should be very concerned about LI and NY's future.
It's also no surprise that politicans speak with forked tongues, and when you vote in a centrist liberal there's always the risk of them going extreme left, and vice versa with a conservative. So, the platform that elects them, doesn't mean that's exactly what u get in the end. That's the game of politics, stretch your true agenda and see if you can still get re-elected. It hasn't changed much over the years. If Walker, Christie, Kasich, etc are union busting because they believe that's the can getting kicked down the road, if that's not what the people want, they get voted out. Same applies for reps. and senators. Another fact of life, is that whatever they do now legally between elections is eventually hashed out collectively with all voting elected officials, many changes take place, and the inclusion is based on a vote on the final form of a law. Isn't it just that straight forward, and the "new norm." will still be decided this way?
Only 14% of employed people in WI are unionized! What backs are you breaking here - they're dying on their own.
This is a ONE HUNDRED PERCENT political move by the GOP to cripple The Dems politically... It's like Terminator, go after the source of the money. Kill the unions and clean-up in the elections. It is not about anything else.
The reason these budgets are so flipped "in union heavy states" (WI is not one of them so you need to take off your NY glasses) is because of the criminals on Wall St who destroyed these peoples pension funds. It's all misdirection.
Yes, the "criminals" on Wall St destroyed their pensions. I mean...c'mon. I invite you to think for yourself instead of spatting off some bullet point that you read in the Huffington Post. The market goes up and down and a lot of these pensions weren't complaining when they were seeing 20% gains in the 1990s. No investment company in the world would make the promise that the NYS pension gives to their patrons of a guaranteed rate of return of 8%.
Unfortunately, when NYS was guaranteeing pensions to people in the last century, they didn't realize that people would be collecting for longer than they put into the system. That's a big oops, like calculating the geometry for the Mars Lander in feet but inputting it in meters. By the time they realized this was going to be a problem, the unions had gotten a stranglehold on the political landscape of NY and there was no way it was changing until we are on the event horizon looking down into the abyss. We are now at that point.
It's not Wall St's fault, and that is a very lazy argument to point your finger at the wealthy. The funny part is that Wall St works for the for shareholders of companies, which are held in funds like your 401k, 403b, or the NYS pension plan. So, Wall St works for you and I with one goal in mind. Make as much money for us as they can. So, when you blame Wall St, you can just turn your finger back around and point it at yourself.
The public sector workers of any state factor into the budgets of any state as public sector workers are usually a type of cost center*. And since those public sector workers are represented by unions, the Unions have a lot to do with any deficit of any state. You can't take them out of the equation.
*(Some state workers do generate money, for example the V/ABC).
They do factor into the budget, yes, but there has been no change in how they operate or their cost over the last few years. Regardless, when it comes down to it, the concessions regarding the pension program and health benefits, which is what Walker campaigned on are needed to help with the budget problem, and the Unions have agreed to do exactly that. The collective bargaining issue, is just simply trying to destroy Unions.
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