If 'urban pioneers' succeed in DC, would half of NOVA pour in? (Arlington: middle-class, crimes)

[Stephen 81]

Am I the only one who thinks that the term pioneers is inaccurate, at best? Pioneers are people exploring uncharted territory, and it seems strange to call Shaw or Ledroit Park uncharted just because those neighborhoods didn't have a lot of white people there twenty years ago. Put differently, would people here find it strange if the first Latinos who moved to Herndon were called intrepid pioneers pushing the frontier north?

Regardless of the noun used to describe professionals moving into previously run-down areas, I can't imagine NoVA emptying out as people head into the District. Arlington and Alexandria have been booming concurrently with the District (their population growth rates are higher than Fairfax, Montgomery, or Prince Georges), and I don't see any Loudoun County residents trading in their 4 bd, 3.5 ba houses for a rowhouse in Shaw.

[South Jersey Styx]

Originally Posted by Tiger Beer

If 'urban pioneers' succeed in DC, would half of NOVA pour in?

I doubt it. Maybe the younger crowd w/o little kids and families who are stepping up in their careers. But no, for reasons previously stated. Also, even as one gets older the DC scene can get old--after awhile, a little bit of peace and quiet is a luxury and more space one's $$ becomes a big factor.

[South Jersey Styx]

Originally Posted by Stephen 81

Am I the only one who thinks that the term pioneers is inaccurate, at best? Pioneers are people exploring uncharted territory, and it seems strange to call Shaw or Ledroit Park uncharted just because those neighborhoods didn't have a lot of white people there twenty years ago. Put differently, would people here find it strange if the first Latinos who moved to Herndon were called intrepid pioneers pushing the frontier north?

Good point. I don't understand how "pioneers" was being used here either. These supposed uncharted areas have been inhabited by many families who have lived there for generations.

[Yankeesfan]

Not after Tuesday's primary results. If Michelle Rhee leaves there is no hope left for the DC schools.

[stpickrell]

Originally Posted by South Jersey Styx

What neighborhoods? You're talking about a huge expanse of an area -- points on the west side of the city to the Southeast -- lots of different areas in-between including the GWU neighborhood, federal HQs/bldgs, etc.

OK, just for starters -- Shepherd Park, Brightwood, and Takoma. I saw some SFH's for 400-600k with decent for DC sized lots. If I were moving to the area with a young family, and had not been poisoned by living in South Arlington for six years, I'd definitely consider those places -- I haven't heard of them being crime legends.

[normie]

Originally Posted by Stephen 81

Am I the only one who thinks that the term pioneers is inaccurate, at best? .

I totally agree.

Originally Posted by Stephen 81

I don't see any Loudoun County residents trading in their 4 bd, 3.5 ba houses for a rowhouse in Shaw.

LOL, you've got that right. Even for those who find DC homes appealing, a daily commute from DC to Reston or even Tysons would be horrid. Remember, most people out here work in the tech corridor.

[brooklynborndad]

just for starters the original "pioneers" in the USA werent moving into completely empty territory either.


Secondly its not necessarily about race. In baltimore I thought of people buying and renovating rowhouses in canton or fells point as pioneers, even though the former inhabitants were poles, ukrainians, etc. You could say its about ethnicity or social class. But at bottom its about real estate prices and renovation of the housing stock. In many parts of urban america thats accompanied by racial change, charged issues relating to crime etc, but to me its still about someone with a hammer, or a paint bucket. In fact I think the term pioneer is stretched most when its used for those affluent people who come in and buy the houses in an already renovated area and do NOT physically change them.

and thirdly, yes, in some contexts I could see a group of hispanics moving into a new area, as pioneers. Certainly there is a dynamic with ethnic minorities of needing supports from their own group, which makes it hard for the first settlers, and easier for the followers -exactly the dynamic the word pioneer is meant to represent.

[brooklynborndad]

Originally Posted by Yankeesfan

Not after Tuesday's primary results. If Michelle Rhee leaves there is no hope left for the DC schools.

there being no hope for the NYC schools or Chicago schools or Philly schools, since she isnt there. She is indispensable, the only person on the earth who can save an urban school system.

[ChristineVA]

Originally Posted by South Jersey Styx

I doubt it. Maybe the younger crowd w/o little kids and families who are stepping up in their careers. But no, for reasons previously stated. Also, even as one gets older the DC scene can get old--after awhile, a little bit of peace and quiet is a luxury and more space one's $$ becomes a big factor.

Because I'm old the people *I* have known to move back into DC have been in their 40s or older. Most of them have done it because their kids are out of the public school systems, they are downsizing, and some of these revitalized neighborhoods are cheaper than going into Old Town Alexandria or other similar type areas that appeal to that age group. Most have bought older rowhomes that needed some work (but still a very good price) or some of the newer condos and townhomes near the ballpark/Navy Yard. They really are a pretty good deal and put you VERY close to work if you work in DC. These areas also aren't a haven for the 20-somethings so they don't feel out of place.

[ACWhite]

Originally Posted by stpickrell

The area west of Rock Creek Park is very wealthy and very safe.

Everyone agrees east of the Anacostia is pretty crime-ridden still.

Isn't the area between Rock Creek Park and the Anacostia about as safe as say Seven Corners in VA?

Take a look at this crime map of one of the deluxe zipcodes (20016), showing crimes in the past 14 days alone. The area west of RCP is not free of crime by any stretch, though your feeling of "safe" probably depends whether you were one who was hit. But look at the area to the east -- Dupont, Adams Morgan, etc., all considered desirable. The number of reported crime incidents is so dense there you can barely sort them out. And I know people who live in 20016 who say they wouldn't even bother to report minor crimes, so consider how many incidents aren't on the map.

http://www.crimereports.com/map?search=20016

I found it shocking. I thought more progress had been made at least in the wealthier areas.

Most are obviously property crimes in this privileged part of the city, but if you have ever been victimized by a burglary while you are at home (I have, in another city, multiple times), you know that the crime can escalate.