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The majority of Black Americans do not look mixed race, in terms of facial feature and hair. They just don't. You have a much higher percentage of Puerto Ricans who are clearly mixed race (and a smaller percentage of those who look just Black).
You're trying to confuse and complicate things, when there is no confusion and complication. Its irrelevant what any two individuals look like, the issue is what do groups as a whole look like. There just wasn't the same amount of race mixing in the US as there was in Latin America.
The reason why you feel that black Americans do not look mixed race is because mixed and black have often been lumped as black and thus you may not be able to distinguish the two.
Unless you are going for a certain type of mixed feature that you would tie to your epitome of what you feel looks mixed race.
For example Stacey Lattisaw is an example of a mixed looking AA. Better yet look at most of the Civil Rights elite and leaders and important historical traditional AA figures. They ALL were predominantly of white European descent and/or heavily mixed.
AA families continually still mix and have offspring of different colors since they are so mixed. They can easily pop out dark children, light children and everything else in between.
Would you consider singer Chris Brown to be mixed? He certainly looks mixed IMHO. This depends on how one perceives one's features etc. If Chris Brown said he was from DR i bet you would say he was very mixed or more mixed etc.
Well, when I was in Paraguay they called the Blacks there afroamericanos. African American or Afro American, can mean any person of African descent in the Americas. So if Mariah Carey's father had some African descent, yes, he was indeed AA (o afroamericano en Paraguay). So its not like she's off base calling herself AA, if she does indeed call herself that.
Paraguay had plenty of African slaves. There are African descendants in Paruguay that descend from Spanish colonial times.
And Mariah Carey's father was only half African American.
African American as it pertains to the USA is an ethnic group. Not a race.
Mariah Carey identifies as mixed.
As for Latin America one may notice that many Latin American nations tend to claim that the African descent and heritage in their countries is foreign and comes from some place else. In Bolivia there are plenty of black people but many are not aware of Afro Bolivians so many Bolivians assume blacks are foreign and come from Venezuela or Colombia or Brazil.
The same in Chile. In DR, people say blacks are from Haiti. In Puerto Rico, people accuse blacks as coming from Dominican Republic or other Caribbean islands.
In Chile, an African American friend of mine told me they assumed she was Haitian or Colombian or Peruvian or from some place else even though Child has it's own traditional black population etc.
In Panama, many people claim that blacks are foreign and come from Jamaica or Barbados or the Caribbean, when there has always been a large black population in Panama since colonial times.
In Cuba, people say that blacks are from Haiti or Jamaica etc yet there has always been blacks in Cuba.
You will however admit that Dominicans, until recently at least, had a very complicated attitude towards the African aspect of their ancestry and heritage. Indeed making more of their Taino roots.
It has been documented by many DOMINICAN intellectuals. Frank Moya Pons, Ginette Candelaria, and Silvio Torres Saillant. I doubt that any of them are extreme black militants, indeed two of them arent black, even by US criteria. One coined a book called "Black Behind the Ears" as she describes a fictive Indio/Iberian identity crafted by the Dominican elites and the notion that the black aspects of being Dominican are mumbled about and down played.
Now Dominicans are no means unique in this. So to pretend as if Dominicans do not have issues with "blackness" and African identity is ludicrous.
All Afrodiasporic groups have these issues. Most Latinos who identified as black on the censuses in the states have been DOMINICANS. Dominicans acknowledge that they have African roots. They just don't take on identities under the label black. Also people don't use the label black because to them it's being viewed as African American and they aren't AA.
And don't assume. No one said Dominicans don't have issues. I just feel that they get a bad wrap and at the end of the day if they don't want to identify as such then it's best to leave them be.
However I think it's important to note that it is hypocritical when some Dominicans impose the same identity perceptions on other people that they don't want done to them, as in one dropping and imposing other labels likewise on people that you don't want imposed on to yourself etc
You will however admit that Dominicans, until recently at least, had a very complicated attitude towards the African aspect of their ancestry and heritage. Indeed making more of their Taino roots.
It has been documented by many DOMINICAN intellectuals. Frank Moya Pons, Ginette Candelaria, and Silvio Torres Saillant. I doubt that any of them are extreme black militants, indeed two of them arent black, even by US criteria. One coined a book called "Black Behind the Ears" as she describes a fictive Indio/Iberian identity crafted by the Dominican elites and the notion that the black aspects of being Dominican are mumbled about and down played.
Now Dominicans are no means unique in this. So to pretend as if Dominicans do not have issues with "blackness" and African identity is ludicrous.
Dominicans were raped by Haitians and mistreated by Haitians and thats where some of the issue comes from and then the reign of terror by the hypocritical bigoted ingrate dictator Trujillo made things worse.
But you have to take into account the history. Haitians oppressed and conquered the Dominican side of the island and that left a bad taste and psychosis on Dominicans. Haitians were the Dominicans oppressors.
And also let's keep in mind xenophobia and racism are not the same thing.
And there are Dominicans that identify as black even in DR.
I don't recall him snapping up endorsements celebrating the first "Black" champion. He was just accepting endorsements because he was successful. I don't think it had anything to do with race or ethnicity. It was the media and the Black population yelling that he was this Black phenomenon and when he refused to go along with it, that's when the Black population went crazy and became angry, calling him everything under the sun because he didn't go along with their desire to label him.
I agree with you. To take it a step further, there were a few ads, commercials, and endorsements that Tiger partook in that promoted and made campaigns of anti racism and integration in the athletic and golf world since golf excluded people of color until recently and Tiger Woods was pegged as the person of color poster child of golf. His mixed race identity and heritage was capitalized on in endorsements as well and used to represent him as the All American human being and how he could identify with everyone.
I wish Tiger Woods and Mariah Carey had kids. They'd be every race and ethnicity on the planet practically lol!
I knew a pitch black Black American who told me he was English, Scottish, Irish and Native American! There are a number of Black Americans who claim to have all this Indian ancestry, despite having no obvious Indian features. Basically, this is self hatred and you see it throughout the Americas where you have large numbers of Blacks. Some people throughout the Caribbean bleach their skin as well. And this has been documented as well, so no need to say its specifically a Dominican thing, when there are Jamaicans, Black Americans, Trinidadians, Puerto Ricans, Cubans, among many others who are suffer from this mind set.
Agreed! It's a GLOBAL thing. It's even an issue in the Arab world. Arab slave trade imported and enslaved more blacks worldwide.
The reason why you feel that black Americans do not look mixed race is because mixed and black have often been lumped as black and thus you may not be able to distinguish the two.
Unless you are going for a certain type of mixed feature that you would tie to your epitome of what you feel looks mixed race.
For example Stacey Lattisaw is an example of a mixed looking AA. Better yet look at most of the Civil Rights elite and leaders and important historical traditional AA figures. They ALL were predominantly of white European descent and/or heavily mixed.
AA families continually still mix and have offspring of different colors since they are so mixed. They can easily pop out dark children, light children and everything else in between.
Would you consider singer Chris Brown to be mixed? He certainly looks mixed IMHO. This depends on how one perceives one's features etc. If Chris Brown said he was from DR i bet you would say he was very mixed or more mixed etc.
What are your thoughts?
Now you're starting to get ridiculously stupid. Most Black Americans do not look like Adam Clayton Powell or Rosa Parks! In skin color, hair types, and facial features, yes, Powell and Parks looked mixed. This is a MINORITY among Black Americans. You also ignore the fact post slavery and through Jim Crow until the 1960s, you had an extreme pattern of segregation in the US were racial mixing was illegal (and other certain circumstances could get one KILLED). Therefore you didn't have as MUCH mixing in the US between Blacks and whites that occurred in places like Puerto Rico. There's just no point in debating the issue.
If a dark skinned person that comes from Spanish speaking background you'd automatically assume they are mixed but a dark person that is of AA background to you would seem or look less mixed to you even though they may be more significantly mixed than the dark Latino person.
USA is more mixed than many realize.
You are projecting your own issues and thoughts on to me. I would not automatically assume that a dark skinned Hispanic person is MIXED. I REPEATEDLY said its BASED ON the PERSON's FEATURES overall, including HAIR TEXTURE.
As for racial mixing being so prevalent here, you are aware that African Americans (like other blacks for that matter) have been known to LIE about their family histories. Just as a Black Dominican may claim to be "Taino" You have plenty of Black Americans who claim lots of non Black ancestry when there is absolutely little evidence of it in many cases.
You also ignore the fact that race mixing was illegal POST SLAVERY until the 1960s. So how could there be a heavily mixed population among Black Americans. Race mixing could get you time disowned by your family (if you were white), jail, or even the killed (Black man with white woman).
And by the way, having a couple of white ancestors during slavery does not make one mixed race. Many people in this category have essentially no white features, as their "white" ancestry is practically a DROP in the bucket! Unless the person more recently had a white parent or grandparent (or other non Black parent) this is the extent mixing occurred in the US. You'd have to go back two centuries or more.
That's not very mixed.
USA Today has any interesting article on DNA testing on African Americans.
It said most African Americans who claimed Native American ancestry did not test as genetically Native American. People do LIE about their family history.
30% of African Americans tested had primarily European lineage on their father's side, probably a legacy from slavery. But guess what, though a decent percentage, its FAR from the MAJORITY or EVEN HALF of African Americans.
I really don't care what people consider themselves to be, or claim to be . I care what they objectively are, and this can be proven by DNA tests.
Now you're starting to get ridiculously stupid. Most Black Americans do not look like Adam Clayton Powell or Rosa Parks! In skin color, hair types, and facial features, yes, Powell and Parks looked mixed. This is a MINORITY among Black Americans. You also ignore the fact post slavery and through Jim Crow until the 1960s, you had an extreme pattern of segregation in the US were racial mixing was illegal (and other certain circumstances could get one KILLED). Therefore you didn't have as MUCH mixing in the US between Blacks and whites that occurred in places like Puerto Rico. There's just no point in debating the issue.
HA! Pot meet kettle. And you've been ridiculously stupid the whole time. You're welcome. Don't resort to name calling and disrespect when this has been a civil respectful eye opening and informative debate. Dont make this turn into a back and forth pissing match of insults. That's some ****ed up bull****. Keep it mature
I think you and I for the most part have been on the same page but we are saying different things while hitting and missing each others points while taking things further.
Don't put words in my mouth. I never said most traditional ethnic black Americans look like Adam Clayton Powell or Rosa Parks or other very multiracial or very white looking historical figures. I simply pointed out these individuals are examples of or as proof that there are many American individuals or black categorized individuals at that look and/or are very mixed. They are a big part of the traditional ethnic black American group. I say this because again African Americans are mixed enough to the point that when they have children among their own ethnic group their mixed genes mix with other mixed genes so it gets distributed throughout and among black Americans and you get offspring with different results. In one Black American family people can have a child that looks more black or is darker but then the next child after is very mixed looking or has some features or texture or skin color that looks or indicates mixture. However we have to keep in mind that a person that is mixed or has mixed ancestry could come out with any result so there is no one prototype to being or looking mixed but I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you're smart enough to understand that.*
NOPE. I'm not ignoring anything. It was only for a short period of Jim Crow that interracial unions or marriage was banned or prohibited. Im aware of our history. However keep in mind there were ways people got around it. There were many people of color that had themselves listed as white on paper so they could legally marry their white lover, partner, spouse etc. Then you had people of color that continued to have sex with their white partners and would have mixed race interracial children nonetheless. Of course it was done secretly. But these were just some factors. Even after 1930 when the USA temporarily eliminated mixed race identity, many people still identified themselves as mixed even until mixed race and interracialism was restored in 1967.
There had been plenty of tri racial isolate groups like the Melungeons, Jackson Whites, Lumbees, Redbones and other groups that lived isolated or were able to identify as white and/or mixed without any social reprucussions for generations. Most slaves were mixed during the colonial period in varying degrees. During the colonial period mulattoes mixed with each other and mixed with blacks and then created different mixed combinations and during the later years of Jim Crow it got lumped into one as simply black. So there are plenty of dark blacks that have lots of mixture. In fact it's been said that 5% of AAs have been found to have no detectable African ancestry. More than 70% of African Americans have more than 30% European ancestry.*
Im not overlooking what you are saying. Just adding in the other factors.
You preceded to contradict yourself or complicate or confuse the issue. You compared AAs to PRs but before you compared Afro Latinos to AAs which is flawed and complicated way of looking at or comparing the two of who is more mixed because are you speaking from proportions to respective nationalities? That's more so how I was looking at it.
If you are now comparing PR as a whole to AAs then that's a different story and even that has it's flaws because you have to take into account population sizes. There are more AAs worldwide than there are PRs worldwide. The population of traditional AAs in the states alone outnumbers the PR diaspora worldwide. So for example if you count the number of mixed looking AAs it would far outnumber PRs alone. That's what I was trying to say or get at.
I think you doing an average or as a whole or proportion wise in relation to which is a different story.
Just like for example if you took all the mixed AAs and relocated them to PR, they'd probably outnumber the pre existing population.
So again if you are talking about perception or proportions then I may get your drift
And again yes. NOT ALL Traditional Black Americans look like the very multiracial or very mixed looking historical figures and leaders that have often been promoted to represent black history, but my point is that many black Americans that look more black in features (whatever that truly means) often times themselves have significant mixed ancestry that has been maintained and continually mixed down the line. Basically most AAs are MGMs. Multigens.
Also think about how many black Americans have a biracial ancestor or a mulatto ancestor or a quadroon in their family or they have a biracial or multiracial mixed wife or husband or light skinned or mixed looking relative or spouse or they give birth to mixed looking children even though they may not look mixed themselves.
This happens plenty of time among black identified folks and families in the United States.
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