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well, the CBO report you posted, though it breaks it down by education level, it does not compare like jobs. So, while college educated public sector workers make more than college educated private sector workers, there's no accounting for the fact that my college educated cousin is a yoga instructor and my college educated friend works at starbucks, and etc.
the like jobs thing doesn't work in your favor. you could have an office paper pusher in the private sector earning $11 an hour with no benefits and a high school degree where the similar paper pusher will have a college degree, earn $20 an hour and have health insurance and a pension. both doing the same job, but compensation is much better in the public sector. that's where the bulk of your workforce is and that's why you see as education level goes up, the government advantage is less. however, they are still ahead I believe in each category. people like yourself sometimes forget that for every one of you, there are 10 low income workers. now if you want to compare equal jobs to yours, you need to know where you stand in the private sector. is your compensation average for your job or are you on the higher end?
Last edited by CaptainNJ; 01-17-2014 at 08:15 PM..
What I have read and seen through my experience is that low skill jobs pay better in the public sector and higher skill jobs pay better in the private sector.
We sometime get second career retirees from large companies that are well off financially and they tell us the pay is not where it should be for the work we expect from them. I know it is anecdotal but it is a fairly common refrain.
What I have read and seen through my experience is that low skill jobs pay better in the public sector and higher skill jobs pay better in the private sector.
We sometime get second career retirees from large companies that are well off financially and they tell us the pay is not where it should be for the work we expect from them. I know it is anecdotal but it is a fairly common refrain.
My experience as well. I am a consultant. Do a lot or work with various forms of state/local governments. A few times a client has approached me off the record about joining them in-house. But they can never afford me. I'm sure the $5 copays would be great, and the idea of never losing your job EVER sounds like a good deal, but most of my client offices are so slow and mundane, I could never entertain spending the next 30 years of my life there.
No $5 co-pay where I work. A major problem with the envy against government employee benefits is people use old information or just completely incorrect information and assume it is factual.
We fired 40 people over the last 2 years out of about 1,200
and that $650,000 you have in your scenario would leave you with annual income of about $26,000/yr if you followed the rule of withdrawing 4%/yr and increasing for inflation. so in the scenario of your saving your own money, you come out far behind the scenario of the pension. if you felt like doing the math, you'd have discovered that though.
You would actually more or less break even using the 4%/year rule if you invested the other $2,100 into an IRA. I'm not going to to argue that defined benefit isn't the better option if you live longer than average, but there are some advantages to defined contribution.
The feasibility of defined benefit ultimately boils down to whether it's sustainable in the long term; and from my perspective, this isn't the case in NJ.
But you voted for these big wigs! I dont get it. The teachers union LOVED christie in 09 or whenever he eas elected. Now he makes a couple of bills that impact teachers and its like "oh hell no".
longer hours, more school in the summer. Can't wait for teachers to start demanding 100k salaries for 4th grade teachers.
A gym teacher in the district of my town retired a few years ago, after working for about 30 years, with a salary of $110,000. I know this because I looked it up since these records are public. Then I looked up some other teachers' salaries, ones who I know have been teaching for a while, and I was floored. Am I the only one who thinks this is excessive and completely ridiculous? A GYM teacher?? This may sound controversial (my entire post actually ) but I think there should be a cap on things like this, either a required retirement age or no tenure (because some teachers who are tenured get lazy, I have seen it) or a tenure harder to achieve or a cap on salary, yes depending on subject or age taught, or not getting a raise every single year. This kind of stuff is out of control. I don't even want to know what the cops (and fireman) in my town make and what they retire with, considering I know how safe my town is and I know for a fact those cops have nothing to do a lot of the time other than aimlessly pulling people over and issuing tickets. Then there's the fact that we have local, some county, and state police. Many towns that definitely could consolidate departments to save money (and because in some areas, you really don't need that many cops and fireman to be honest) still have their own departments and units.
In 2010, teachers in my town were striking before school - yup, marching, holding signs, and everything. They refused to go in before school officially started to help kids, and refused to stay after 4:00, even if students needed help. Not one teacher showed up to graduation for the Class of 2010 as volunteers or to support the students, all because it wasn't required in their contracts - thy were rebelling and it was so unfair to the kids. They wore black on Fridays to "mourn their paychecks" and wore red on Wednesdays to "show their power". It was completely ridiculous. A circus. It's out of hand, and the union is too powerful. I remember hearing a teacher who called in to NJ 101.5 a few years ago complaining, I mean like the world just ended, that because of Christie, she had to pay something under $10 ($8 or $9 or something) for her prescriptions. She previously had to pay $2. The host laughed at her and disconnected her call. Unreal.
I understand that public/state employees like teachers and fireman (especially first responders) have difficult jobs requiring time and effort, if they do it right (lazy teachers, anyone? ), and they're only helping out the public, technically every day putting their lives on the line, but I think NJ takes it too far with benefits. I highly respect all of these professionals and appreciate what they do, don't be mistaken by my anger at the situation, and I know that individually none of them can be blamed for the precedents set years ago, but I think it's a real problem here that needs to be addressed. There's a reason our taxes are so high and other states' aren't, and we have these problems and others don't. We pay our teachers some of the highest salaries in the nation (I think 5th nationally?).
Sorry, I needed to rant. This stuff really grinds my gears, especially because I know many cops, fireman, and teachers (and I love them ALL) who love complaining about this stuff, while the non cops, firemen, and teachers all roll our eyes because we know the reality and aren't clouded by bias and, yes, greed.
Last edited by JerseyGirl415; 01-19-2014 at 12:29 AM..
A gym teacher in the district of my town retired a few years ago, after working for about 30 years, with a salary of $110,000. I know this because I looked it up since these records are public.
Please post the town/employee name so I can look up this fact. Just curious.
Please post the town/employee name so I can look up this fact. Just curious.
Holy crap...not going to post the name but.
18 years
$130,278 Family & Consumer Sciences – Apparel, Textiles and Interiors
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), and they're only helping out the public, technically every day putting their lives on the line, but I think NJ takes it too far with benefits. I highly respect all of these professionals and appreciate what they do, don't be mistaken by my anger at the situation, and I know that individually none of them can be blamed for the precedents set years ago, but I think it's a real problem here that needs to be addressed. There's a reason our taxes are so high and other states' aren't, and we have these problems and others don't. We pay our teachers some of the highest salaries in the nation (I think 5th nationally?). 
