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It sounds like the scenario playing out is that the people are not able to refinance to a fixed rate - unfortunately, that is a basic risk one takes with an ARM, and one of the risks DMX is talking about in his post.
Nahh The argument is whether you can do whatever you can to minimize the pain to you and your family or must grit your teeth and perservere until you get to Libertarian heaven.
That is not very complex. You do the right thing or the Libertarian thing.
Drop it TM...you are arguing religion with a zealot...and one with his fuzz phrase computer all fired up. "Intellectual enigma wrapped in a conudrum" - That is put on BS meaning a lack of understanding. And that is true...These guys only understand other true believers.
Right is on your side...blathering postures nicely summarizes the writings of GLS.
What an amazing display of objectivity on your part. Just how many commissions did you put in your pocket helping slide these poor unqualified "victims" into homes and mortgages they couldn't afford?
What an amazing display of objectivity on your part. Just how many commissions did you put in your pocket helping slide these poor unqualified "victims" into homes and mortgages they couldn't afford?
I love it. You get your own BS back and immediately I must be a bad guy...well I am in a way. I think Libertarians are shallow visionaries not capable of dealing with reality. Sort of the sci-fi fans of political theory.
Nope - Never lost one . Unlikely I ever will...and if I do it will be over my very direct advice. . I watch my clients closely. Few years ago I did represent a couple where the guy was a very colorful hard money lender. Would not be surprised to find out he crashed. But not while I was involved.
I did counsel my SOL through an interest only mortgage for a few years. He made a bundle.
And I have little sympathy for those who manuevered themselves into the position by speculative games. But then again those are the ones who will buy and then get foreclosed.
I feel for the kids who made a rational buy decision and have had it socked to them by the times. And I would assist any of them in a manuever to escape the position they are trapped in.
I understood. he is saying he hasn't done anything unethical and feels for those that bought what they thought they could afford.Just like I don't believe every union personis in the mob because Jimmy Hoffa was.
I must have missed something, Olecapt, because I don't understand your reply.
Sorry...
The ARM is merely one facet of the problem. The threads deals with a guy who has pulled a clever manuever to get out from under a situation where he could actually afford to make the payments but it would be a bad fiscal thing for him to do so. So he has bought another more affordable house with much lower payments than the primary and now is going to let the primary be foreclosed. This is certainly an odiferous situation. It is however not illegal and even the immoral tag is hard to pin on him. I describe him as at least part weasel.
The discussion then is a broad one as to whether or not one can walk away from a bad financial situation if one is not compelled to. I think it is fully agreed that if it reaches the point where you simply cannot pay it there is no choice but to walk. At the other extreme if it causes a year or two of belt tightening to weather the storm it would be generally agreed that you should stick to it. In between is the fun zone. How about if it handled for now but not soluable in the time frame in which a move will become necessary. Must you ride out five years and then get foreclosed? Or should one go ahead and do it now if it has a high probability of occuring anyway?
How about one faced with a growing family and perhaps an 8 or 10 years of marginal existence pauperized by a mortgage?
I hold that extracting oneself from these situations by any tactic that ain't illegal is fair game. Others here hold that your word is your bond and you must fulfill the contract you entered into even at great harm to yourself and your family.
So ARMs are just a tiny part of the causal. A much larger problem than that.
I hold that extracting oneself from these situations by any tactic that ain't illegal is fair game. Others here hold that your word is your bond and you must fulfill the contract you entered into even at great harm to yourself and your family.
My word IS my bond. I have never broken it and plan to never break it. I teach my children to comport themselves in the same way.
My word IS my bond. I have never broken it and plan to never break it. I teach my children to comport themselves in the same way.
Is your word somehow less trustworthy than that?
Ohh - you solemnly swear to follow every last detail of every last contract you sign? You read and swear to obey all the boiler plate on the back of every consumer transaction you do? You are bound by all shrinkwrap licenses even those that are illegal and immoral?
You follow the restriction convenients buried in the CC&Rs of the old house you buy even though the Feds will send you to jail for it?
Just how far does your word is my bond go? I stick to only the legal stuff.
Hey I admire your fortitude but I question your good sense.
Drop it TM...you are arguing religion with a zealot...and one with his fuzz phrase computer all fired up. "Intellectual enigma wrapped in a conudrum" - That is put on BS meaning a lack of understanding. And that is true...These guys only understand other true believers.
Right is on your side...blathering postures nicely summarizes the writings of GLS.
Thank you for your understanding. It is greatly appreciated.
Ohh - you solemnly swear to follow every last detail of every last contract you sign?
Yes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt
You read and swear to obey all the boiler plate on the back of every consumer transaction you do?
I don't always read it, but if something happens and I am shown that the agreement obligates me to perform in a specific manner, yes, I obey it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt
You are bound by all shrinkwrap licenses even those that are illegal and immoral?
This is a ridiculous hypothetical. I don't believe I've ever bought a product that carried an illegal or immoral license on it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt
You follow the restriction convenients buried in the CC&Rs of the old house you buy even though the Feds will send you to jail for it?
Another ridiculous question. When I buy a house, I make sure I understaqnd any covenants attached thereto. If any of them are illegal, I won't buy the house withoug having those restrictions removed. Therefore, the feds will never send me to jail for following one of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt
Just how far does your word is my bond go? I stick to only the legal stuff.
There's supposed to be a limit? If I give my word, I keep it. I don't understand your confusion on this matter. Suggesting that you don't stick to your word if you agreed to something illegal supposes that you would be shortsighted enough to agree to something you didn't fully understand, but that might be illegal, or that you understand to be illegal. I haven't made either of those mistakes, so far as I am aware to this point in my life.
Quote:
Originally Posted by olecapt
Hey I admire your fortitude but I question your good sense.
How can doing what one says one will do ever be questioned? One should never be expected to do otherwise, in my opinion.
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