The much-despised "ma'am" word (husband, person, adults, senior)

[Ultrarunner]

Originally Posted by Shysister

Yes I agree which is why I'm apprehensive about raising kids in Texas in the first place because I know they will have to do what it takes to "fit in" sort of speak and I don't like the idea of that at all. However there will be adjustments through out their lives that they will have to adhere too such as the work place in the future. So I guess it could be an early life lesson, that's a positive way to view it.

Where would you like to raise your children if given the option?

I think this is very important because some of my friends became military families and often would end up in places very foreign... some made the best of it and for others it was several years of torture counting down the days...

[KathrynAragon]

Originally Posted by Mattie

Maciesmom is a long-time and well respected poster, who happens to not agree with you. She sure doesn't deserve the snark.

Oh, come on. If maciesmom wants to respond, she's free to. I think she can handle it, and I know (as a long time and well respected poster myself ) that I can too. She doesn't need for you to run interference, m'am.

Happy New Year!

[KathrynAragon]

Originally Posted by Mattie

I've lived in GA a bit longer than you, and in some instances, it's common AND expected. My kids were in 8th and 9th grade when we moved here, and learned very quickly that in a school setting, ma'am as well as sir is not just seen as being pleasant, but customary, and yes, expected. Coming from out-of-state, the terms were not in their everyday vocabulary, but a few extra laps around the track to remind them took care of that, courtesy of coaches who insisted upon hearing it. Maybe if they never played sports it wouldn't have become habitual, but they did, and those coaches were very persuasive. Consequently, it became a habit both in and out of school, and even sometimes at home.

And let's talk about this for a bit.

I moved to Georgia when I was 13. I spent time in both private Christian schools and public schools there, in the 1970s, as well as college in the 1980s (and the public school system was very rural, just for the record). Not one time in my life was I ever corrected or prompted to say "sir or m'am" to a teacher. I was sort of random about it - sometimes said it and sometimes didn't but it wasn't required at home or at school. I was certainly never punished by a school official for not saying it, but I wasn't in sports so maybe that's the difference. I've found that some coaches run things in a sort of military way, and "sir" and "m'am" ARE customary in the military.

These terms are often customary and expected from kids - I've never denied that. I was addressing the ADULT poster who is super sensitive about anything that smacks to her/him of slavery, and who thinks that it's common for Texas women to give the stink eye when they're not addressed as "m'am." Now - I don't doubt that some crazy woman somewhere might do that, but believe me, it's not a general rule for either women in Texas or women in Georgia to give other adults the stink eye if they're not called "m'am." If some woman in either locale seemed to expect me to call her m'am, I'd figure she was about half crazy. And I'm pretty sure most other adults in either state would agree with me. Though it would be great fun to laugh about over some mimosas at brunch.

Though in either state, it's generally considered quite respectful for adults to address other adults in that manner, it's generally neither expected nor required. Unless of course, one is hosting the Queen of England. In that case, it may be required - I'll have to ring up Emily Post to be sure on that one.

[maciesmom]

Originally Posted by KathrynAragon

Oh, come on. If maciesmom wants to respond, she's free to. I think she can handle it, and I know (as a long time and well respected poster myself ) that I can too. She doesn't need for you to run interference, m'am.

Happy New Year!

No one is "running interference" for me. In fact, I had decided let your little tantrum stand on it's own merit because while I could have responded, it would be considered off topic bickering. And I chose not to veer from the topic at hand. It is interesting that I was able to disagree with you without calling you "oversensitive" or mistaken. I simply disagreed and pointed out why. I guess manners are a bit loosely interpreted - no matter how many season's greetings or "bless your hearts" you tack on (with or without deleting later).

Interestingly, I grew up in a military family. In a VERY military town. And you know what? No one used ma'am and sir to their parents or other adults. Many of those military adults in fact preferred not to hear ma'am or sir outside of the work environment. That is my experience.

[Georgianbelle]

Such a lot of venom about a word. In school in South Georgia where I went I was required to answer teachers with sir or mam. It did not bother me because it was what I was used to. I never knew it was so offensive to so many people. Also, there is no reason to get in a contest about who is the most respected poster. Hopefully, we are all respected even when our opinions are different.

[DewDropInn]

Originally Posted by KathrynAragon

Unless of course, one is hosting the Queen of England. In that case, it may be required - I'll have to ring up Emily Post to be sure on that one.

No need. Upon being introduced to the Queen protocol requires that she be addressed as "Your Majesty". Should there be any more chit-chat.... "Ma'am" is acceptable.

This tidbit brought to you by a native Californian who can count on one hand the number of times she's addressed someone as "Ma'am". We don't have a bug up our butts about those things.

[Mattie]

Originally Posted by KathrynAragon

Oh, come on. If maciesmom wants to respond, she's free to. I think she can handle it, and I know (as a long time and well respected poster myself ) that I can too. She doesn't need for you to run interference, m'am.

Happy New Year!

Not running interference at all, Maciesmom doesn't need my help. I'm just puzzled why you feel the need to resort to surreptitious insults to get your point across, which you did again at the end of the post I just quoted.

[cremebrulee]

Originally Posted by KathrynAragon

What???

Unless you were calling them something disrespectful instead of "M'am," I think you were imagining this.

I never notice when someone doesn't call me M'am - but I notice (positively) when they do. I have lived in east Texas for nearly 30 years and I have honestly never once heard a woman of any age or race say anything akin to "He should have called me M'am."

I find that when something like this bothers someone, it is due to them not being able to view another person's culture. They do not have the ability to realize, just because they think it's wrong, everyone else should? It's a shame that something as small as this would be insulting to some....it is a very small thing which is nothing more then a sign of respect in some cultures....

Unbelievable......

[KathrynAragon]

Originally Posted by cremebrulee

I find that when something like this bothers someone, it is due to them not being able to view another person's culture. They do not have the ability to realize, just because they think it's wrong, everyone else should? It's a shame that something as small as this would be insulting to some....it is a very small thing which is nothing more then a sign of respect in some cultures....

Unbelievable......

LOL I agree. The whole thing seems blown completely out of proportion!

[gentlearts]

I think its about,"When is Rome...." I was a well brought up Yankee girl, and saying sir or ma'am was not a requirement. We did have to be respectful to adults in other ways, like standing up and shaking hands, etc. We always addressed adults as Aunt This or Mr. and Mrs. That, never first names.

Here in the south, I notice I tend to be addressed as Mizz Susan, rather than Mrs. Gentlearts. My grandsons who were raised both military and southern are always sir and ma'am ing adults.

One thing that jerks my chain is that my husband has picked up the habit of saying sir and ma'am at his job at a DIY store. To me it sounds overly obsequious and I don't like it. A 65 year old man should not be calling other adults that, unless it is a much older woman. Everyone does it though, so he just picked up the habit.