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There is nothing more demoralizing than walking past vehicles and leaving them there so you can go for a nice walk.
Most I've covered in a single day was 18 miles through rolling hills for overwatch positions. To say it was hell was an understatement despite not having been shot at that day. It was nearly 110, I'm carrying more than 1/2 of my body weight in equipment. I have started off with a full camelbak, 2 bottles of water and 2 bottles of Gatorade. Drank all of that before getting back to the trucks where I slammed 2 bottles of water and ate/drank after we got back to base. Didn't pee until the following day, that's how dehydrated I was and I'm pretty conservative with water consumption. It seemed like non-stop walking all day. Towards the end of the patrol while I was nearly back to the truck, I turn the corner and see a camel staring at me. I slowly walk around it and it starts following me. I put my selector switch on my M4 from safe to semi and I'm getting ready to send this thing to camel heaven as it keeps following me. My commander catches up and tells me he will take care of it. He stops, waves his arms around and yells at the camel as I walk away...
The only times you will crawl, sprint or run is when you are under fire or in an open area. Open areas are very dangerous as you have neither cover or concealment. Nowhere to run and nowhere to hide.
Depending on how far you need to go for patrol, what the terrain is and the IED threat, you may be dropped in by helicopter.
Walking 7 miles back to base after an 8 day patrol with no water left had a lot of guys lining up for the medic to give them an IV.
What were you mostly carrying that is more than half your weight? Is it all just ammunition?
What were you mostly carrying that is more than half your weight? Is it all just ammunition?
I was around 140 pounds back then.
Here goes what I was carrying/wearing:
body armor with front/back/side plates-plates are 1" thick ceramic
ballistic helmet
M4 rifle with ACOG optic
7 magazines with 30 rounds in each magazine
rack to hold magazines and other small equipment
Radio with cords and mic
antenna for the radio
1 battery for each day
GPS
Spare batteries for GPS
digital camera
8 bottles of water per day of patrol-carried up to 3 days of supply
2 MREs for each day of patrol-carried up to 3 days of supply
backpack to store all the stuff I'm not wearing
large ruck sack to store all the little stuff in
sleeping system (wet weather liner & sleeping bag)
hygiene items such as toothbrush & toothpaste, baby wipes
I'm sure I've left some stuff off.
There are two common sayings:
1. pack light, shiver at night. Some guys would pack less stuff which meant carrying less of the "comfort" items like a sleeping bag and/or sleeping mat but you'll get even colder at night.
2. ounces equals pounds, pounds equal pain. Every ounce counts when you're carrying it.
One of the most forgettable days was when we went on a 3 day patrol and had to bring everything to sustain us for 3 days. I carried 24 bottles of water and 6 MREs with me. Who wants to walk miles with a case of water on their back? Of course I drank it over the course of those 3 days but that first day was hell carrying all of that stuff.
body armor with front/back/side plates-plates are 1" thick ceramic
ballistic helmet
M4 rifle with ACOG optic
7 magazines with 30 rounds in each magazine
rack to hold magazines and other small equipment
Radio with cords and mic
antenna for the radio
1 battery for each day
GPS
Spare batteries for GPS
digital camera
8 bottles of water per day of patrol-carried up to 3 days of supply
2 MREs for each day of patrol-carried up to 3 days of supply
backpack to store all the stuff I'm not wearing
large ruck sack to store all the little stuff in
sleeping system (wet weather liner & sleeping bag)
hygiene items such as toothbrush & toothpaste, baby wipes
I'm sure I've left some stuff off.
There are two common sayings:
1. pack light, shiver at night. Some guys would pack less stuff which meant carrying less of the "comfort" items like a sleeping bag and/or sleeping mat but you'll get even colder at night.
2. ounces equals pounds, pounds equal pain. Every ounce counts when you're carrying it.
One of the most forgettable days was when we went on a 3 day patrol and had to bring everything to sustain us for 3 days. I carried 24 bottles of water and 6 MREs with me. Who wants to walk miles with a case of water on their back? Of course I drank it over the course of those 3 days but that first day was hell carrying all of that stuff.
Are you the radio specialty guy or does everyone carry the radio? When you go out on the actual patrol, are you actually carrying all that stuff? Or will you set up a base camp, and drop everything off there, make sure it is well protected, and then go out on the patrol?
If you go out for three days, I imagine you are leaving some sort of fortification and traveling quite far from it. Dont you have to set up some sort of base camp and drop off most of your gear there? How can anyone walk around for three days straight with all that gear on them and still be combat effective?
Are you the radio specialty guy or does everyone carry the radio? When you go out on the actual patrol, are you actually carrying all that stuff? Or will you set up a base camp, and drop everything off there, make sure it is well protected, and then go out on the patrol?
If you go out for three days, I imagine you are leaving some sort of fortification and traveling quite far from it. Dont you have to set up some sort of base camp and drop off most of your gear there? How can anyone walk around for three days straight with all that gear on them and still be combat effective?
You learn to do it. It comes with the territory of being an infantry man. He is absolutely right about all of what he would need to carry and notice there wasn't any mention of a tablet or laptop. They don't carry an xbox either. If they are going on patrol they would have had some sort of plan for sleeping at night. Best case would be some shelter that is defensible and dry. Otherwise God loves the infantry. He rains he love down on them.
One point here though under attack you drop all that gear and fight without the ruck sack. The radio is coming with him but everything else is dropped. Let's say they have a 2 day march into the wilderness to attack a target. They would march those two days stopping short of the target. Set up final camp and leave a guard to watch over it. Then the remainder would proceed to complete the mission. I was a radio operator and I would carry that on my back. I promise you none of it was light.
body armor with front/back/side plates-plates are 1" thick ceramic
ballistic helmet
M4 rifle with ACOG optic
7 magazines with 30 rounds in each magazine
rack to hold magazines and other small equipment
Radio with cords and mic
antenna for the radio
1 battery for each day
GPS
Spare batteries for GPS
digital camera
8 bottles of water per day of patrol-carried up to 3 days of supply
2 MREs for each day of patrol-carried up to 3 days of supply
backpack to store all the stuff I'm not wearing
large ruck sack to store all the little stuff in
sleeping system (wet weather liner & sleeping bag)
hygiene items such as toothbrush & toothpaste, baby wipes
I'm sure I've left some stuff off.
There are two common sayings:
1. pack light, shiver at night. Some guys would pack less stuff which meant carrying less of the "comfort" items like a sleeping bag and/or sleeping mat but you'll get even colder at night.
2. ounces equals pounds, pounds equal pain. Every ounce counts when you're carrying it.
One of the most forgettable days was when we went on a 3 day patrol and had to bring everything to sustain us for 3 days. I carried 24 bottles of water and 6 MREs with me. Who wants to walk miles with a case of water on their back? Of course I drank it over the course of those 3 days but that first day was hell carrying all of that stuff.
I knew there was a reason I went the aircrew route! All our survival gear was carried in the overhead racks. Nights were spent in billeting when in the sand box.
Soldiers spend a lot of time in patrol walking, running, low crawling. Not just infantry Soldiers. Sometimes Artillery, Engineers, and other combat arms Soldiers are involved in patrols in combat zones. They use HUMMVs and Armor Personnel Carriers and other trucks, vehicles to transport in long distances.
Soldiers do physical fitness activities every day with running. They're tested in running every 6 months last I heard - Army is changing their physical fitness test from my understanding.
Soldiers often march in garrison when in large groups to move from point A to point B in an orderly manner.
My cousin joined the Marines in the 80s. He was in the artillery and he was part of a towed 155mm cannon crew. One day they were in the field and the Sergeant wasn't too happy with their performance. They were ready to go back to the barracks and had the gun hooked up to the truck and were waiting to board said truck when the Gunny came by and said a lot of cuss words and that tonight the truck was only for the gun. 12 miles full packs and empty stomachs. He said he wasn't pissed at the sarge. He walked with them.
You learn to do it. It comes with the territory of being an infantry man. He is absolutely right about all of what he would need to carry and notice there wasn't any mention of a tablet or laptop. They don't carry an xbox either. If they are going on patrol they would have had some sort of plan for sleeping at night. Best case would be some shelter that is defensible and dry. Otherwise God loves the infantry. He rains he love down on them.
One point here though under attack you drop all that gear and fight without the ruck sack. The radio is coming with him but everything else is dropped. Let's say they have a 2 day march into the wilderness to attack a target. They would march those two days stopping short of the target. Set up final camp and leave a guard to watch over it. Then the remainder would proceed to complete the mission. I was a radio operator and I would carry that on my back. I promise you none of it was light.
But if you are literally 2 days away, couldnt you have just been airlifted, or driven to maybe at least a day's march away? That way you are fresher when the battle happens. If you are literally that far away, you can still mask your intentions and movements.
But if you are literally 2 days away, couldnt you have just been airlifted, or driven to maybe at least a day's march away? That way you are fresher when the battle happens. If you are literally that far away, you can still mask your intentions and movements.
It all depends on logistics. If it can be done stealthily yes. But let's for example use a drug lord operation in the jungles of Columbia. You might be able airlift and drop by parachute but you will still need to drop far enough away not to be spotted. Vehicles traveling on the road will be noticed and don't kid yourself they have scouts out there. Even marching through the jungle you might trip warning sensors.
Sure you might be able drop right out of the sky on top of Pablo but that isn't going to make the operation go very well.
But if you are literally 2 days away, couldnt you have just been airlifted, or driven to maybe at least a day's march away? That way you are fresher when the battle happens. If you are literally that far away, you can still mask your intentions and movements.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldsoldier1976
It all depends on logistics. If it can be done stealthily yes. But let's for example use a drug lord operation in the jungles of Columbia. You might be able airlift and drop by parachute but you will still need to drop far enough away not to be spotted. Vehicles traveling on the road will be noticed and don't kid yourself they have scouts out there. Even marching through the jungle you might trip warning sensors.
Sure you might be able drop right out of the sky on top of Pablo but that isn't going to make the operation go very well.
What the old soldier said. if you saw the movie depiction of Black Hawk Down notice that as soon as the helicopter engines started winding up there was the rebel groups scouts calling to say here come the Rangers. It is the same with APCs, trucks, and tanks. In some situations your vehicles can move faster then they can evacuate or prepare defenses but rarely are we in the take that village at all cost mode but rather trying to sneak in with minimum force to gain some other objective.
It all depends on logistics. If it can be done stealthily yes. But let's for example use a drug lord operation in the jungles of Columbia. You might be able airlift and drop by parachute but you will still need to drop far enough away not to be spotted. Vehicles traveling on the road will be noticed and don't kid yourself they have scouts out there. Even marching through the jungle you might trip warning sensors.
Sure you might be able drop right out of the sky on top of Pablo but that isn't going to make the operation go very well.
But how will marching an overwhelming force or number of troops be anymore stealthy? Unless you send in a small force like special forces, but for this thread and am only interesting in regular combat troops.
If you are sending in regular forces, I will first send in scouts. They normally are lightly packed. Then once I know location, I will try to surround then and then close the circle. That way, even if drug dealers spot me they cant get out.
Or if we are talking about drug dealers, and their drug labs in the desert. I just put out active patrols to cover as many spots as I can. The drug dealers will have to keep moving and moving. They will never get a chance to settle down, and actually produce. They have to pretty much move out of that jungle.
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