Need more info on Hayfield Secondary School in Alexandria (Fairfax: how much, homes)

[JD984]

I did a spot check on some of the data that was the basis for the Schooldigger rankings - performance on Algebra I and English "Standard of Learning" tests. I didn't look at Hayfield, but data that I looked at for some other schools was simply wrong. In short, I would give no weight whatsoever to a "Schooldigger" ranking. The quality controls seems to be non-existent.

There is no doubt, however, that Hayfield's test scores are at the lower end of Fairfax County test scores - which tend to be substantially above both state and national averages. This doesn't mean a student can't receive a good education at Hayfield (and, with apologies to the NRA, schools don't take SATs and SOLs; students do). I would hate for someone to double their commute and end up in a neighborhood they liked far less simply because a crude and inaccurate number-crunching program didn't give a high school three or more stars.

[springfieldva]

The investor craze of buying houses and quickly flipping them has pretty much come to a halt (yay!). People are now buying *homes* to live in.

I'll bet a lot of the school scores will start going up. Pick a neighborhood you like and don't worry - Fairfax county schools are fantastic.

[barryhussein]

In the 80's it was worse than Lee or Edison. Probably better that West Potomac (formerly Groveton).
It's not horrible, but there is a bit of a gang problem. I am a friend of the Asian Community; and I will tell you there are problems with Asian Gangs at that school. West Springfield would be a better choice, and just a tiny bit further. It is good to see the optimism from the above posters. We always here the same optimism about Stonewall HS in PWC. They have this program, and that award, etc..., But if you take a drive by there at 1 o'clock in the afternoon it will be a big dose of reality. How many kids are getting a free lunch to go along with their I-phones?

Good Luck with your move.

[Skapov]

Believe it or not, but the rankings on schooldigger.com ARE pretty accurate actually. For example, Thomas Jefferson HS does get 5 stars for being in the top percentile, and the schools in Burke/West Springfield do get 4 or 5 stars and we all know that those schools are good. BTW, T C Williams HS has demographics that are 25% Hispanic and 42% AA, and 30% of the kids there qualify for free-reduced lunch, so why would anyone doublt that the school wouln't rank high?! Now I'm not saying YOUR particular kid can't get a good education, but if the school has high proportions of ESL students and high poverty people, then the school frankly isn't gonna have high-performance.

BTW, Washington Post just did a story about the high teenage pregnancy rate at T C Williams, the school even has a DAYCARE on premises! And so for all y'all folks who think every school in NOVA is great, take note that many perform no better than those in Prince Georges' County MD, where I currently live. Check this out: washingtonpost.com


[SIZE=5]They're Having Babies. Are We Helping?
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[SIZE=-1]By Patrick Welsh
Sunday, December 14, 2008; B01[/SIZE]
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[/SIZE]
The girls gather in small groups outside Alexandria's T.C. Williams High School most mornings, standing with their babies on their hips, talking and giggling like sorority sisters. Sometimes their mothers drop the kids (and their kids) off with a carefree smile and a wave. As I watch the girls carry their children into the Tiny Titans day-care center in our new $100 million building, I can't help wondering what Sister Mary Avelina, my 11th-grade English teacher, would have thought........

[JD984]

At the risk of running off-topic, I will reiterate that many - though admittedly not all - of the rankings on the Schooldigger site are based on faulty data that doesn't match official FCPS data.

Hayfield's test scores on standardized tests such as SATs are slightly below national averages, and TC Williams' test scores are slightly below Hayfield's. On the other hand, TC Williams' scores are above six high schools in Montgomery County, Maryland, and the average SAT score in Prince George's County (1283) is well below any high school in Northern Virginia - including both Hayfield and TC Williams.

So the suggestion that Hayfield = TC Williams = any school with "high proportions" of ESL students = PG high schools just doesn't survive scrutiny. In general, and while there is much room for improvement, Fairfax does a better job of serving its ESL/FRL population than other neighboring jurisdictions.

[Skapov]

First up, you cannot compare schools between different states obviously, and having myself lived in several states (TX, AR, IL, VA, MD) I can vouch that overall, your child will receive a better education in VA than in the vast majority of states. Even the worst schools of VA are probably about equal to the best schools in the Bible Belt South.

As far as Montgomery County, with the exception of Bethesda/Chevy Chase and Rockville, their schools aren't all that great, and the schools in Silver Spring are even ranked lower than the schools in certain communities of PG County, so we're not talking about Montgomery here. Everything is relative, and when you benchmark a school you can't compare apples to oranges, so that's why you only can compare schools within the state or even within the district.

Comparable to the benchmark, Hayfield HS is ranked in the bottom 10-30%, and T C Williams is in the bottom 10% among FCPS.

As far as SAT SCORES go, black/hispanic students in Fairfax County score on average about 250 pts below white students, it's on FCPS website broken down if you want to dig. Therefore, we know that the quality of the school does not correlate with SAT usually, and SAT has a wellknown racial bias. Btw, PG County has Eleanor Rosevelt HS and Bowie HS, and their SAT scores are above the national average, but that's because those 2 schools have a higher than average amt of white/asian students.

Anyway my point is that if you're paying Fairfax prices, you should be aware that not all schools are created equal there, and you don't always get what you pay for!

[JD984]

There are many ways to compare the performance of schools in different states, including (but not limited to) performance on SATs, student participation in AP and IB programs, and performance on AP and IB exams. US News and World Report did so earlier this month, when it published its rankings of the nation's top high schools. There were 11 Fairfax high schools included in that list. Hayfield was not among them (nor, for that matter, was Bowie, Elenor Roosevelt or any other PG high school), but the inclusion of so many Fairfax schools on the list does reflect favorably on the county schools as a whole, and a number of other posters on this thread have spoken positively of their own experiences with Hayfield.

As a result, I just don't buy the argument that Hayfield can only be assessed against other Fairfax County schools and, on that basis, fails to measure up to a prospective home buyer's expectations. But, by all means, the OP should do his or her own due diligence before making a final decision.

By the way, TC Williams is not a Fairfax County school. It is the City of Alexandria's high school - not part of the Fairfax system at all.

[barryhussein]

They used to have to play the TC Williams v. W. Springfield Basketball games behind closed doors. Guess which schools students were starting the trouble?

[The Dissenter]

Originally Posted by JEB77

There are many ways to compare the performance of schools in different states, including (but not limited to) performance on SATs, student participation in AP and IB programs, and performance on AP and IB exams. US News and World Report did so earlier this month, when it published its rankings of the nation's top high schools. There were 11 Fairfax high schools included in that list. Hayfield was not among them (nor, for that matter, was Bowie, Elenor Roosevelt or any other PG high school), but the inclusion of so many Fairfax schools on the list does reflect favorably on the county schools as a whole, and a number of other posters on this thread have spoken positively of their own experiences with Hayfield.

As a result, I just don't buy the argument that Hayfield can only be assessed against other Fairfax County schools and, on that basis, fails to measure up to a prospective home buyer's expectations. But, by all means, the OP should do his or her own due diligence before making a final decision.

By the way, TC Williams is not a Fairfax County school. It is the City of Alexandria's high school - not part of the Fairfax system at all.

I agree completely.

Bottom line, for a motivated child nearly any high school in Northern Virginia will give them a quality education. Be it TC Williams, Hayfield, or Thomas Jefferson.

[slduvall]

Going back to the OP's question, and another posters comments about schools here vs elsewhere. I agree that anywhere below the bible belt is pretty bad. I too have lived in multiple states. The south was the worst, and of course there are exceptions, but seeing that the OP looked to be military, like me, the schools around the military bases can be awful! Many look to private school based on their zip code. We bought our last house based on zip code, as the other options were scary.

So back to his question, Hayfield will be better than some schools your kids have gone too, the areas that feed into are pretty nice, safe etc.