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Old 01-29-2012, 04:45 PM
 
5 posts, read 21,662 times
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Where are you coming from? South Georgia
Why are you moving? Husband interviewing for job in NYC
Where will you be working? If NYC, what part of NYC? Midtown right next to Penn Plaza

Will you buy or rent? rent
What is your budget? not 100% sure but thinking under $2,000
What kind of place are you looking for? Prefer more of a house feel with access to the backyard, at least 2 bedrooms. We own a 1200 sq ft 3 bed, 3 bath home right now. I realize we will not enjoy the same amt of space in an apt without a much bigger budget, but anything even getting close to our current home would be ideal.

Will anyone (spouse, children, pets) be moving with you ? 2 adults, one kid (age 4) and one 70lb Labrador
Do you need/want good public schools? YES! Our son will start kindergarten in the fall.

Briefly describe the kind of neighborhood you'd like to live in: Family friendly, safety is important, near parks and essentials like grocery stores and pharmacies. Don't care so much about other types of shopping. Good schools. Close to train line.

List three things that are important to you in order of importance:
1. Reasonably priced
2. Easy commute into midtown
3. Family friendly and good schooling....I guess I gave you my top four!



I should start by saying that we will likely be the picture of country come to town. We are considering the suburbs simply because I CANNOT imagine living with thousands of other people right on top of me. With that in mind we are thinking that Montclair or Bloomfield may be a good fit for us at least because it seems the commute is reasonable. Is the train ride really 35-40 minutes or are there often delays? I'm sorry to be so uninformed, but how are the trains? Easy to get on and off and comfortable enough to be on for 40 minutes? What can we expect regarding commuting everyday?

What is the rental market like? What kinds of fees and such should I expect to pay? Is it difficult to find a place that allows a large dog? We have owned our home for the last 5 years but before buying we did rent for many years. I have to say though, the rental process in the small town south goes something like this - walk through, decide you like it, tell the landlord you want to rent it verbally, pay a deposit and maybe a pet deposit, sign a lease and move in. No applications, no credit checks, etc. I imagine it won't be so simple in NJ....

One of our biggest concerns in choosing a town are the schools. If you have any insight into Essex county schools other than what I can read on Wikipedia, that would be great.

Really, any thoughts, tips, places to look into, places to avoid, etc would be helpful.

Thanks!
Heather
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Old 01-29-2012, 09:03 PM
 
115 posts, read 381,504 times
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Heather,

FYI - Essex County can be a great place to live. But the taxes are high, so usually rents are too. Brian Lehrer told the Essex County Executive Joseph DiVincenzo, Jr. that Essex County is one of the most segregated counties in the USA on his radio show (Union County too). That anecdotal census broadcast is here. So it's diverse, but you can usually see the lines on a daily basis. The county is pretty divided racially and economically from East to West. The East side near Newark is much poorer than the very affluent west Essex towns. In the middle are the more affordable, but certainly not cheap "buffer towns" as some locals call them.

East Essex includes Belleville, Newark, Orange, East Orange, Irvington and Nutley. I like parts of Newark downtown and the Ironbound, and it's the epicenter of rail transportation in NJ, but I wouldn't send my kids to public school there. Nutley is a decent school, but no public transportation. Very large Italian American population and a good school (it has one of the nicest football fields I've ever seen).

West Essex: Millburn, Livingston, the Caldwells, Fairfield, Roseland, Essex Fells, & Verona. Millburn (and the area within it of Short Hills) is on the train line and has excellent schools, but is very pricey.

Then, you get to the "buffer towns" that are racially and economically diverse and represent a true melting pot of America. They also IMHO are some of the coolest towns in NJ.

Montclair has a great downtown, many train stops, and the schools would be good enough for me. (Stephen Colbert and many other celebs live in Montclair). Cedar Grove is small, not as diverse, but has rail and excellent schools. Both Montclair and Cedar Grove are cheaper than Millburn, but that's not saying much.

Bloomfield is much more affordable, with the north end of town being safer, but the south end having two train stations into the city with the light rail to Newark as well. I have a friend who sent her son to Bloomfield HS and he loved it. But some on this forum might not. If not for the economic downturn, I would have put Bloomfield as a town that was up-and-coming.

Then, there's the very famous South Orange and Maplewood who now have SOPAC (Newark has NJPAC). Cheaper than Montclair, but like Essex overall, the more east you go, the more affordable. The more west, the safer, but more expensive. They're both nice towns, the schools aren't bad, but they're not great. A Peabody Award-winning radio documentary was done about the HS there, Columbia.

West Orange is also there, has a nice zoo and skating rink, but no public transportation. Schools are decent and it is a more affordable town.

Last edited by Cherno; 01-29-2012 at 09:16 PM..
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Old 01-29-2012, 11:01 PM
 
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Cherno did a really great job of giving you a feel for the area (love the radio broadcasts - thanks for that!). For the most part, Essex County is defined by the poorer urban areas that you'll most likely want to avoid (Newark, East Orange, Orange, and Irvington) and the wealthier suburbs that surround them.

If you're like me, and commute into midtown, you're going to want to be as close to a train as possible. They're efficient, fast, and save for the occasional delays leaving Penn Station - will get the job down as painlessly as possible in such a crowded busy area. Keep in mind most stations don't have public parking, so you're going to want to keep that in mind when choosing a place to live.

Essex County has two train lines, and both offering direct service to New York Penn Station. The Montclair-Boonton Line, which passes through Newark, Bloomfield, Glen Ridge, and Montclair, and the Morristown Line, which passes through Newark, East Orange, Orange, South Orange, Maplewood, and Millburn. I'll try to give you a brief rundown on these towns. (Also, New Jersey Monthly magazine does a bi-annual ranking of the state's high schools. It's not an exact science, but it can give you a starting point. You can also click links to sort it by county: 2010 Top High Schools in New Jersey | High School Rankings | High School Ratings)

Montclair-Boonton Line:

Bloomfield: A solid working class town, this offers some of the best values in suburban Essex County for New York City commuters. The northern part of town called Brookdale (by the fantastic Brookdale Park) is considered the most desirable, with the nicest homes and best grammar schools, but there are no train stations.

Generally speaking, the closer you get to the town's southern border with East Orange and/or Newark, the more the neighborhood goes down. Both of the towns train stations are in the southern part of town, and certain parts can get sketchy, but you can still find good values in nice areas near the Bloomfield stop (I'd avoid the Watsessing stop area). Generally speaking, the southern part of a town is a bit more crowded and urban feeling also.

Shops line Broad Street from north to south in town - nothing fancy, but if you're not picky there's a lot that can get the job done. You're also a short drive away from the hip scene in Montclair.

The main drawback of Bloomfield is that the high school is considering underperforming for the area. Horrible? No, but not up the levels of Glen Ridge and Montclair. This keeps the housing prices much lower, but turns a lot of people off from the town.

Glen Ridge:

In a word, charming. Old homes, streets still lit by gaslamp - it's like a different world. It's tiny - basically Bloomfield's western most streets that broke off from the rest of town in the late 1800's. It's school system is the main draw for many - as the town is tiny and mostly wealthy - test scores and graduation rates are high, and the high school is considered one of the best in the state. Throw in a 35 minute ride to Penn Station, and you have a town a lot of people want to live in. Consequently, it's not cheap, and that may be the main drawback for you. There also are not a lot of rentals in town.

The town is the definition of family friendly, as it seems almost every house has a child - there are always kids everywhere. There's not quite as much outdoor public space as in Montclair (though you're always a short drive from Brookdale Park and Eagle Rock reservation) and it has no downtown of it's own. You'll take the short drive to Montclair and/or Bloomfield for most of your shopping.

Montclair:

My favorite town in New Jersey. Montclair has it all: Old beautiful homes, New Jersey's best restaurant scene, tons of culture (theaters, museums), and a very liberal, young, but family oriented environment.

Montclair has not one, but three downtowns with tons of shops and restaurants. Parks and reservations for hiking also are all over the town. Basically, you'll have to try hard to be bored here! It has a long and storied history of diversity, and is really popular with young families moving out to the burbs from the city.

Like Bloomfield it's large, and has it's different neighborhoods - the town runs to both extremes of the wealth spectrum: from some of the largest homes in Essex County in the southwest part of the town called the "Estate Section" to the 5th ward near Glenfield Park that has poverty rates as high as any inner city.

The area north of Watchung Ave is referred to as Upper Montclair, and is the most popular with New York City commuters. There are five train stations (!) - and almost every house is within walking distance of one. It also has it's own charming downtown on Valley Road with shops, restaurants, grocery stores, and movie theaters. It's very expensive, but certainly worth looking into. I know for sure there are apartment complexes renting two bedrooms for under $2,000.

Watchung Ave has a train station and a little downtowny area, and you may be able to find something cheaper a little south of that area.

In the southern part of town, the rents near the Walnut Street station will likely be cheaper, though the area is a little younger (post college) and less family oriented, and a little more urban feeling and crowded. But you'll be close to Montclair's main downtown on Bloomfield Ave and on Church St. I'd avoid living near the Bay Street train station. Not the nicest part of Montclair.

Montclair's school system is run a little differently. It's a magnet system, meaning parents get to send their kids to the school of their choosing. It's meant to keep the schools racially diverse, but each school will also have a speciality and focus (ie: Math and Science, or Visual and Performing Arts). Everyone goes to the same high school - and because the town runs the gambit wealth wise - test scores are not as uniformly high as towns like Glen Ridge. Many people see this as a positive - maybe a bit more like a real world, but it's a concern for others. The people that live in town will tell you they couldn't be happier with the school system.

Morristown Line:

I think most people here would agree with me when they say you should skip East Orange and Orange, so let's just move on to South Orange:

South Orange: Baristanet.com (a local Essex County website, highly recommended) just did a great little rundown of both South Orange (also gas lamp lit!) and Maplewood (both towns share Columbia High School, which NJ Monthly ranks high). I'll just use their words here, as they did a great job. Original link here.

"Home to Seton Hall University, South Orange offers a mix of suburban tranquility and urban flair. Situated between the South Mountain Reservation and Newark, the village shares a school system with sister town Maplewood. The downtown center is anchored by the South Orange Performing Arts Center (SOPAC), and boasts a gourmet grocery store and scores of independently owned shops and restaurants. South Orange attracts a diverse mix of residents including recent graduates, young families, jazz musicians and artists; it is also a mecca for upper-middle class African-Americans. The town recently elected one of the youngest mayors in New Jersey, providing a fresh influx of energy to the political scene. Crime is sometimes an issue near the Newark border, and the town has increased police presence there in recent months. Housing stock varies from charming single-family homes to luxury rental apartments and stately mansions in the Montrose Historic District. Steep property taxes are offset by access to train and bus lines, spiffed-up parks and green spaces, an affordable municipal pool, and a vibrant cultural scene."

Maplewood:

Also from baristanet.com. Original link here.

"Known for its tree-lined streets, lovely old homes, socially progressive attitude (lots of Occupy Wall-Street supporters here) and proximity to NYC, Maplewood packs a lot of personality into its four square miles. Young professionals, recent immigrants, creative types and gay families alike appreciate the town’s welcoming, small-town vibe –- not for nothing is its nickname “Mapleberry.” Two main shopping districts –- the charming walkable downtown packed with chic stores and restaurants, and the bustling strip of Springfield Avenue -– buzz with stroller-pushing moms and local workers. In summer, locals flock to the town pool, and to the ultra-popular, ultra-groovy Maplewoodstock, a free outdoor concert that has become a tradition. Columbia High School, which also serves adjacent South Orange, is recognized for its stellar arts and music programs as well as a state champion fencing team — and is the birthplace of Ultimate Frisbee. Housing prices are a bargain compared to some nearby towns but come with a high property tax bill.

“Value is what is selling homes in Maplewood over Montclair,” says Robert Northfield, real estate broker/sales person for Coldwell Banker Residential Brokerage’s Maplewood office. He says buyers can find a “Montclair” house for a little less in Maplewood. Buyers are attracted to the community’s variety of housing stock and styles, small town feel, tree-lined streets, diversity, the Village, good schools, beautiful parks and the “fantastic commute to New York City” — one half hour by train."

Millburn:

I know little about Millburn expect for:

- it's school system is considered the best in the state
- it's really wealthy
- it's really expensive
- it's home to Short Hills Mall - lots of high end stores
- it's really wealthy

I'm sure someone here can fill you in on it better than I.

Keep in mind that all of these towns are near the urban areas where crime is high, and it does spill over occasionally into ALL of the towns listed above. Violent crime is almost never a problem, and the towns are incredibly safe, but burglaries can happen. Lock your doors to both your car and home, and you'll avoid 90% of most problems.

That being said, the vibrant downtowns, culture, and community feel, coupled with a great New York commute - and these towns can't be beat. It really is, in my opinion, the best place to live in New Jersey. It's expensive, but worth it if you can afford it.


To answer your other questions about commuting:

- expect crowded trains at rush hours
- expect the trains to show up on time
- expect occasionally delays leaving penn station
- expect penn station to be a madhouse at rush hours

Get a book or iphone or ipad or whatever, and just sit down and enjoy the ride. It's better than sitting in traffic (which is awful on highways in Northern New Jersey by the way - another benefit of living in towns with local downtowns - you can avoid all that).

For the rental market - Avoid craig's list. Too many scams. You can get lucky, but I don't even recommend looking at it. Use a realtor, and a website like Trulia, Realtor.com or Zillow. Yes, you'll have to pay a brokers fee (never, ever pay anyone up front - thats the sign of a scam), but it's worth it to get a legit place in my opinion.

Another great option can be a website like apartments.com - or just contacting an apartment complex you like yourself. Apartments.com puts you in touch with the building itself, and you don't have to pay a brokers fee. Contract and credit check will definitely happen.


Any other questions, ask away!

Last edited by labcjo; 01-29-2012 at 11:30 PM..
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Old 01-30-2012, 07:35 AM
 
5 posts, read 21,662 times
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Wow! I am overwhelmed with information - and that's a good thing. Thanks to both of you! I am glad to hear that the trains pretty much run on time and that we have hope of finding a decent place with good local schools in our budget. I will check out all the links you provided and continue to learn more about an area in which this southern girl just never imagined living. Thanks again!
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Old 01-30-2012, 08:11 PM
 
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Great summation labcjo.

I think it shows the diversity of Essex.

Just in two towns, Maplewood to Millburn - you'd go from:

East Maplewood - predominately African American, to mixed Whites & African Americans (and gays) to newer immigrants in the Wyoming section of Millburn like Russians, Indians, Koreans and Chinese to an established and vibrant Jewish community in Short Hills. Millburn Twp. (including Short Hills) even increased its Asian population by nearly half from 2000 to 2010.

So there is a bit of a culture shock coming from the South, I'd imagine. But you'll be able to get any type of ethnic food . . . at high quality too.
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Old 02-01-2012, 03:26 PM
 
Location: Montclair, NJ
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Wow, great descriptions.

I'd start getting letters from neighbors about how quiet, friendly, clean the dog is that you can show a prospective landlord.
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Old 02-02-2012, 11:57 AM
 
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Thanks, MontclairNative! I will get working on those letters ASAP.
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