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I have to say I have traveled all over the USA and for a rural based town the size of Keene pop. 23,000 this is about as good as it get in America. Lets see, it is attractive, has a college right in town, vibrant main street no empty store fronts, decent healthcare, enough big box stores but not overwhelming. A nice co-op, a nice mix of liberal and conservative politics. Drive around the rest of the country and look into similar size towns. Believe me Keene is at the top of the pack.
The main downside to Keene is owning any property in the city limits due to the absurd property taxes.
How much does the college add to that area? I know it's a wicked party school with a long history of shenanigans and property damage around town, but I hate to cast the whole area in that light.
I'm fortunate to live near Dartmouth College. While they've had their share of shenanigans as well, almost everything else they do and provide to the public is hugely beneficial (and I don't mean just being the major employer). Arts, entertainment, cultural events, outdoor concerts, etc. etc. So much is accessible to the public.
Update: Thank you all for providing us with your input and suggestions. Based on your recommendations, we visited Manchester, the Seacoast areas, and North Conway in the past two months. And loved what we saw.
Dover and Portsmouth had most of the things we want, ( Children's Museum, Henry Law Park, unschooling community, organic food, health stores, hospitals, Odiorne State Park, Seacoast Science Center, etc.).
As such we will be moving to the Seacoast area, probably Dover if we find a rental. We are okay driving an hr to Whole Foods once or twice a month if needed. They had great prices and selection for food.
Our main goal is to explore the Seacoast areas of NH before we decide to buy a house as we want to be closer to the ocean.
Right now, we are looking more closely at the following towns: Lee, Madbury, Durham, and Dover. Any info on these towns (especially finding rental units, ticks, access to the internet and laws about running an online business from home) will be appreciated.
What is Somersworth like, we have seen most of the rental units there and in Rochester are cheaper than Dover?
I loved NH when I lived there and hated to leave. I'm now divorced, but I can't afford to move back to NH due to high property taxes. We lived in Lebanon and the current tax on our former home is $12K/year. On a $40K teaching income, that's impossible. I now live in TX which also has no state income tax, but we do have a sales tax. I have a 40-acre horse farm with a new 3000 sf house, excellent Morton barns, etc., and my property taxes are right around $7K/year. Much more manageable. NH has got to do something to alleviate those high property taxes. I would move back in a heartbeat, but simpiy cannot afford to.
I loved NH when I lived there and hated to leave. I'm now divorced, but I can't afford to move back to NH due to high property taxes. We lived in Lebanon and the current tax on our former home is $12K/year. On a $40K teaching income, that's impossible. I now live in TX which also has no state income tax, but we do have a sales tax. I have a 40-acre horse farm with a new 3000 sf house, excellent Morton barns, etc., and my property taxes are right around $7K/year. Much more manageable. NH has got to do something to alleviate those high property taxes. I would move back in a heartbeat, but simpiy cannot afford to.
The total overall tax burden for state and local taxes is 8.15% in Texas, and 7.07% in New Hampshire. This includes property taxes.
In the past year or so, I have closed on an immaculate 2,000sf log home on over 40 acres and the taxes are only $4,300 a year, and a decent 2,000sf home on almost 30 acres with immaculate horse barn and fields for horses and taxes are only $4,700 a year. In the past few months I've showed clients 3,000sf+ homes on lots in the following sizes: 27 acres, 110 acres, 270 acres, 100+ acres, and the taxes for all these properties ranged between 7k-9k a year. Yes, there are many homes in NH with 12k property taxes, but there are numerous homes with taxes way lower than that.
Yes, there are many homes in NH with 12k property taxes, but there are numerous homes with taxes way lower than that.
One key is to avoid some of the particular towns with high tax rates relative to the property value. Lebanon's nice.... but by living down the highway in Grantham, I've got a nice, large 5 acre lot, nice landscape, quiet evenings, good schools (here for the Elementary, Lebanon for Middle and High), and while the town itself doesn't have a lot of business (okay, almost none), but the drive to the central Upper Valley is short, and aside from 7:55 to 8:05am and 4:50 to 5:10pm, almost completely without traffic.
My 2017 tax bill was $5618.
Lebanon is a 1-2 punch, in that it's got a somewhat higher tax rate than a lot of the surrounding towns, and a higher valuation that most of the surrounding towns except Hanover.
Update: Thank you all for providing us with your input and suggestions. Based on your recommendations, we visited Manchester, the Seacoast areas, and North Conway in the past two months. And loved what we saw.
Dover and Portsmouth had most of the things we want, ( Children's Museum, Henry Law Park, unschooling community, organic food, health stores, hospitals, Odiorne State Park, Seacoast Science Center, etc.).
As such we will be moving to the Seacoast area, probably Dover if we find a rental. We are okay driving an hr to Whole Foods once or twice a month if needed. They had great prices and selection for food.
Our main goal is to explore the Seacoast areas of NH before we decide to buy a house as we want to be closer to the ocean.
Right now, we are looking more closely at the following towns: Lee, Madbury, Durham, and Dover. Any info on these towns (especially finding rental units, ticks, access to the internet and laws about running an online business from home) will be appreciated.
What is Somersworth like, we have seen most of the rental units there and in Rochester are cheaper than Dover?
Thanks in advance.
I have a son who goes to the summer camp at the Seacoast Science Center every year for a couple of weeks. They have a great program and he really loves it. As far as the towns you mentioned are concerned, Lee is nice but you don't want to live too close to the racetrack. It's not that it is a bad area, you just might not like the noise. Or maybe you might? The people who go to the races seem to have a lot of fun. There is also a nudist camp near there. Madbury is nice but quiet, with good schools but if you're homeschooling it won't matter I guess. Durham has the college but I don't know much else about it. Dover has a lot of shopping and is nice in the outskirts. Schooling is mediocre but from what I hear, improving.
Somersworth and Rochester have worse reputations than Dover does, and in some parts of the city it is warranted. I live in Rochester...the outskirts are nice and there is plenty of shopping. Downtown during the day isn't too bad either but stay away from some parts at night. Drugs are a problem there for sure. Somersworth has a similar reputation but I can't confirm firsthand. I live on the very edge of Rochester and I love it. Elementary schools are good in my experience. The high school has a bad reputation but I've gotten mixed reviews from people I've talked to about it. I'm a bit worried about what it will be like when I have to send my own kids. Your kids would be going to school with the children of the drug addicts at just the time they are getting old enough to start experimenting themselves. That worries me. I may want to try private school. (if anyone has any recommendations I'm all ears) Again though if you're home schooling it won't matter. In my neighborhood there are quite a few home schoolers but I don't know if they have any sort of organized group they belong to. I moved here from a large city in Massachusetts so I may be more forgiving of some of the faults of that area than most around here, so keep that in mind.
I like Lee and Madbury a lot. You're about halfway between the Portsmouth and Rochester/Dover/Somersworth shopping areas but out in the woods enough to avoid some of the problems involved with living in the larger "cities"(larger by NH standards) and the high prices of Portsmouth. You are also close to Epping where there is plenty of shopping as well.
Last edited by Fifty Seven; 07-31-2018 at 07:05 AM..
I have a son who goes to the summer camp at the Seacoast Science Center every year for a couple of weeks. They have a great program and he really loves it. As far as the towns you mentioned are concerned, Lee is nice but you don't want to live too close to the racetrack. It's not that it is a bad area, you just might not like the noise. Or maybe you might? The people who go to the races seem to have a lot of fun. There is also a nudist camp near there. Madbury is nice but quiet, with good schools but if you're homeschooling it won't matter I guess. Durham has the college but I don't know much else about it. Dover has a lot of shopping and is nice in the outskirts. Schooling is mediocre but from what I hear, improving.
Somersworth and Rochester have worse reputations than Dover does, and in some parts of the city it is warranted. I live in Rochester...the outskirts are nice and there is plenty of shopping. Downtown during the day isn't too bad either but stay away from some parts at night. Drugs are a problem there for sure. Somersworth has a similar reputation but I can't confirm firsthand. I live on the very edge of Rochester and I love it. Elementary schools are good in my experience. The high school has a bad reputation but I've gotten mixed reviews from people I've talked to about it. I'm a bit worried about what it will be like when I have to send my own kids. Your kids would be going to school with the children of the drug addicts at just the time they are getting old enough to start experimenting themselves. That worries me. I may want to try private school. (if anyone has any recommendations I'm all ears) Again though if you're home schooling it won't matter. In my neighborhood there are quite a few home schoolers but I don't know if they have any sort of organized group they belong to. I moved here from a large city in Massachusetts so I may be more forgiving of some of the faults of that area than most around here, so keep that in mind.
I like Lee and Madbury a lot. You're about halfway between the Portsmouth and Rochester/Dover/Somersworth shopping areas but out in the woods enough to avoid some of the problems involved with living in the larger "cities"(larger by NH standards) and the high prices of Portsmouth. You are also close to Epping where there is plenty of shopping as well.
Pogue, thank you for your detailed information, it's very helpful and valuable. We will check out Rochester and Somersworth later this summer.
What's the best way to get a 2BR or 3BR rental unit, ideally with a backyard? Do you have any recommendations?
Also, are there any areas in Dover we should avoid?
The total overall tax burden for state and local taxes is 8.15% in Texas, and 7.07% in New Hampshire. This includes property taxes.
These numbers are very misleading - especially if you own property. The burden on property owners is way too high and many people find living in Texas or other states much more affordable even given your (suspicious) numbers. We've passed on many a house in NH that we could afford to buy - but couldn't afford the long term property tax burden. Have friends who lost their house because of high taxes that went from $2550 when they bought it 28 years ago to now $6,620 and there have been no upgrades in town services. Their property value now is less than when they bought it but the town has it assessed for 70k more. So numbers do lie.
Just so we're clear, you can live in the most expensive, "best" school districts in the State (like Hanover for instance) and, most certainly, "Your kids would be going to school with the children of the drug addicts at just the time they are getting old enough to start experimenting themselves."
I'm not trying to downplay problems in schools, but they are in EVERY school. The rich communities just get their drugs from a doctor, or hide it better.
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