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Come on guys...you cant blame the Asians or prep schools. The kids not getting in need to blame themselves first and foremost. I and other Asians who came from 1st and 2nd generation homes, truly suffered when it came to poverty. My folks came to this country with $7.00 dollars in their pockets in the mid-70's. I went to BK tech after half ass studying from a prep book I picked up from the library. Our living conditions were miserable. We did not live in the projects nor did we sign up for welfare but that was due to safety and pride. So, my folks bust their chops and we all made due with what we had. Not just me, but many other friends who I met at school. None of the Indian kids used any prep courses at the time though I heard it was big in the Korean/Chinese community..but it was open to all for a price. I didn't know about it until afterwards and I doubt I would go even if I had the money, due to the distance from the Bronx.
If anyone wants to use such services...just google it. Hell, there is a franchise called Kumon learning centers.
I don't see anyone complaining about sport scholarships? A lot of kids had parents who could afford the extra training and memberships to leagues and clubs, while I couldn't. I never went to day camp or summer camp. I never had enough money to participate in sports leagues except one season due to my neighbor. I lost a tremendous advantage, but I sucked it up. So *** you all, who think we drop the standards once again to accomadate inferior students. I used inferior because it's you folks who make your kids inferior by lowering the bar so low, so that everyone looks at them as rejects from day one due to all the advantages.
What are the extraordinary differences encountered by blacks and hispanics, that aren't encountered by Asians? Poverty, crime, drugs, etc? Please I have been exposed in it all literally but ultimately made the effort to get out of it. You think the 3rd world is sweet? Please, visit and see what poverty, crime and injustice is al about. It will make any ghetto in America look like an upscale community.
You can't be too nice if you want to achieve anything at work or in business. I'm not saying be a ruthless villain, but at the same time you do what you gotta do.
Yet, liu forgets the birthplace of Buddhism and where it spread from. In a corporate environment, either you push hard or get stepped on hard. That's a fact. With no advantages whatsoever, no help, we striving.....
Not getting into those schools doesn't mean you're a failing parent. The reality is those schools are for those among the best and brightest at the materials tested and taught in those schools. Everyone needs to step back and realize that those are schools that emphasize "Science"
Don't "dumb" down a test, but have harder classes so that people won't have to pay for prep.
Do you suggest that they make the exams easier so that students still struggling with multiplication and division in 8th grade stand a fighting chance? Or is it better to up the standards so that kids can at least start doing a bit of algebra in junior high?
Also, those standardized tests don't reflect intelligence at all.
As for intelligence, we're at the point now where nothing in our lives reflect intelligence. People have a thousand excuses for why nothing reflects intelligence especially when one specific racial group seemingly excels in all the metrics that were used to gauge intelligence in the past. If this trend continues, scoring high on exams would be even considered stupid and useless a few decades from now unless it's your racial group or kids scoring high.
And the reason you did well in your SAT was because you were already a good student. The prep classes work best for those just looking to fill in the gaps in their knowledge and give you the best methods at tackling the problems. It doesn't work well for those still struggling with basic concepts.
I said "don't dumb down a test" but rather have a more rigorous curriculum so that the kids have better chances at passing the test. There are too many failing schools out there in addition to lack of parental involvement. It would be insulting to me, personally, to dumb down anything.
Also, I also don't give excuses. I said that standardized tests such as the SAT and tests like it (i.e. the specialized high school test, which is basically a carbon copy of the PSAT) don't reflect intelligence at all. It's about knowing how to take a that particular type of test. You are right, though...someone who can't grasp basic concepts definitely won't be helped by test-taking prep courses. My stance on standardized tests has nothing to do with race at all and it doesn't matter to me that some other racial group is scoring higher than me. At the end of the day, I got where I needed to go and got into the schools I wanted to get into.
Also, the people making excuses for any shortcomings aren't the AA/Hispanic test takers who came up short but rather others such as government officials who have other designs. Many kids who "come up short" end up going to other schools. For some, that works out better for them being big fish in smaller ponds. When it comes to college admissions, there are so many factors that come into play that I wouldn't be crestfallen if I didn't get into Stuy.
Let's also keep this in mind: as was said earlier upthread, the kids who are into bling and have crappy parenting aren't taking the specialized high school exams in the first place. In my former high school, they didn't even take Regents Exams but RCTs aka Regents Lite. The kids who tend to take these exams probably are smart but either need a better curriculum, prep better, whatever. I wasn't interested in science or math so I didn't even bother with those schools.
I said "don't dumb down a test" but rather have a more rigorous curriculum so that the kids have better chances at passing the test. There are too many failing schools out there in addition to lack of parental involvement. It would be insulting to me, personally, to dumb down anything.
Also, I also don't give excuses. I said that standardized tests such as the SAT and tests like it (i.e. the specialized high school test, which is basically a carbon copy of the PSAT) don't reflect intelligence at all. It's about knowing how to take a that particular type of test. You are right, though...someone who can't grasp basic concepts definitely won't be helped by test-taking prep courses. My stance on standardized tests has nothing to do with race at all and it doesn't matter to me that some other racial group is scoring higher than me. At the end of the day, I got where I needed to go and got into the schools I wanted to get into.
Also, the people making excuses for any shortcomings aren't the AA/Hispanic test takers who came up short but rather others such as government officials who have other designs. Many kids who "come up short" end up going to other schools. For some, that works out better for them being big fish in smaller ponds. When it comes to college admissions, there are so many factors that come into play that I wouldn't be crestfallen if I didn't get into Stuy.
Let's also keep this in mind: as was said earlier upthread, the kids who are into bling and have crappy parenting aren't taking the specialized high school exams in the first place. In my former high school, they didn't even take Regents Exams but RCTs aka Regents Lite. The kids who tend to take these exams probably are smart but either need a better curriculum, prep better, whatever. I wasn't interested in science or math so I didn't even bother with those schools.
Sorry I missed the don't part because you quoted the "dumb" and that caught my eye. I guess if that was a SAT question I would have gotten it wrong.
I mentioned one way to make people feel better is to increase the number of these school and spread them out in different neighborhoods. Also do a study to make sure that the materials on the exam reflect what's taught in class. The school system in my opinion then has a responsibility to fill in any knowledge gaps by either providing a kaplan type of book (even though everyone can get them online nowadays*), or provide a special prep class during school. That way people who aren't culturally aware of these materials at least have a choice to decide whether they want to pursue it or not.
I totally agree that these schools are definitely not the end all be all. But when politicians infer policy statements favoring one race over another that is not right. They're picking on the group with the least political clout.
Last edited by bumblebyz; 03-13-2014 at 02:18 PM..
What are the extraordinary differences encountered by blacks and hispanics, that aren't encountered by Asians? Poverty, crime, drugs, etc? Please I have been exposed in it all literally but ultimately made the effort to get out of it. You think the 3rd world is sweet? Please, visit and see what poverty, crime and injustice is al about. It will make any ghetto in America look like an upscale community.
I was an exchange student in Paraguay and it did not make a ghetto in the US look like an upscale country. I've been to Brazil and that too did not make a ghetto in the US look like an upscale country.
I'm not sure why you seem to think that Blacks and Hispanics in NYC aren't familiar with "third world" conditions when many of us come from the "Third World" or are just first or second generation Americans.
Come on guys...you cant blame the Asians or prep schools. The kids not getting in need to blame themselves first and foremost. I and other Asians who came from 1st and 2nd generation homes, truly suffered when it came to poverty. My folks came to this country with $7.00 dollars in their pockets in the mid-70's. I went to BK tech after half ass studying from a prep book I picked up from the library. Our living conditions were miserable. We did not live in the projects nor did we sign up for welfare but that was due to safety and pride. So, my folks bust their chops and we all made due with what we had. Not just me, but many other friends who I met at school. None of the Indian kids used any prep courses at the time though I heard it was big in the Korean/Chinese community..but it was open to all for a price. I didn't know about it until afterwards and I doubt I would go even if I had the money, due to the distance from the Bronx.
If anyone wants to use such services...just google it. Hell, there is a franchise called Kumon learning centers.
I don't see anyone complaining about sport scholarships? A lot of kids had parents who could afford the extra training and memberships to leagues and clubs, while I couldn't. I never went to day camp or summer camp. I never had enough money to participate in sports leagues except one season due to my neighbor. I lost a tremendous advantage, but I sucked it up. So *** you all, who think we drop the standards once again to accomadate inferior students. I used inferior because it's you folks who make your kids inferior by lowering the bar so low, so that everyone looks at them as rejects from day one due to all the advantages.
What are the extraordinary differences encountered by blacks and hispanics, that aren't encountered by Asians? Poverty, crime, drugs, etc? Please I have been exposed in it all literally but ultimately made the effort to get out of it. You think the 3rd world is sweet? Please, visit and see what poverty, crime and injustice is al about. It will make any ghetto in America look like an upscale community.
At the end of the day, be happy for your achievements, whatever they are. For those that don't do those things for whatever reason, be happy for them as well. I'm a firm believer in free choice, including the choice to stay poor or not study if that's what you want to be. Or to work as a bartender, truck driver, shipping person, etc. For those who want professional careers and who have interest in academics, they should study. But that's not everyone. It takes all types of people to make the world work.
I'm a firm believer in free choice, including the choice to stay poor or not study if that's what you want to be. Or to work as a bartender, truck driver, shipping person, etc. For those who want professional careers and who have interest in academics, they should study. But that's not everyone. It takes all types of people to make the world work.
Why is why politicians and "advocates" should not interfere with the admissions process of the SHS. It works fine as it is.
Actually, now that I think about it, Citigroup had an Indian American lawyer for CEO. People should really knock off racial stereotypes.
Actually his trade was engineering. The lawyer was the guy before him. So that kind of puts to rest the ridiculous statement that someone (not you) made about mathematicians staying in the back office. Look who are running the most successful hedge funds. People from quantitative backgrounds, not the social butterflies. As for why an Asian CEO of Indian decent rather than say Chinese? I'd say it has something to do with the British educational system in India.
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