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I'm looking to move to the UP and I figure that MQT or the Soo are probably my best bets, but I'm looking for all advice, discussion forums, and resources that would help me. My target date for moving is next fall, or probably the following spring.
I grew up on the MI/OH border near Monroe/Toledo so I'm not totally uninformed about the area, just mostly. I love nature, cool temperatures, animals, space, and people not stacked 20 deep on each other (I currently live in Boston, and before that Chicago, so I'm all too familiar with crowding). I'm going to be 50 and plan to either retire or semi-retire so money is an issue to some extent. I want to buy a property, with AT LEAST an acre between me and my closet neighbor, preferably on a pond or lake, but certainly wooded. My budget is $400K cash, preferably less. To this point, it seems that the Soo would be the better bet, but I don't know for sure.
Culturally, I'm quite liberal, but all I require from people is that they are critical thinkers and open to discussion on matters. I'm open to having my mind changed by facts and reason, so I expect others to be so as well. I would not like to be surrounded by small minded rednecks who are unable to look at things from another perspective anymore than I would like to be surrounded by uber-sensitive idiots who can't take a joke or who would instantly react with horror to anything even mildly offensive. to this point, MQT seems high on the list, even though it SEEMS that the real estate is higher priced.
Job wise, if I can't keep working for my current employer when I move, my background (for 20 years) is as a computer systems engineer at possibly the most prestigious medical school in the world. I'd hope that could get me a gig, but I'm open to anything that could really just cover medical insurance.
Socially, my background is hockey. I really get along great with hockey people. Character and heart are encouraged, as is ethical behavior, as is a tight (almost familial) social network. At the same time, letting one's freak flag fly is also the name of the game, because all of us are pretty unique when the walls are down, so I really enjoy the openness that hockey has about that fact (I think it moves from the goalies down). Pretending that we're all Wonder Bread clones is boring as hell.
Bottom line, I'm looking for an affordable natural setting, that's not Hicksville. I want a fair degree of civilization, a good hospital, maybe a Sears and a Home Depot (or something of the sort), and someplace where participation in the community is encouraged, but where you can easily retreat into your own little kingdom whenever you want. I want to see the stars again, and hear crickets, and know people's names, but not be Daniel Boone. Any help would be greatly appreciated. This is the biggest decision I've ever made, and in the next few months I plan to stat visiting places and looking for homes. Thanks.
I would add the Houghton/Hancock area to that list. Both are college towns--Michigan Technological University in Houghton and Finlandia University in Hancock (was looking rough around the edges when I last saw it a few years ago--so the towns have a vibrant feel not found many other places in the UP.
From Wikipedia: "The area lends itself to a wide variety of outdoor sports, both winter (ice hockey, Nordic and Alpine skiing, figure skating, and snowmobiling) and summer (trail running, hiking, camping, river and sea kayaking, sailing, windsurfing and road and mountain biking)."
"Tourism is a major industry in Houghton. Summer tourism is very popular, especially among those wishing to tour old mines, visit various historical sites, and camp. Winter tourism is also very active from November through April, for snowmobiling, skiing and other winter sports."
Hancock has a Level 3 Trauma Center, but I have no idea how good it is.
You'll find lots of undeveloped land in the area, especially up north, some of it lakefront. The prices are much better than the Marquette area, of course.
A couple of smaller towns worth looking at: Iron River--minor population boom, nice area, though much smaller. Has a relatively vibrant feel to it--kind of jarring in the UP. Iron Mountain is having a mini population boom too and has more amenities and better transportation options that Iron River than Iron River, but it seems more red politically than Iron River. I could be wrong about that though. Both towns get less snow than Marquette and H/H.
Marquette county has a lot to offer and would be a good fit I think for you. Anything else will probably be to rural and conservative for you except for maybe the Houghton area. Look a bit out from Marquette like near Harvey or Ishpeming.
Marquette county has a lot to offer and would be a good fit I think for you. Anything else will probably be to rural and conservative for you except for maybe the Houghton area. Look a bit out from Marquette like near Harvey or Ishpeming.
Or Munising. I like the Munising area a lot. Only about an hour or less from Marquette.
If you aren't 100% set on Michigan maybe you head further west toward Duluth Mn. I confess I am not overly familiar but it is a good size city that leans liberal.
There are only a couple of yoopers on here. You might try reddit.
The only real hospital is Marquette, unless you go way over by the WI border maybe. And Marquette hospital is having a management problems. If medicare and health benefits get cut rural hospitals are really going to suffer.
I doesn't sound like you haven been to the UP? You need to do that. I'm not sure what you are describing is the UP.
You might be happier north of Grand Rapids in one of the small towns near the Manistee Forest. And this, most rural areas are conservative. College towns tend to be more progressive so yes, Mqt or Houghton in the UP. In the northern mitten Big Rapids has Ferris and is near the Manistee Forest. But not near much else.
I'd recommend visit to the area for a couple weeks before moving here. I have a friend who moved to Marquette from rural Massachusetts (north of Pittsfield) and is thinking of moving of moving back now after only just buying a house last year because of how remote the UP is. The rural state of Vermont has a population density about 3.5x times that of the UP. Yoopers are in character, I feel very similar to Northern Maine. The other part is beware of our cold winters. In the winter, I head south to Chicago or Milwaukee to warm up for a few days. The rest of the country would laugh at the idea of Chicago for a winter haven. However, we yoopers are friendly laid back crowd. Politically we are independent minded moderates. Largely working class people who love the outdoors. Marquette is our little capital and major city but its still much smaller then Pittsfield, MA. I live in a smaller city of about 1,000 around 90 mins out of Marquette and love it out here. The middle and western part of the UP are more mountainous while the eastern portion is mostly flat. Out east they associate more with downstate while central and western yoopers associate more with Wisconsin and the Green Bay packers. For most of us, Green Bay is the big big city if we need to leave the UP for some reason. The main highways are generally well plowed but I'd recommend a high clearance vehicle and snow tires if you don't live right in town. Like some else mentioned above, if small town life is not your thing, Duluth is a beautiful progressive city on Lake Superior that I would highly recommend. Duluth is a more moderately sized city, similar size to Portland, ME but not quite as liberal. I've been to Duluth many times, and while I have never lived there, its definitely one of the prettier mid sized cities in the midwest.
Thanks for all of the advice. I'm sorry that I haven't replied sooner but I work a lot. I get maybe 45-60 cumulative minutes a day to myself.
To cut to the chase here, the reason I'm high on the UP is because, up until now, I had always planned to move to Northern Ontario. Turns out that immigration is harder than you might expect, so I'm probably going to have to give up on that and make other plans. I am very familiar with Northern Ontario and have been there many times. I love it! I feel right at home. The people are friendly, the communities are pretty tight, even people like me who are by nature rather reclusive are pulled out into the community, but at the same time, there's a whole lot of space, you can be by yourself, and you can get a fantastic home on a fair amount of land for less than I have currently spent for my tiny box in the sky in Boston. And to be sure, the temperatures are very important to me. If it's above 72, I'm uncomfortable. I cannot tell you how much happier I am when things are cool, even cold, so a place where it's 60 degrees at night in the summer? Sign me up! Literally, I'll take -20 over 95 any day of the week. You can dress for the cold, but not for the heat.
BUT, Canada and the US are pretty different places. "Conservative" in Canada is nearly leftie-socialist in the US, but then again, Richard Nixon, who in the day was considered nearly nut-job, fringe element right wing, would today be considered a commie by most Republicans. I'm just hoping that many of the elements which cause people in Northern Ontario to realize that radical individualism leads to pretty bad ends would also lead people in the UP to realize it as well. People are stronger together, especially when nature is sometimes conspiring against you. Politeness and the ability to listen are also good traits.
I know that MQT might be my best best socially, but it seems that you can get a whole lot less for $400K there than in any other part of the UP. I could be wrong. SSM seems great in that it's much closer to "civilization" even though it's smaller in and of itself, and it has some GREAT realty available. I had never even heard of the Houghton/Hancock area before, so thanks, I'll have to check it out.
Also, thanks to Giesela for the note on regional hospitals. I hadn't considered that angle. I had considered the need for a hospital, but I hadn't factored in the current lunacy currently on offer from the right wing who are absolutely bent on the destruction of healthcare for anyone or any region without huge amounts of cash. This is another reason why I love Canada so much, they actually value health over profit. We were moving in a sane direction, but now all bets are off. This government keeps putting forth prospective policies which every healthcare organization in existence says will kill millions of people and hurt many millions more, but that's certainly not stopping them. With the "health" policies which are currently being pushed, in combination with the tax cuts which benefit the rich by over 80%, vulnerable areas like in the UP would end up being crushed and only "big" cities up there might end up with anything even approaching modern medicine. MQT could be the last man left standing. As such, it would be best for me to consider that in my plans.
Reddit was mentioned as another place to get info about the UP, but I Googled it and didn't find much.
Vermont was mentioned, and I am considering it, but sort of on the back burner. I don't really know why. I think I prefer MI because it's where I grew up and because it's right next to the places I wanted to live in ON. Christ, SSM is within sight of SSM, ON. VT is attractive in that it's very close to where I live now, it has a huge "knowledge economy" so I could be easily employed there in semi-retirement if I so chose, and the people there are basically Canadian in terms of values - socially and culturally. I could even still live right next to Canada, even though it would be QC, though I do speak some French already. (Man, I think I may have just made a compelling argument to myself on this.) But, I'm concerned about property values. I've never really checked it out, but it is New England, and prices here tend to be insane, even for rural properties. Christ, if I moved back to Monroe, MI, I could by a pretty nice estate for the price of my tiny little condo!
I know that I'll never regret moving out of Boston but I do want to make the right decision. I am sick to death of the overcrowding, the heat, no silence, tiny grocery stores, never being able to see the night sky, and a whole host of other reasons. As such, any and all help is greatly appreciated. I plan to start visiting next summer and move next fall or the following spring. All I want is a nice house, where I can't see or hear my neighbors, and where they don't care what I'm up to either. (I'd like to do some wild animal rescue and rehab, as well as be home to a few abandoned domestics like goats, waterfowl, chickens, dogs, and such. That should be fine, but you'd be amazed at the number of people who not only dislike animals but who are totally convinced of various kinds of bad information, like that squirrels transmit rabies, and who are totally not interested in disabusing themselves of such fallacies.) I just want a place where I can be left alone but not live in a cave or be surrounded by hillbillies.
I think SSM would be your best bet. SSM, ON is right over the border and it's a great city.
We took a vacation there last summer. We spent the night on the ON side and did the Soo MI touristy stuff during the day. When we got done being in MI, we went back over to ON. It was nice. The border crossing was also less "gruff" than we've experienced coming back from Montreal or Windsor. Our experiences crossing from QB and Windsor left a lot to be desired.
From what you've said, I think it would be a good fit for you.
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Iron Mountain is having a mini population boom too and has more amenities and better transportation options that Iron River than Iron River, but it seems more red politically than Iron River. I could be wrong about that though. Both towns get less snow than Marquette and H/H.
