MMA taking over???? (fight, boxing, money, bigger)

[Bjorn_Ironside32]

Comparing the HBO PPV numbers to the UFC PPV numbers is the wrong formula on judging how healthy each sport is, people look at these numbers and automatically assume "Boxing is Dying" "We need to fix Boxing" "OMG"

Lets break this down just to show how healthy the sports really are.

One sport is MMA

One sport Boxing

MMA has had 3 major organizations die the past 2 years and that's not counting Bodogfights,
Hardcore Championship Fighting soon to be Dream.

IFL -

The IFL was a MMA org that was founded March, 2005, in a very short time they were able to secure a deal with Fox Sports. Corporate sponsors such as Microsoft, Suzuki and Coca-Cola sign on, in November 2006 The company goes public. December 2007 "60 Minutes" prominently features IFL. Shortly after, its stock peaks at $17. March of 2007 MyNetworkTV begins screening IFL fights, June 2007 IFL shares fall to $1.

December 2007 IFL's contract with MyNetworkTV ends. June 2008 IFL cancels an August event at the Izod Center, saying the company can't afford to stage it. The CEO says the league is looking for a buyer or partner.

Oct 2008 the IFL sells for $650,000 - IFL DEAD

PrideFC -

PRIDE Fighting Championships was formed in 1997,they held more than sixty mixed martial arts events. During its ten years of operation, Pride was broadcast in 41 countries worldwide. Pride still holds the record for largest crowd for a MMA event at Tokyo National Stadium 91,107 in attendance.

On June 5, 2006, Fuji Network announced that they were terminating their television contract with PRIDE Fighting Championships effective immediately due to a breach of contract, According to Fightopinion.com and a Japanese magazine called Shukan Gendai, Pride has been run and owned by the Yakuza(Japanese Mob) for some time.

The owners of the UFC bought pride in March 2007 for a reported $70 million with the intentions of having another MMA brand in Japan, after failing to secure a TV deal in Japan, the new pride owner(Lorenzo Fertitta) was forced to shut down the company in October 2007. They fired the remaining 20 employees in Japan and closed it's offices. The UFC owners ended up paying $70 million for fighter contracts and a video library. - Pride Dead

Elite XC -

Elite Xtreme Combat was founded as a partnership between Showtime Networks Inc. and ProElite, Inc. Their first major event was in February, 2007, 1 year later it was reported that EliteXC had reached an agreement with CBS to broadcast EliteXC shows on prime time. The first show May 31, 2008 on CBS drew the highest ratings in the history of MMA in north america, it peaked at 6.5 million viewers watching the main event with Kimbo Slice against James Thompson. That week they ended up second in most watched sport shows on Television, the second Elite XC show on CBS on July, 26 was not what CBS was expecting. The ratings were down 40% from the first show, rumor were rampant that the company was hemorrhaging money but they still had Kimbo Slice so the next show had to be a blockbuster. October 4 was the next show and they scheduled Kimbo against well known 44 year old 1 - 7 in his last 8 fights Ken Shamrock, the plan an easy win for Kimbo huge ratings, sounds great. The day of the fight Shamrock pulls out with a cut and isn't allowed to fight, Kimbo has to face late sub and subsequently gets ko'd in 10 seconds. The ratings ended up being great but after the fight there were allegations of pay offs to keep the fight standing, The Florida state athletic commission starts an investigation to look into fight fixing. On October 21 it was reported that Elite XC would close it's doors by the end of the week, it was reported that in it's 2 years of existence the company had lost $55million . -Elite XC Dead

Boxing

The claims of boxing's death are greatly exaggerated, you will not be able to find a time when there has been this much boxing accessible to the general public.

Network TV

Telefutura(soon to be shifted to Azteca America)
Telemundo

Basic Cable

ESPN Friday night fights (9 months out of the year)
Versus - Fight Night
Fox Sports Net- will begin airing notable overseas title bouts on a tape-delay basis about once per month as part of "Best Damn Sports Show Period."
ESPN Classic - Boxing every night
Golden Boy Promotions is working on a deal for a monthly boxing program on basic cable to feature prospects.

Premium Cable

HBO Has a Boxing budget of $60 million a year, they had 20 shows this year not counting PPV.
Showtime has a Boxing budget of $20 million a year, they had 24 cards this year non on PPV.

All these different channels are pumping money into the Boxing economy, here in the US not counting PPV buys or live gate.

Non U.S Boxing networks

UK Setanta
UK Nuts.tv
UK ITV
UK Sky Sports
UK BBC
Germany ARD
Germany ZDF
Mexico TV Azteca
Canada Super Channel
Canada TSN

Live Gate

The Top grossing gate in the history of MMA

CHUCK LIDDELL vs. TITO ORTIZ II
12/30/06 $5,397,300

Top Boxing gates of the last 2 years

FLOYD MAYWEATHER JR vs. OSCAR DE LA HOYA
05/05/07 $18,419,200

Oscar De La Hoya vs Pacquiao
12/6/08 $14,380,300

Ricky Hatton vs Juan Lazcano
5/24/08 $12,000,000

JOE CALZAGHE vs. BERNARD HOPKINS
04/19/08 $ 11,636,400

FLOYD MAYWEATHER JR vs. RICKY HATTON
12/08/07 $10,393,950


Biggest one fight purse for each sport in 2008

MMA

Tim Sylvia - $800,000
Andre Arlovski -$749,690
Chuck Liddel l - $500,000
Kimbo Slice - $500,000
Brock Lesnar - $450,000
Forrest Griffin - $310,000
BJ Penn - $250,000
Randy Couture - $250,000
Anderson Silva - $200,000

Boxing

Oscar Delahoya - $24,000,000
Felix Trinidad - $14,000,000
Wladimir Klitschko - $12,000,000
Manny Pacquiao - $11,000,000
Joe Calzaghe - $10,000,000
Roy Jones - $10,000,000
Bernard Hopkins - $8,000,000
Miguel Cotto - $7,000,000
Kelly Pavlik - $3,000,000

and people keep saying MMA is taking over, and boxing is dying? .

[Mike in TN]

I can't find the link, but the UFC had 7 of the top 10 PPVs in North America this year. WWE had 1 and HBO PPV had 2.

The MMA vs. Boxing argument is circle that spins 'round and 'round with nothing happening. Two different sports. Two different type athletes. Two different demogrpahics.

Neither is going away any time soon. Boxing is probably falling off with the 18-49 white male demographic, and since they make up such a large percentage of people in the states people think b/c they aren't watching boxing anymore that no one is. Pac-Man - De La Hoya PPV buys say otherwise.

But showing some upstart MMA promotions that failed isn't really proving that MMA isn't growing. Zuffa lost something like $20M+ over about 5 years with the UFC before they turned a profit. Who knows how much they could sell it for now. If someone said MMA isn't expanding b/c the IFL folded, that would be akin to one boxing promoter failing.

I enjoy both - although I'm a bigger fan of MMA. That's just me being perfectly honest.

The way I see it, the biggest boxing match of the year will probably always be the highest grossing event. However, aside from that one match, the UFC will win the $$$ games for the next few years. Maybe it's a fad for some? I guess only time will tell.

Oh and I don't believe the MMA salary figures that were posted. I'm not saying they aren't what you found that is listed with the state athletic commisions, but there is a lot of under-the-table money in MMA. I think they try to keep public salaries down to keep fighters from bargaining for more. I'm sure Fedor Emelianeko made more than $1M in his :30 annihilation of Tim Sylvia.

Last edit: Now way Zuffa paid $70M for PRIDE. That was all a publicity stunnt. I think the actual figure was closer to $10M, if that.

[Bjorn_Ironside32]

true.

but what i truly hate is these so-called ''UFC/MMA fans'' saying boxing is on the decline.
what they fail to understand is that if it wasn't for dana white coming with the boxing rules (judges, weight classes) ufc/mma wouldn't be as big as it is.

[Mike in TN]

Originally Posted by jack the ripper

but what i truly hate is these so-called ''UFC/MMA fans'' saying boxing is on the decline.

They just don't know anyone that watches it so they think no one else does. Simple mindedness.

what they fail to understand is that if it wasn't for dana white coming with the boxing rules (judges, weight classes) ufc/mma wouldn't be as big as it is.

Dana White tries to act like he and the Fertittas did that, but IIRC that was the New Jersey State Athletic Commission.

[LaoTzuMindFu]

Originally Posted by jack the ripper

true.

but what i truly hate is these so-called ''UFC/MMA fans'' saying boxing is on the decline.
what they fail to understand is that if it wasn't for dana white coming with the boxing rules (judges, weight classes) ufc/mma wouldn't be as big as it is.

Dana White did NOT come up with that. The State Athletic Commissions demanded that that happen before they would allow them to sanction the fights. White and Zuffa had NOTHING at all to do with it.

What I hate about those MMA fans who cry that boxing is dying and MMA is taking over is that they dont know what the f**K they are talking about. Plus, most the the so called "fighters" in MMA are poorly trained martial artists who are just in good physical shape. Real martial artists do not act and behave the way those guys in the Ultimate Fighter Show behave.

[krudmonk]

Originally Posted by jack the ripper

what they fail to understand is that if it wasn't for dana white coming with the boxing rules (judges, weight classes) ufc/mma wouldn't be as big as it is.

Aren't these common to almost any combat sport?

[Positiveone]

I enjoy both boxing & MMA, but for the most part all the boxing undercard fights are pretty boring. At least with the UFC you get 7-8 good quality fights for 40 bucks or so. In boxing i always feel i'm paying for 1 or maybe two decent fights. Once dela hoya leaves for good there arent all that many big fights left. No exciting heavyweights, Pavlik was beat by Hopkins, so no big excitement at middleweight, Junior middle pretty weak. I guess 147 has the best potential in boxing. I have to say in the UFC all the divisions have good quality fights. Again I like both, but as of today i'll lean MMA!

[Bjorn_Ironside32]

Originally Posted by Mike in TN

They just don't know anyone that watches it so they think no one else does. Simple mindedness.



Dana White tries to act like he and the Fertittas did that, but IIRC that was the New Jersey State Athletic Commission.

Originally Posted by DaBeez

Dana White did NOT come up with that. The State Athletic Commissions demanded that that happen before they would allow them to sanction the fights. White and Zuffa had NOTHING at all to do with it.

What I hate about those MMA fans who cry that boxing is dying and MMA is taking over is that they dont know what the f**K they are talking about. Plus, most the the so called "fighters" in MMA are poorly trained martial artists who are just in good physical shape. Real martial artists do not act and behave the way those guys in the Ultimate Fighter Show behave.

Thanks for correcting me guys, i always thought it was dana since he himself was a former boxer.

i truly agree with that last part, those ufc fighters need some discipline.

[Mike in TN]

Keep in mind, many, if not most mixed martial artists are classy people. Don't judge the majority of them based on an edited reality show. Randy Couture, Anderson Silva, Fedor Emelianeko, Matt Hughes, Rashad Evans, Miguel Torres, Georges St. Pierre, Antonio Nogueria - all classy, respectful guys.

[CleanCutHippie]

MMA is a great sport.....but boxing is just better. The anticipation and production of boxing is much better. The white trash in the MMA crowd is just ridiculous.

Boxing is my fav. sport

MMA is a distant 2nd