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Sorry guys, but I am not really swayed by all of the hysteria about pending economic doom if this bill is passed.
Bill 101 has always been decried as something that supposedly prevents the economy from prospering and the almost unprecedented boom of recent years still happened in spite of Bill 101 still being in force.
Is Bill 96 useful for anything besides being divisive?
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Originally Posted by djesus007
Nope, it's just another ass backward policy by a racist, xenophobic, out of touch right wingers who got scared from one Journal de Montreal article. Bill 96 will not only curb rights and freedoms of anglos and allos, but it will destroy the economy and you will see another flight of capital if this thing passes. This will be a huge blow after it took us more than 30 years to recover from two referendums and draconian laws. We cannot afford to have that happen again.
I am admittedly an American looking in. I first visited Montreal in November 1976, days after the election where Renee Levesque's Parti Quebecois defeated Bourassa's Liberal government. I visited again briefly in 1977, 1979 and 1986. Nothing prepared me for how Montreal had degraded by the time of my March 2005 visit.
I visited Quebec City extensively in 1979, 1986 and, with my wife, 2012. Concededly, Quebec City has retained a bit more of its sheen than has Montreal. Even Quebec City's gentility is a bit shabby. My wife, who has less of a soft spot than I do for Canada, feels that Canada is overpriced and overrated. I can understand that feeling. She is intelligent, and compares prices and living standards to the U.S. Sadly, most of this is self-inflicted. Legislation such Bill 101, and now Bill 96 chases away businesses and people. It is not Quebec's fault that North America, and to the lesser extent the world, speaks English as a dominant, unifying language.
Chasing people and businesses with money is a hard way, indeed, to govern successfully.
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Originally Posted by jamesse
So while I totally understand that this Bill 96 is horrible for anglophones/allophones who have called Montreal their home and want to make Montreal their home, it makes sense for the francophone Quebecois people. It's a matter of protecting their identity and identity should come before $$$.
That's perfectly fine if Canada abolishes equalization and other transfer payments.
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Originally Posted by thedwightguy
And after coming back from Cuba, those same "Elites" that MURDERED Pierre Laporte got good jobs due to their connections. The "siege mentality" is actually pretty dangerous. While I wish my ancestral province well, is it not time to look forward instead of backward?? It's a big world out there, embrace it.
The 1976 provincial elections and Bill 101 destroyed one of the world's great Jewish communities. So much for "diversity" or "minority rights." I guess "minority rights" only applies to Francophones surviving on subsidies.
One of the reasons I come on forums like these is to balance things out.
If I wasn't here it would just be a bunch of out-group people discussing something that first and foremost affects the future of someone else's in-group.
At least in threads such as this one.
Quebec is lucky that it survived an American onslaught, in 1775-6. General Winter defeated him, as much as it defeated Napoleon. North America, granted, is a more interesting place with Quebec being a French-language holdout. As I posted above, it's hostility to English is probably not helpful economically, but who am I to judge or dictate?
I am admittedly an American looking in. I first visited Montreal in November 1976, days after the election where Renee Levesque's Parti Quebecois defeated Bourassa's Liberal government. I visited again briefly in 1977, 1979 and 1986. Nothing prepared me for how Montreal had degraded by the time of my March 2005 visit.
I visited Quebec City extensively in 1979, 1986 and, with my wife, 2012. Concededly, Quebec City has retained a bit more of its sheen than has Montreal. Even Quebec City's gentility is a bit shabby. My wife, who has less of a soft spot than I do for Canada, feels that Canada is overpriced and overrated. I can understand that feeling. She is intelligent, and compares prices and living standards to the U.S. Sadly, most of this is self-inflicted. Legislation such Bill 101, and now Bill 96 chases away businesses and people. It is not Quebec's fault that North America, and to the lesser extent the world, speaks English as a dominant, unifying language.
Montreal and Quebec City look better today than at any point in my lifetime. And I am in my early 50s so I have memories of them going back to the late 70s.
That's perfectly fine if Canada abolishes equalization and other transfer payments.
.
That's an absurd idea and will never happen.
Other provinces drain way more per capita out of the coffers than Quebec does, and some of them make way stupider decisions with far more serious economic consequences than Quebec does.
Besides, the Canadian federation doesn't work that way.
What's clear is that Quebec's main sin is its unwillingness to lie down in front of the Anglo-American steamroller.
The 1976 provincial elections and Bill 101 destroyed one of the world's great Jewish communities. .".
In all honesty a large part of that destruction was self-inflicted.
A too large share of Montreal's Jewish community decided that learning French was too much for them and so they decided to leave to city they allegedly loved for Toronto or the US.
There isn't anything that intrinsically opposed Jews and the French language, as there are millions of Jews in France who speak French and have tremendously contributed to French society and culture.
I actually feel sad that francophone Canada and such a large part of the Jewish community missed this historic rendez-vous like two ships passing in the night. But the socio-cultural conditions that were forced onto both groups roughly in the first half of the 20th century couldn't do anything but drive them apart. Or perhaps more accurately - against each other.
It's a bit better today, as more Sephardim who speak French have moved to the city and the older Anglo-Ashkenazi community has younger generations that almost all speak French (albeit as a second language).
In all honesty a large part of that destruction was self-inflicted.
A too large share of Montreal's Jewish community decided that learning French was too much for them and so they decided to leave to city they allegedly loved for Toronto or the US.
I quite honestly don't see it that way at all. Jews are 1.9% of the U.S. and 1.9% of the Canadian populations, and an infinitesimal percentage of the world population. The Jewish population has been cut by a lot in various pogroms and organized killings. The surviving Jews are descended from those who "travel lightly" and move when the temperature in the kitchen starts rising. We are on alert for early signs of trouble, and the effort to squeeze our culture is one such sign. To some extent "what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander." French-speakers are protective of their rights as a minority culture. Same with Jews.
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Originally Posted by Acajack
There isn't anything that intrinsically opposed Jews and the French language, as there are millions of Jews in France who speak French and have tremendously contributed to French society and culture.
I actually feel sad that francophone Canada and such a large part of the Jewish community missed this historic rendez-vous like two ships passing in the night. But the socio-cultural conditions that were forced onto both groups roughly in the first half of the 20th century couldn't do anything but drive them apart. Or perhaps more accurately - against each other.
We learned gratitude at the Drancy deportation station in France.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack
It's a bit better today, as more Sephardim who speak French have moved to the city and the older Anglo-Ashkenazi community has younger generations that almost all speak French (albeit as a second language).
Nothing wrong with bi-lingualism. Why is bi-lingualism good for Canada but bad for Quebec?
We learned gratitude at the Drancy deportation station in France.
I don't think that's any different from what occurred elsewhere in Europe during that tragic period, nor do I think that has anything to do with 20th century Montreal Jews being unwilling to learn French.
The German, Polish, etc. languages weren't incompatible with Jews either, as Jews spoke the language of the countries they lived in. And we all know will happened.
I quite honestly don't see it that way at all. Jews are 1.9% of the U.S. and 1.9% of the Canadian populations, and an infinitesimal percentage of the world population. The Jewish population has been cut by a lot in various pogroms and organized killings. The surviving Jews are descended from those who "travel lightly" and move when the temperature in the kitchen starts rising. We are on alert for early signs of trouble, and the effort to squeeze our culture is one such sign. To some extent "what's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander." French-speakers are protective of their rights as a minority culture. Same with Jews.
I actually can understand that. That doesn't mean I'm not sad about what happened.
Nothing wrong with bi-lingualism. Why is bi-lingualism good for Canada but bad for Quebec?
I am sorry but the idea that the rest of Canada is this paragon of bilingualism compared to Quebec which is allegedly totally unilingual is a blatant fallacy.
It doesn't matter how many times Lorne from Lethbridge repeats it. It's a lie.
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Divisive and counterproductive
