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I don't support them cleaning up for me any more than I support them telling me where I can and can't live. Regardless, the accumulation of debris that one see's in the Lincoln would support the position that they aren't spending a lot of that public money up there anyway.
I say let it burn. http://bestsmileys.com/fire/3.gif (broken link)
Last edited by TKO; 05-04-2008 at 11:56 AM..
Reason: clarification
I don't support them cleaning up for me any more than I support them telling me where I can and can't live. Regardless, the accumulation of debris that one see's in the Lincoln would support the position that they aren't spending a lot of that public money up there anyway.
I say let it burn. http://bestsmileys.com/fire/3.gif (broken link)
On that, you and I absolutely agree. Like it or not, the forests are in such a condition now that fires are larglely inevitable. I recall a conversation I had a few years ago with a forest specialist Forest Service employee about a beetle-ravaged forest area. He basically said, "As a Forest Service employee, I would tell you that if a fire started up there, we would do everything we could to put it out. As a forester, I wish I could go up there with 5 gallons of gas and a match--that would be way better in the long run for the forest itself."
I think we agree on most of it. Enough to make comfortable anyhow, I think I'd like that forester. In the end Mother Nature's gonna have her way with us. As it should be.
I'm in agreement with what has been expressed about brush and forest fires having been suppressed so much that it produces more and more fuel until the consequences are inevitable and a fire erupts, either due to man made accident or arson, or due to natural causes like lightning, and then when the fire starts it becomes gigantic and widespread. We need to let more natural fires burn themselves out in order to clear the forest. Besides that, artificially suppressing the fires changes the mix of trees in the forest because some need empty spaces and sunshine to start, and others need fire to explode the cones and let the seeds out to germinate.
It sounds lovely to have a beautiful cabin in a little clearing in the middle of the forest, but to live there you've got to accept that it's inevitable that one day the forest will burn down, and grow again, but your house is going to burn down with it. It's unreasonable to expect otherwise, and it's unreasonable to expect the taxpayers to finance this untenable type of settlement.
Anybody who still wants to live in forested areas should be required to clear a large enough clearing that their house won't burn down when the forest burns down. Yes, that isn't as nice as being right in the trees, but unfortunately man and man's houses are alien to the forest. The forest belongs there, not the house. If somebody wants to live there then they need to face reality, and understand and accept the consequences.
And we really need to quit putting out naturally caused forest fires. We're just making the problem worse by doing that.
Myself, I'd love to live in a forest, but for all of the above reasons I'll settle some place else.
Really if you think about it, probably half the country lives in an area where natural disasters are more the norm than a freak thing. Do we apply these same principles to them? Earthquakes in Cali, drought in the midwest, blizzards up north, hurricanes in the southeast coast and flooding just about everywhere. Many of these other disasters involve considerable manipulation by man of the natural order of things. Where do we draw this line?
I don't live in the forest, I live in Cruces but we have the cabin to get away from the heat in the summer and it IS lovely. It is in the forest and surrounded by trees and it will almost certainly be burned down one of these days. We have insurance and we'll rebuilt if we choose to, despite the fact that it'll happen again one day. We're certainly not alone in this stubborness and we don't ask for any special expenditures by the forest service to save us. What's the problem with that?
I'ts far too large an area to just clean up. The way it's cleaned up is by fire. A series of planned fires may be the way to go, but it's a task of monumental proportions and I don't think it's going to happen before a natural fire does it for us. Most of it's National Forest too, so the "owners" are us.
In one of the states I lived in (Tn.) people volunteered to keep the mountains/forests cleaned up. I'm surprised it is not that way in NM. I am ignorant when it comes to fires because I've lived in cities all my life. Now it's off to the mountains and forests of Timberon and I'm learning from you good people on what to do and how to prevent fires.
In one of the states I lived in (Tn.) people volunteered to keep the mountains/forests cleaned up. I'm surprised it is not that way in NM. I am ignorant when it comes to fires because I've lived in cities all my life. Now it's off to the mountains and forests of Timberon and I'm learning from you good people on what to do and how to prevent fires.
Welcome and I'm sure you'll enjoy it. Solitude and peace&quite are priceless and you'll find as much of both as you want in Timberon. Tennessee is one of the most beautiful states in the union IMO and that's very respectable that that sort of effort is put forth. I think here folks generally keep the area around their settlements clear so as to minimize the danger, but fire really is a part of the natural order of things in these forests. Plus the forest are immense and really steep terrain with limited roads.
They become unhealthy when the fires are kept down for too long as evidenced by the recent pest infestations. It's a conundrum to be sure since we've taken advantage of the suppression and built in areas that are due to burn, as discussed above. Kind of like water, it's a hot issue. No pun intended!
I was just at a friends house, and he works on the Mescalero Reservation. He informed me, BECAUSE they thin trees(log) and clean up the underbrush, cut the branches so high on the trees, that the fire is not getting in the trees, its mainly running on grasses. This could change, but for not its not the threat that the Lincoln could be to us. Glad I got a lot of brush cut down this spring.
I was just at a friends house, and he works on the Mescalero Reservation. He informed me, BECAUSE they thin trees(log) and clean up the underbrush, cut the branches so high on the trees, that the fire is not getting in the trees, its mainly running on grasses. This could change, but for not its not the threat that the Lincoln could be to us. Glad I got a lot of brush cut down this spring.
You wouldn't know of a crew that does clearing up there would you? If you do and you would feel comfortable recommending them I am seriously in the market to hire. PM me if you do, or anyone else that knows of such a crew for that matter. I'm too old and broke down to tackle it all myself or I would.
You all have been such a big help on this and I've also read Mtcats post about what to do and what not to do.
We're heading up to timberon tomorrow for a week. I will miss cooking out this week but that's okay. We just want to get our place ready and get the pine needles raked up.
Remember the raindance. It's worth a try anyway.
Thanks everyone.
Cheryl
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